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#51 Post by R A Rowe » May 11th, 2013, 6:22 pm

Sounds great nonetheless.
ITB

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#52 Post by Ken Rudman » May 23rd, 2013, 8:49 pm

Had a big batch of starter in the fridge so I decided to make a few different sourdoughs today:

Fig-Anise-Walnut
Seigle (50% Rye) batards
White sourdough boules

Starting to get some good results with the "ears" on my slashes. I call the one in the back left "Sideshow Bob"...

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Big batch of sourdough by Ruddy, on Flickr

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#53 Post by Kenny H » May 30th, 2013, 8:35 pm

How did I miss those sourdoughs? Incredible! Ken, uh, you ship?

We just did "wonder bread" from the bread bible. It is suppose to be what Wonder Bread was suppose to be I guess. Anyway, it tastes like a giant dinner roll! 24 hour ferment, 12 hour rise, second rise, blah my wife handles it.

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And Z crumb

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#54 Post by Ken Rudman » May 30th, 2013, 9:07 pm

Beautiful crumb, Kenny. Just trying to figure out what I'm going to get started for tomorrow.

I think we need to organize a SoCal bike ride/wine tasting and I'll bring the bread.

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#55 Post by CWun » June 15th, 2013, 6:09 pm

Ok this was my first attempt at making the Cooks Illustrated version of "no knead" bread. 8-12 hrs first rise/autolyse, 15 seconds of kneading (barely any), another 2 hours for second rise. Then baked in dutch oven. The secret ingredients CI adds are a little vinegar and beer (light lager) to duplicate a poolish or starter complexities.

I'm still not good at scoring.

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#56 Post by Ken Rudman » June 15th, 2013, 9:17 pm

Nice looking crumb.

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#57 Post by Kenny H » June 17th, 2013, 9:38 am

oh that looks delish.
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#58 Post by Ken Rudman » June 17th, 2013, 4:56 pm

We're up in the Petaluma area so we stopped by Keith Giusto's baking supply aka Central Milling Flour. Just loaded the car with 70# of flour--bread, high gluten, French-style type 55 and 85 (baguette and miche) and 00-style for pizza. It's going to be a fun couple of weeks...

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#59 Post by Kenny H » June 20th, 2013, 8:50 pm

Ken Rudman wrote:We're up in the Petaluma area so we stopped by Keith Giusto's baking supply aka Central Milling Flour. Just loaded the car with 70# of flour--bread, high gluten, French-style type 55 and 85 (baguette and miche) and 00-style for pizza. It's going to be a fun couple of weeks...
Man on a mission! I don't know about everyone else, but the more gluten the better if you ask me.

So this is the latest, 10 grain bread from the Bread Bible. It's outstanding. Ken, you have any tips on how to cut the slices better? Suzy is not very good, as it would appear from all the fancy pics here. I haz very sharp knife.

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#60 Post by Ken Rudman » June 20th, 2013, 9:11 pm

It's harder to slash with a knife because the blade will often tug at the dough. You can buy a lamé which is a razor blade in a fancy holder or you can make your own with a double-edge razor blade and a coffee stirrer or wooden skewer. Then, with a razor, you want to slash with a quick stroke using just the leading edge of the blade, and at a shallow angle to the surface. Also, make sure to slash right before you put the loaf in the oven.

Also, for a long loaf like this, try slashing diagonally across the loaf--maybe four slashes from end to end. The bread will rise up and pull the slash open more dramatically.

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#61 Post by Kenny H » June 21st, 2013, 9:26 am

sweet, good tips.
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#62 Post by CWun » June 21st, 2013, 9:46 am

Ken Rudman wrote:.....a double-edge razor blade and a coffee stirrer or wooden skewer. Then, with a razor, you want to slash with a quick stroke using just the leading edge of the blade, and at a shallow angle to the surface. Also, make sure to slash right before you put the loaf in the oven.
.....
+1

I finally did this with a the abundance of Derbys/blue birds shaving bladesI have. I looked in a kitchen drawer and found reusable coffee stirrers (the thin popsicle stick looking ones, or the triangle cross-section ones) and thread it through the middle to get the curve. It does cut much better than any knife.
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#63 Post by Mel Hill » June 21st, 2013, 10:15 am

Focaccia ready to rise before baking. left is onion and sage, right is rosemary and olive.
Focaccia_9491.jpg
Focaccia_9491.jpg (40.17 KiB) Viewed 1680 times
and the cooked version
Focaccia_9495.jpg
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#64 Post by Ken Rudman » June 21st, 2013, 3:33 pm

