Peter Luger NYT review.

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Victor Hong
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Peter Luger NYT review.

#1 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 9:28 am

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/29/dini ... wells.html

Sliced and raw. Then, there is the steak....
Last edited by Victor Hong on October 29th, 2019, 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Peter Lugar NYT review.

#2 Post by Peter Metzger » October 29th, 2019, 10:09 am

[oops.gif] Luger, not Lugar
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#3 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 10:24 am

Not lugey? Oh, wait, that was the review rating.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#4 Post by Mike Reff » October 29th, 2019, 10:59 am

Zero Point Zero!

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#5 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 11:24 am

Remember Ben Benson’s, on West 58th? My interdealer bond broker once took me there.

The waiter insisted on breaking the lobster claws for me, so that we could eat faster, to turn the table. I pushed the entire dish at him, and told him to pulverize the lobster in a blender (Bass-O-Matic styled) and serve me the result in a fountain glass with a straw. He backed off, but another waiter come over to hover. In 45 minutes, we were rushed out of there, minus $225 without drinks……….a lot of money back in 1986.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#6 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 29th, 2019, 11:38 am

Pete wells needs to quit. He’s the Caymus of food critics. He should just stick to eating at Gramercy Tavern.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#7 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 11:43 am

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:38 am
Pete wells needs to quit. He’s the Caymus of food critics. He should just stick to eating at Gramercy Tavern.
Why? Nobody is forced to agree with him.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#8 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 29th, 2019, 11:46 am

Victor Hong wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:43 am
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:38 am
Pete wells needs to quit. He’s the Caymus of food critics. He should just stick to eating at Gramercy Tavern.
Why? Nobody is forced to agree with him.
He’s a POS who wishes he were Jonathan Gold. The NYT would improve vastly by subtracting him.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#9 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 12:00 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:46 am
Victor Hong wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:43 am
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:38 am
Pete wells needs to quit. He’s the Caymus of food critics. He should just stick to eating at Gramercy Tavern.
Why? Nobody is forced to agree with him.
He’s a POS who wishes he were Jonathan Gold. The NYT would improve vastly by subtracting him.
Based on what?
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#10 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 12:01 pm

What is PoS?

Point of Sale?
Noodle-slingers ring out orders for cash there.
Point of Sail?
Yachtsmen refer to that for boat direction and sail trim.

I get easily confused. newhere
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#11 Post by Paul Miller » October 29th, 2019, 12:34 pm


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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#12 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 12:49 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:46 am
..............

He’s a POS who wishes he were Jonathan Gold. The NYT would improve vastly by subtracting him.
Let me guess again. Port or Starboard? Tell me that am I getting warmer.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#13 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 12:58 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 11:38 am
Pete wells needs to quit. He’s the Caymus of food critics. He should just stick to eating at Gramercy Tavern.
But Caymus wine and equivalently over-priced, Yabba-Dabba-Doo brontosaurus-styled steaks pair perfectly.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#14 Post by M.Kaplan » October 29th, 2019, 2:12 pm

Pete Wells is a crummy restaurant critic and Peter Luger is a shadow of its former self (and has been for a decade). Both things can be true.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#15 Post by RyanC » October 29th, 2019, 2:54 pm

M.Kaplan wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 2:12 pm
Pete Wells is a crummy restaurant critic and Peter Luger is a shadow of its former self (and has been for a decade). Both things can be true.
+1
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#16 Post by John Davis » October 29th, 2019, 3:12 pm

RyanC wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 2:54 pm
M.Kaplan wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 2:12 pm
Pete Wells is a crummy restaurant critic and Peter Luger is a shadow of its former self (and has been for a decade). Both things can be true.
+1
+2
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#17 Post by Jason T » October 29th, 2019, 3:14 pm

This is my challenge with most steakhouses. Without even having that much skill, one can often do better, often more consistently and certainly more cheaply, at home.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#18 Post by Frank Drew » October 29th, 2019, 3:52 pm

I haven’t yet read all the comments to Wells’ review, but so far the clear majority agrees with him.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#19 Post by Frank Drew » October 29th, 2019, 3:53 pm

.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#20 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 29th, 2019, 4:14 pm

Sure, if you’re a millennial drone, agree away.