CWun wrote:
Ken Rudman wrote:.....a double-edge razor blade and a coffee stirrer or wooden skewer. Then, with a razor, you want to slash with a quick stroke using just the leading edge of the blade, and at a shallow angle to the surface. Also, make sure to slash right before you put the loaf in the oven.
.....
+1

I finally did this with a the abundance of Derbys/blue birds shaving bladesI have. I looked in a kitchen drawer and found reusable coffee stirrers (the thin popsicle stick looking ones, or the triangle cross-section ones) and thread it through the middle to get the curve. It does cut much better than any knife.
Yep. I took two bamboo kebab skewers, taped them together and used that with a Feather DE. For the more aristocratic slash. [snort.gif]

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#65 Post by Ken Rudman » June 21st, 2013, 3:37 pm

Mel Hill wrote:Focaccia ready to rise before baking. left is onion and sage, right is rosemary and olive.
Focaccia_9491.jpg
and the cooked version
Focaccia_9495.jpg
Awesome, Mel. Am currently proofing up some basic sourdough using the Central Milling bread flour I just picked up in Petaluma. I'm going to start experimenting with the Tartine method (very wet dough, young starter, baked in a cast iron combo cooker) and also see about dialing in flour mixtures I like. I have some of the Central Milling Type 70 and type 85 and I want to see what that does for baguette and miche. Pricey, and not super-convenient to buy, but at least so far, I will say that the bread flour is pretty amazing--quick hydration, easy handling, very big rise. The crust and crumb will tell the tale, though.

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#66 Post by Mel Hill » June 22nd, 2013, 8:50 am

the focaccia was made with KA bread flour and a bit of rye flour from Red Mill

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#67 Post by Ken Rudman » July 3rd, 2013, 7:29 am

Have now made the Tartine Bread recipe twice. Love the flavor and the crust--baking in the cast iron combo cooker is really easy. But handling and shaping the very wet dough is a real challenge.

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Tartine bread take 2 by Ruddy, on Flickr

Second loaf was baked much darker to see the difference and both crumb and crust are far superior.

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#68 Post by Brian Tuite » July 3rd, 2013, 7:36 am

Zucchini Bread
[resizeableimage=800,600]http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae19 ... baee8d.jpg[/resizeableimage]
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#69 Post by Kenny H » July 3rd, 2013, 11:59 am

Zucchini bread is way underrated. Love it with some walnut.
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#70 Post by Brian Tuite » July 3rd, 2013, 12:07 pm

Walnuts are in there!
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#71 Post by Ken Rudman » August 18th, 2013, 10:44 am

My first bake in about a month, due to job and such.

Baked these baguettes (ficelles, really) in my outdoor pellet grill (Traeger) to keep it cool inside. Am going to bake a couple of loaves of Tartine-style sourdough later, too. I used the Central Milling Type 70 flour, which is their version of a French baguette flour (lower protein, a bit more of the wheat germ), so we will see how they taste.

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Outdoor baked baguettes by Ruddy, on Flickr

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#72 Post by CWun » August 18th, 2013, 1:15 pm

Looks like you need practice on scoring, just like me. Inside crumb pr0n shot?
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#73 Post by Ken Rudman » August 18th, 2013, 3:26 pm

Yeah, it was very hard to score these loaves for some reason, maybe my razor was getting dull.

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#74 Post by Kenny H » August 18th, 2013, 10:49 pm

Ken Rudman wrote:My first bake in about a month, due to job and such.

Baked these baguettes (ficelles, really) in my outdoor pellet grill (Traeger) to keep it cool inside. Am going to bake a couple of loaves of Tartine-style sourdough later, too. I used the Central Milling Type 70 flour, which is their version of a French baguette flour (lower protein, a bit more of the wheat germ), so we will see how they taste.

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Outdoor baked baguettes by Ruddy, on Flickr
Does the flour help the richness in flavor?
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#75 Post by Ken Rudman » August 19th, 2013, 6:59 am

Kenny H wrote:
Ken Rudman wrote:My first bake in about a month, due to job and such.

Baked these baguettes (ficelles, really) in my outdoor pellet grill (Traeger) to keep it cool inside. Am going to bake a couple of loaves of Tartine-style sourdough later, too. I used the Central Milling Type 70 flour, which is their version of a French baguette flour (lower protein, a bit more of the wheat germ), so we will see how they taste.

Image
Outdoor baked baguettes by Ruddy, on Flickr
Does the flour help the richness in flavor?
There is definitely more flavor, some from the wheatiness of the flour, but mainly from the use of a pate fermante (basically, dough that you make the day before that has time to get all those good flavorful enzymes going). The lower protein is a factor in the texture, since lower protein = less gluten, meaning that the structure of the bread is a little finer and softer inside, while the crust gets nice and crunchy. You can mimic this somewhat by baking with a blend of bread flour and AP flour, and add a bit of whole wheat flour for the flavor.