Is it annoying that they only take cash? Sure. Then again, they haven’t taken credit cards besides their own since they opened. Are the servers grumpy? Sure, but again many are the same people who’ve been there for 20-30 years. Also, anyone who’s been there is and has been fully aware of this, as this is the way they’ve always been.

I’ve found the steaks to be consistently good since the 90s, the wine list to be reasonable for NYC (bedrock ovz for $60, etc), and it to be a fun place to have dinners with friends when I’m in the city.

Like his locol review, I don’t understand why one would review Lugers, nor would it make a smidgen of difference to anyone who’d go there. What’s he going to review next? The 21 club?

Is it the best restaurant? Certainly not. Does it offer great steaks and a fun environment with decent wine? IMO yes. If it’s not for you, don’t go.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#21 Post by John O' » October 29th, 2019, 4:43 pm

My son recently moved back to the general area and wants to take me to Peter Luger's as a thank you. Sent him this review and he called within 10 minutes ( a record by about 48 hours). We agreed we'd go somewhere more local that's just as good at 1/3 the price. My one and only time there, about 15 years ago, was not dissimilar to Wells review. As to service, there's a fine line between classic/memorable curmudgeon waiters (as the Palm did best) and just jerkoff service.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#22 Post by John O' » October 29th, 2019, 4:45 pm

oh, and thanks Victor. You saved my son a lot of money and both of us a big disappointment.
Us Salomon guys gotta stick together.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#23 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 29th, 2019, 4:49 pm

1/3 the price for what?

I have issues with people criticizing the pricing. ~100 for a 24-30 oz USDA prime porterhouse is not expensive, even for an uncooked steak. For example, holy grail sells a dry aged 24 oz porterhouse for $89 w/o shipping. Snake River Farms sells a dry aged wagyu porterhouse for $160 and bone in dry aged rib steak for $99.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#24 Post by John O' » October 29th, 2019, 4:51 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 4:49 pm
1/3 the price for what?

I have issues with people criticizing the pricing. ~100 for a 24-30 oz USDA prime porterhouse is not expensive, even for an uncooked steak.
Context: I live in Central NY where price are much lower. Wasn't comparing to NYC prices.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#25 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 29th, 2019, 4:53 pm

That’s just what USDA prime porterhouse costs, anywhere. If you are talking about a non-steak restaurant being cheaper, that’s fine, but it’s not comparing apples to oranges.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#26 Post by John O' » October 29th, 2019, 5:02 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 4:53 pm
That’s just what USDA prime porterhouse costs, anywhere. If you are talking about a non-steak restaurant being cheaper, that’s fine, but it’s not comparing apples to oranges.
Point taken. I guess I was referring to having a great steak dinner (albeit maybe not the same exalted raw materials), with better service, without the hassle of driving to Brooklyn for a lot less money.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#27 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 5:10 pm

John O' wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 4:45 pm
........
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#28 Post by James Sanders » October 29th, 2019, 5:18 pm

I enjoying reading Pete Wells, and all the more so when he's taking down the sacred cows. And let's be honest, even the best steakhouses are pretty mediocre, especially given how absurdly expensive they have become.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#29 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 5:32 pm

Restaurants are for entertainment; critics can be too, while accurate.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#30 Post by Mark Y » October 29th, 2019, 6:32 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 4:53 pm
That’s just what USDA prime porterhouse costs, anywhere. If you are talking about a non-steak restaurant being cheaper, that’s fine, but it’s not comparing apples to oranges.
Been there a couple of times. I think you are right in that Pricing are similar to other steak restaurants, not worse. The price isn’t the issue. It’s what u get for the price.

Service is meh. Cook on steak is meh. Overall vibe is meh.

If I want steak, there are better steak restaurants with better service and vibe. . If I want a nice meal, there are clearly much better restaurants.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#31 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 29th, 2019, 6:35 pm

To each their own. I’d argue the quality of the steak is better than any steakhouse I’ve been to (haven’t been to APL yet, though) and the service is fine. I don’t need obsequious wait staff. I want my orders taken correctly and efficient service and that’s it. I’ve gotten exactly that in each of the 10+ times I’ve been there.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#32 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 7:04 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 6:35 pm
To each their own. I’d argue the quality of the steak is better than any steakhouse I’ve been to (haven’t been to APL yet, though) and the service is fine. I don’t need obsequious wait staff. I want my orders taken correctly and efficient service and that’s it. I’ve gotten exactly that in each of the 10+ times I’ve been there.
Based on your statement, and how the review described Peter Luger's, would you thereby agree with its writer?
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#33 Post by Mark Golodetz » October 29th, 2019, 7:25 pm

I like Peter Luger, and would happily return there, but it has major faults. The steaks do not seem quite as good as yesteryear, but still very good. The wine list is poor, and they don’t offer BYO, and if there is anything worth drinking, I have never found it. And of course seriously overpriced.

So overall, there is no reason not to get a great Flannery steak, grill it yourself, provide a superb wine from your cellar, add a few duck fat potatoes and garlic spinach. Look at the steak porn thread. We may not fire at 1600 degrees, but we can still make great steaks.

And if need be, to get the authentic Luger service, I can always find some hard-up curmudgeon to yell at me.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#34 Post by Michael Feldman » October 29th, 2019, 7:26 pm

Basically agree with Well’s review. Went to Peter Luger’s a few years back because my wife loves steak. Thought I would treat her to a meal at the “best” steak house in the country. We left restaurant thinking that it was way overpriced for only an okay steak. Both agreed that my wife’s home cooked choice cut Porterhouse was way better at one quarter the cost.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#35 Post by Victor Hong » October 29th, 2019, 7:36 pm

Mark Golodetz wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 7:25 pm
I like Peter Luger, and would happily return there, but it has major faults. The steaks do not seem quite as good as yesteryear, but still very good. The wine list is poor, and they don’t offer BYO, and if there is anything worth drinking, I have never found it. And of course seriously overpriced.

So overall, there is no reason not to get a great Flannery steak, grill it yourself, provide a superb wine from your cellar, add a few duck fat potatoes and garlic spinach. Look at the steak porn thread. We may not fire at 1600 degrees, but we can still make great steaks.

And if need be, to get the authentic Luger service, I can always find some hard-up curmudgeon to yell at me.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#36 Post by Mark Y » October 29th, 2019, 7:59 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 6:35 pm
To each their own. I’d argue the quality of the steak is better than any steakhouse I’ve been to (haven’t been to APL yet, though) and the service is fine. I don’t need obsequious wait staff. I want my orders taken correctly and efficient service and that’s it. I’ve gotten exactly that in each of the 10+ times I’ve been there.
You probably need to visit more/better steak houses ;)

kidding dude.. agree, different strokes.. all good!
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#37 Post by RyanC » October 29th, 2019, 8:33 pm

Traditional steakhouses -- showcasing cornfed prime beef and traditional sides -- are almost inherently overrated these days. Consumers can find great meat and, with some practice, it's not hard to cook it very well. Heck, even the Whole Foods down the street from me pretty regularly gets phenomenal prime beef (sometimes Wagyu-level beef) for ~$20/lb (sometimes less than that on sale). The Central Market that's five minutes away has great Wagyu strips and ribeyes. It's hard to justify $100+/person at a steakhouse when I can feed the family on prime beef (or better) and drink from my cellar for a fraction of that.

To really stand out these days, a steakhouse needs to feature specialty beef (e.g., real Kobe etc) and/or offer a multi-faceted experience with great and interesting sides/apps/drinks/atmosphere (like Georgia James here in Houston).
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#38 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 30th, 2019, 2:56 am

The fundamental issue I have with the review is regarding the quality and value of the meat, which I think is phenomenal.

Regarding service/lack of amenities that the writer (and everyone else) knew/knows exactly what they would/wouldn’t get before going.
Victor Hong wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 7:04 pm
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 6:35 pm
To each their own. I’d argue the quality of the steak is better than any steakhouse I’ve been to (haven’t been to APL yet, though) and the service is fine. I don’t need obsequious wait staff. I want my orders taken correctly and efficient service and that’s it. I’ve gotten exactly that in each of the 10+ times I’ve been there.
Based on your statement, and how the review described Peter Luger's, would you thereby agree with its writer?