This mill (up in Petaluma) also has a Type 65 clone, which has even more of the wheat germ and mimics the stuff used in miche, pain de campagne and other rustic breads in France--it is awesome stuff.

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#76 Post by Ken Rudman » August 19th, 2013, 7:03 am

I also baked a sourdough, adapted slightly from the Tartine recipe by adding just a bit of yeast to get the proofing stage done in a couple of hours (can otherwise take 6-8 hours). No noticeable degrading of flavor from this. Baked outside in a cast iron cooker in the pellet grill, which doesn't get quite as hot as my oven (about 430 degrees seems to be top), so a little paler than I like, but the house stayed cool.

Image
Sourdough by Ruddy, on Flickr

And, the crumb, which was really pretty good.

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Untitled by Ruddy, on Flickr

Just baked a second loaf of this, which I retarded overnight in the fridge and baked in the oven. Will taste test later.

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#77 Post by Kenny H » August 19th, 2013, 4:28 pm

outrageous.

and yes my favorite rolls suzy makes use a day long ferment. so rich and delish.
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#78 Post by Ken Rudman » August 19th, 2013, 5:33 pm

Kenny H wrote:outrageous.
And totally compatible with a good bike racing diet. [snort.gif]

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#79 Post by M Hudson » August 23rd, 2013, 6:21 am

ok you guys are killing me, I want to try some of these on my pellet grill

where are you getting the recipes...I know nothing about making bread
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#80 Post by Ken Rudman » August 23rd, 2013, 6:44 am

Mark, I started with kind of the bible for home bread baking these days, which is
The Bread Baker's Apprentice. Great book, very well written. As for baking in the Traeger, I'm just kinda making it up--heat on high with the baking stone in there for about an hour until it gets as hot as it can, then go.

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#81 Post by M Hudson » August 26th, 2013, 12:55 pm

Ken I had no idea you had a traeger...

I will find that book, thanks.
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#82 Post by N. Justl » October 14th, 2013, 9:56 am

I also want to attempt at baking my own bread. Have zero experience, but The Bread Baker's Apprentice book mentioned above looks like a great start. While browsing Amazon, I also came across Flour Water Salt Yeast. Just curious as to which book (or possibly another) would be best for someone just starting.

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#83 Post by MBerto » October 14th, 2013, 2:26 pm

N. Justl wrote:I also want to attempt at baking my own bread. Have zero experience, but The Bread Baker's Apprentice book mentioned above looks like a great start. While browsing Amazon, I also came across Flour Water Salt Yeast. Just curious as to which book (or possibly another) would be best for someone just starting.

Thanks!
I really like FWSL, although as I've read more I've come to realize most of these recipes are just slight variations on the same theme, so it's tough to go too wrong. FWSL does have a lot of information on the technique behind the recipe, so you'll understand exactly how to mix and fold the dough as he suggests.
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#84 Post by Ken Rudman » October 14th, 2013, 2:32 pm

Made a couple of Levain de Campagne-style loaves using some whole wheat flour my wife brought back from this place:

http://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/anglese ... do/page-3/
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#85 Post by SeanHarding » October 14th, 2013, 8:11 pm

This one turned out kind of ugly, so maybe not the best first post for me to make in this thread, but it tasted great. You'll just have to take my word for it.

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#86 Post by Ken Rudman » October 14th, 2013, 8:20 pm

Nice dark crust, Sean. And some of my best-tasting loaves are less-than-beautiful.

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#87 Post by Kenny H » October 14th, 2013, 9:00 pm

Ken Rudman wrote:Made a couple of Levain de Campagne-style loaves using some whole wheat flour my wife brought back from this place:

http://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/anglese ... do/page-3/
Going to need details. How was it?
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#88 Post by Ken Rudman » October 14th, 2013, 9:35 pm

Kenny H wrote:
Ken Rudman wrote:Made a couple of Levain de Campagne-style loaves using some whole wheat flour my wife brought back from this place:

http://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/anglese ... do/page-3/
Going to need details. How was it?
Great flavor, nice crust. A bit dense in the crumb, which is great for sandwiches, but I like me some large, irregular air bubbles inside for lightness. Probably needed more proofing time.