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#39 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 30th, 2019, 3:08 am

RyanC wrote:
October 29th, 2019, 8:33 pm
Traditional steakhouses -- showcasing cornfed prime beef and traditional sides -- are almost inherently overrated these days. Consumers can find great meat and, with some practice, it's not hard to cook it very well. Heck, even the Whole Foods down the street from me pretty regularly gets phenomenal prime beef (sometimes Wagyu-level beef) for ~$20/lb (sometimes less than that on sale). The Central Market that's five minutes away has great Wagyu strips and ribeyes. It's hard to justify $100+/person at a steakhouse when I can feed the family on prime beef (or better) and drink from my cellar for a fraction of that.

To really stand out these days, a steakhouse needs to feature specialty beef (e.g., real Kobe etc) and/or offer a multi-faceted experience with great and interesting sides/apps/drinks/atmosphere (like Georgia James here in Houston).
My biggest disagreement with the review (and comments on this post) is regarding quality/value.

Do I think that it’s possible to make as good or better a steak at home? Absolutely. That said, I think the value you get there is actually very good; USDA prime porterhouse is expensive and the ~110 they charge for a ~30+ oz porterhouse is about what you’d pay sourcing one, uncooked, unshipped, from a good source.

One could easily make the argument that you’d rather eat at home and have access to a better selection of wine, and I get that. If they allowed BYO with a reasonable price, it’d be that much better a place. My point was that I’ve paid similar prices for much worse steak at other steakhouses, such as JGVs, and have always had fun there. I also think the steak is still very good and I was there last week. I don’t think paying $600 all in for 6 ppl for steaks, sides, 2 bottles of wine, and dessert is out of line for NYC at all, and my friend took back at least 16 oz of steak.

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#40 Post by J a y H a c k » October 30th, 2019, 4:00 am

I haven't been there for decades and I have no comment about the restaurant or the food, but if you go to Luger's and order Dover sole, you are an idiot, not a food critic.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#41 Post by mmarcellus » October 30th, 2019, 5:51 am

J a y H a c k wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 4:00 am
I haven't been there for decades and I have no comment about the restaurant or the food, but if you go to Luger's and order Dover sole, you are an idiot, not a food critic.
As a food critic, I'd say he's doing his job. The readership of the NYT extends beyond the august assemblage at WB. A non beef eater who only knows Luger's name, and is cajoled into going there by their friends, is not necessarily an idiot - unless they still decide to go there after reading his review. And Wells cannot say the sole isn't good unless he first tries it. I'm sure he knew what he was in for going in.

I really don't get all the Wells hatred here. He's funny, readable and, based on the (few) restaurants I have tried after reading his reviews, he does more or less accurately reflect the experience at the places he's reviewing. He's certainly a hell of a lot more useful to me than Michelin. But, like many NYT readers, I'm a much more casual and intermittent participant in the NYC restaurant scene than many of the people here.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#42 Post by Steve L Gellman » October 30th, 2019, 6:18 am

Had dinner at Keens Saturday night. Still love it there

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#43 Post by Victor Hong » October 30th, 2019, 6:20 am

Steve L Gellman wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 6:18 am
Had dinner at Keens Saturday night. Still love it there
Excellent service and food. BYO friendly. Reasonable prices.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#44 Post by fred o. » October 30th, 2019, 8:35 am

mmarcellus wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 5:51 am
As a food critic, I'd say he's doing his job. The readership of the NYT extends beyond the august assemblage at WB. A non beef eater who only knows Luger's name, and is cajoled into going there by their friends, is not necessarily an idiot - unless they still decide to go there after reading his review. And Wells cannot say the sole isn't good unless he first tries it. I'm sure he knew what he was in for going in.