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#89 Post by Kenny H » October 14th, 2013, 9:51 pm

Ken Rudman wrote:
Kenny H wrote:
Ken Rudman wrote:Made a couple of Levain de Campagne-style loaves using some whole wheat flour my wife brought back from this place:

http://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/anglese ... do/page-3/
Going to need details. How was it?
Great flavor, nice crust. A bit dense in the crumb, which is great for sandwiches, but I like me some large, irregular air bubbles inside for lightness. Probably needed more proofing time.
Cracks me up that a perfectionist artist like yourself prefers a rustic edge to their produce. Kudos to you sir.
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#90 Post by Ken Rudman » October 14th, 2013, 10:19 pm

I am actually all about the rusticity. Achieving it consistently requires a bit of perfectionism...

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#91 Post by MBerto » October 15th, 2013, 3:13 pm

This was a new one for me. It's about 40% whole wheat, 85% hydration. I mixed the dough (no preferment) on Sunday afternoon. After a couple folds it was still really wet - not batter-like, but noticeably sticky. After 6 hours at room temperature the volume had increased perhaps 20%. I thought I couldn't throw it in the oven at that point, I'd get a hard little brick out of it. I throw it in the fridge and let it go until next day at noon, when it had increased in size perhaps 50%. I take it out and let it sit on the counter again until 7 pm, wherein it doubled. At this point I punch it down, shape and proof it. I probably could have let it proof longer (1hr), but I got a great oven spring and the taste is out of this world, I believe due to the extended bulk fermentation. The "rustic" look is due to the fact that the dough stuck to my hand when I moved it from proofing basket to dutch oven.

I should note my house warmed considerably from Sunday to Monday, which contributed to the rates of rise. Regardless, I'm going to try a few more extended bulk ferments in the fridge to see what happens.

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#92 Post by Ken Rudman » October 15th, 2013, 3:36 pm

Very nice, Matthew. Yeah, extended retard in the fridge is pretty awesome for flavor development.

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#93 Post by stevetimko » November 3rd, 2013, 10:39 am

Ken Rudman wrote:
I have three loaves of Jewish deli rye in the oven right now, and it's starting to smell awesome, with lots of onion and caraway seeds... just bought 50# of white rye flour (otherwise hard to find) and I'm trying to make a dent in it. :-)
Is white rye flour the same as light rye flour?
I'm looking at recipes for light rye bread and they involve mixing regular rye with regular white flour.
Which route will give me the best light rye bread?
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#94 Post by Ken Rudman » November 3rd, 2013, 1:09 pm

That's a good question, Steve. It appears that white rye has basically no bran in it, while light rye has a bit. I would think that light rye will work fine. The white rye creates a very clean rye bread, but it's hard to find in stores (which is how I ended up with 50# of it).

Found this:

http://wholegrainscouncil.org/whole-gra ... pes-of-rye

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#95 Post by stevetimko » November 3rd, 2013, 5:57 pm

Thanks. Bobs Red Mill makes a light rye sold locally. Maybe I will want to mix in some regular rye, though
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#96 Post by Ken Rudman » November 3rd, 2013, 11:33 pm

stevetimko wrote:Thanks. Bobs Red Mill makes a light rye sold locally. Maybe I will want to mix in some regular rye, though
Post some pics of your experiments.

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#97 Post by stevetimko » November 4th, 2013, 8:28 am

Ken Rudman wrote:
stevetimko wrote:Thanks. Bobs Red Mill makes a light rye sold locally. Maybe I will want to mix in some regular rye, though
Post some pics of your experiments.
Ah, thanks, but I'll pass. I'm too much of an amateur. I'll be using a bread machine. I already got something of a raspberry from Mel Hill.
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#98 Post by Ken Rudman » December 26th, 2013, 11:12 am

There's a new flour mill in Pasadena selling freshly milled flour from local sources. Got a couple of bags for Xmas and am now plotting a couple of new whole grain bread experiments. The new Tartine book has a bunch of great recipes using alternative whole grains...

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#99 Post by timmy roos » December 27th, 2013, 3:22 pm

Does anyone here grind their own flour in a diamant or a similar mill?? I wanted to know wwhat the results have been
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#100 Post by Ken Rudman » January 1st, 2014, 3:15 pm

First few loaves with the locally milled flour from Grist & Toll in Pasadena:

This one is Spelt and Whole Wheat, made in the Tartine style:

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First bread of the year. Whole grain spelt and triple IV hard red wheat (whole grain) from Grist & Toll by Ruddy, on Flickr

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Spelt/whole wheat by Ruddy, on Flickr

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Untitled by Ruddy, on Flickr

Here's another from the Tartine No. 3 book, which is mostly whole grains and alternative flours. This is Whole Wheat with farro porridge and hazelnuts (the farro was fermented for a couple of days in the sourdough starter and then cooked):

Image
Untitled by Ruddy, on Flickr

and the crumb--very, very dense, but delicious

Image
Untitled by Ruddy, on Flickr

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