I really don't get all the Wells hatred here. He's funny, readable and, based on the (few) restaurants I have tried after reading his reviews, he does more or less accurately reflect the experience at the places he's reviewing. He's certainly a hell of a lot more useful to me than Michelin. But, like many NYT readers, I'm a much more casual and intermittent participant in the NYC restaurant scene than many of the people here.
whether you're a casual/intermittent diner or not, it's still possible to view Pete Wells as a bad critic without hating him/viewing him as "POS." And by "bad," I'm not referring to the technical aspects of writing or being able to describe food, which Wells should be able to do as a baseline function of his job as a journalist. What's much more questionable is Well's judgment, and his decisions in what to review, and how to review those places. If you look at his body of work in reviews, his hack job against Peter Luger's is part of a pattern going back to others like the Guy Fieri, Per Se reviews from years ago: reviews done in poor taste, that look to be done with the intent to drive clicks and pageviews, without really advancing the dialogue on food within NYC in a meaningful way. You can critically assess an institution without doing it in so obviously a self-serving way; I look at Soleil Ho's piece on Alice Waters and Chez Panisse as an example, even if it got savaged by some on the old guard in SF. I don't read Pete Wells and think of someone who loves food, and loves NYC, in the same way that I do when reading Ruth Reichl or even Ryan Sutton (from Eater NY, who I think is much better than Wells), or other thoughtful and conscientious critics like Jonathan Gold when he wrote about food in LA. Even Tejal Rao (who is excellent, and one of the best food critics in California now, to my mind) and Ligaya Mishan are much better within the NY Times food department than Wells.

Part of this may be from an overall decline in the quality of the journalism at the NY Times as a whole. Reading Pete Wells and his approach to food criticism recalls Jill Lepore's devastating profile of how journalism in the US has declined:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019 ... e-a-future

It's unfortunate to see how closely the Times is becoming aligned to websites like Buzzfeed, and reviews like the Luger one seem like just another example of that decline.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#45 Post by RyanC » October 30th, 2019, 8:52 am

fred o. wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 8:35 am
mmarcellus wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 5:51 am
As a food critic, I'd say he's doing his job. The readership of the NYT extends beyond the august assemblage at WB. A non beef eater who only knows Luger's name, and is cajoled into going there by their friends, is not necessarily an idiot - unless they still decide to go there after reading his review. And Wells cannot say the sole isn't good unless he first tries it. I'm sure he knew what he was in for going in.

I really don't get all the Wells hatred here. He's funny, readable and, based on the (few) restaurants I have tried after reading his reviews, he does more or less accurately reflect the experience at the places he's reviewing. He's certainly a hell of a lot more useful to me than Michelin. But, like many NYT readers, I'm a much more casual and intermittent participant in the NYC restaurant scene than many of the people here.
whether you're a casual/intermittent diner or not, it's still possible to view Pete Wells as a bad critic without hating him/viewing him as "POS." And by "bad," I'm not referring to the technical aspects of writing or being able to describe food, which Wells should be able to do as a baseline function of his job as a journalist. What's much more questionable is Well's judgment, and his decisions in what to review, and how to review those places. If you look at his body of work in reviews, his hack job against Peter Luger's is part of a pattern going back to others like the Guy Fieri, Per Se reviews from years ago: reviews done in poor taste, that look to be done with the intent to drive clicks and pageviews, without really advancing the dialogue on food within NYC in a meaningful way. You can critically assess an institution without doing it in so obviously a self-serving way; I look at Soleil Ho's piece on Alice Waters and Chez Panisse as an example, even if it got savaged by some on the old guard in SF. I don't read Pete Wells and think of someone who loves food, and loves NYC, in the same way that I do when reading Ruth Reichl or even Ryan Sutton (from Eater NY, who I think is much better than Wells), or other thoughtful and conscientious critics like Jonathan Gold when he wrote about food in LA. Even Tejal Rao (who is excellent, and one of the best food critics in California now, to my mind) and Ligaya Mishan are much better within the NY Times food department than Wells.

Part of this may be from an overall decline in the quality of the journalism at the NY Times as a whole. Reading Pete Wells and his approach to food criticism recalls Jill Lepore's devastating profile of how journalism in the US has declined:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019 ... e-a-future

It's unfortunate to see how closely the Times is becoming aligned to websites like Buzzfeed, and reviews like the Luger one seem like just another example of that decline.
I agree with nearly all of this. Too many of Wells's reviews are fairly transparently designed to drive clicks rather than advance the dialogue on dining in New York.

I also think he lets his social commentary and anti-elitism cloud restaurant reviews. I'm fine with putting restaurants in their social context. But at some point the commentary swallows the review and it becomes challenging to ascertain the quality of a restaurant's food/service/atmosphere, and also to ascertain how the restaurant compares with similar restaurants in New York and beyond. I would like to know if a restaurant is "the best sushi," "top-tier sushi," etc., and then I can look at the pricing and decide whether it's worth it to me. (FWIW, I thought Tejal Rao's reviews of TFL/Single Thread/etc. was probably the worst offender of this issue that I've ever seen.)

At base, my issue with Pete Wells is that he's just not that informative on where I should eat in New York and how New York's interesting and important restaurants compare to each other and fit in the wider food world. Wells writes pretty well, and he can be entertaining. And his commentary is what it is. But as a food writer, he tells me far too little about food, what I should eat, and where I should eat it.
C@ughey

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#46 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 30th, 2019, 9:28 am

To be clear, I think he’s a POS because of the locol article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/03/dinin ... s.amp.html

Here was Jonathan gold’s reply.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latime ... f_amp=true

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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#47 Post by DanielP » October 30th, 2019, 10:14 am

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 9:28 am
To be clear, I think he’s a POS because of the locol article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/03/dinin ... s.amp.html

Here was Jonathan gold’s reply.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latime ... f_amp=true
After reading both articles, I don't see what makes Pete Wells a POS. The criticism is clearly directed at the food.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#48 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 30th, 2019, 10:19 am

If he wrote a column criticizing a child's lemonade stand for having thin, watery lemonade, would that be appropriate? Would critiquing some cookies someone baked for a charity event as dry, lacking depth be appropriate?

Ignoring completely that the restaurant he reviewed is > 2000 miles away from NYC, there's literally no reason the article should have even been written.
DanielP wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 10:14 am
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 9:28 am
To be clear, I think he’s a POS because of the locol article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/03/dinin ... s.amp.html

Here was Jonathan gold’s reply.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latime ... f_amp=true
After reading both articles, I don't see what makes Pete Wells a POS. The criticism is clearly directed at the food.

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Posts: 471
Joined: October 5th, 2015, 7:21 pm
Location: NYC

Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#49 Post by DanielP » October 30th, 2019, 10:29 am

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
October 30th, 2019, 10:19 am
If he wrote a column criticizing a child's lemonade stand for having thin, watery lemonade, would that be appropriate? Would critiquing some cookies someone baked for a charity event as dry, lacking depth be appropriate?
A little absurd given that it's not a soup kitchen. It's still a restaurant in the business of making money whose product is the food. It's not like he just picked out some take down candidates from a list of socially conscious restaurants. As far as I could tell from Gold's article, it was certainly a restaurant (albeit a different location) that had received a ton of hype. Fair game for a national paper to review.
The people working at Locol are engaged, and seem glad to be there. If Locol can create environments like this across the country, it would be a major achievement.

But first Mr. Patterson and Mr. Choi have to figure out the menu. I understand why they want to take on fast food, but in the neighborhoods they hope to reach it’s one of the few kinds of food available. Why offer less satisfying versions of what’s already there, when they could be selling great versions of something new?

The neighborhoods Locol is targeting have serious nutritional problems, from hunger to obesity, but the solution isn’t to charge people for stuff that tastes like hospital food. If Locol were a nonprofit, then institutional-quality cooking might be unavoidable. It is a restaurant, though, and it is run by two chefs who are famous for cooking food that people really, really want to eat.
This passage seemed to encapsulate the article, and for me, seemed fair. Perhaps you may disagree, but I hardly think it makes Wells a piece of shit. It's also amusing that Wells gets criticism for being too socially conscious, but also takes down a restaurant built around its social mission by focusing on the taste of its food.
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Re: Peter Luger NYT review.

#50 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » October 30th, 2019, 11:07 am

La mag has an interesting view too.

http://www.lamag.com/digestblog/new-yor ... iew-locol/

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