Please settle this disagreement

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JeromeHan
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Please settle this disagreement

#1 Post by JeromeHan » May 20th, 2016, 1:28 pm

My friend and I have a disagreement, but I am inclined to follow his lead usually when it comes to wine as I am a novice relative to him. He told me to never ever put wine in a refrigerator for more then one day as it will "kill" the wine. Is this true?

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Henry Kiichli
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#2 Post by Henry Kiichli » May 20th, 2016, 1:37 pm

No.
"Police say Henry smelled of alcohol and acknowledged drinking a six-pack of Hamm’s beer with the hogs"

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#3 Post by John O' » May 20th, 2016, 1:45 pm

If you put your friend in the refrigerator for one day that might kill him.
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#4 Post by Chris Blum » May 20th, 2016, 1:54 pm

putting wine in the fridge

1) makes it cold
2) slows down the natural biological process that can lead to spoilage.

But no, it doesn't magically kill any wine. Just be sure to isolate it from fridge smells with some sort of seal. Then, take it out and let it warm up before serving.
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#5 Post by Drew Goin » May 20th, 2016, 2:02 pm

No. I have heard that long-term storage in a refrigerator of a bottle can cause problems due to temperature fluctuations and vibrations.

Personal experience says it's fine.

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#6 Post by Henry Kiichli » May 20th, 2016, 2:03 pm

Chris Blum wrote:Just be sure to isolate it from fridge smells with some sort of seal.

You mean, like, a cork?
"Police say Henry smelled of alcohol and acknowledged drinking a six-pack of Hamm’s beer with the hogs"

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#7 Post by Michael Martin » May 20th, 2016, 2:14 pm

Maybe he is referring to a cold serving temp subduing the initial flavors especially in red wine. A slow warm-up will be back the nuances.

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#8 Post by Chris Blum » May 20th, 2016, 2:26 pm

Henry Kiichli wrote:
Chris Blum wrote:Just be sure to isolate it from fridge smells with some sort of seal.

You mean, like, a cork?
That just might work.
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#9 Post by JeromeHan » May 20th, 2016, 5:40 pm

He still seems to disagree, but I think I have made up my mind. Thank you all.

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#10 Post by cnalda » May 21st, 2016, 11:57 am

It is easy to agree to disagree.
Especially when you are right and he is wrong....
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JeromeHan
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#11 Post by JeromeHan » May 21st, 2016, 12:36 pm

So is the only reason that people don't just put their wines in refrigerators long term that they will not age properly?

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#12 Post by E. Mark Larson » May 21st, 2016, 2:38 pm

In our house there are always three or four bottles of white wine in the refrigerator that are available to be opened up.

Heck, I'm such a bohemian, I've forgotten about wine that I put in the freezer for a "quick chill." It doesn't freeze solid, but it does create a slush. Set it on the counter for a few minutes, and it's fine. I can't say that I recommend it, though.

Many people will store unfinished bottles of red wine in the refrigerator. The theory is that the cold retards the oxidation process that starts the instant the bottle is opened. I guess that makes sense.

Please go back to your friend and ask what process occurs in the refrigerator that "kills" the wine. I, for one, am curious about what he thinks happens to the wine.

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#13 Post by Brian Tuite » May 21st, 2016, 2:46 pm

JeromeHan wrote:So is the only reason that people don't just put their wines in refrigerators long term that they will not age properly?
Refrigerators are a dry environment and storing wines in that environment will accelerate evaporation.
Wines that have not been cold stabilized will form tartrate crystals on the cork and also in the bottle which will accumulate as sediment.
Labels don't like extended refrigerator time. They loosen and slide off.
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#14 Post by JeromeHan » May 21st, 2016, 6:34 pm

Brian Tuite wrote:
JeromeHan wrote:So is the only reason that people don't just put their wines in refrigerators long term that they will not age properly?
Refrigerators are a dry environment and storing wines in that environment will accelerate evaporation.
Wines that have not been cold stabilized will form tartrate crystals on the cork and also in the bottle which will accumulate as sediment.
Labels don't like extended refrigerator time. They loosen and slide off.
So keeping a few bottles stored in the fridge for the summer so I'll always have a couples cold bottles on hand should be no problem then right?

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#15 Post by Henry Kiichli » May 21st, 2016, 11:31 pm

Right.
"Police say Henry smelled of alcohol and acknowledged drinking a six-pack of Hamm’s beer with the hogs"

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#16 Post by PeterJ » June 14th, 2016, 6:56 pm

JeromeHan wrote:He still seems to disagree, but I think I have made up my mind. Thank you all.
Well...... he's wrong, so you're OK.
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#17 Post by Peter Kleban » June 14th, 2016, 7:43 pm

JeromeHan wrote:So is the only reason that people don't just put their wines in refrigerators long term that they will not age properly?
Those with a thousand or more bottles have another reason ;-)
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#18 Post by Todd F r e n c h » June 14th, 2016, 7:44 pm

Is your (wrong) friend going with the 'we'll agree to disagree' thing?
Apparently I'm lazy, have a narrow agenda, and offer little in the way of content and substance (RMP) (and have a "penchant for gossip" -KBI)

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#19 Post by JC J o u a s » June 14th, 2016, 8:01 pm

Storing a white wine in a refridgerator at under 40 degrees can lead to the formation of tartrate crystals within one week of being exposed to refrigerator temperatures and maybe that is what your friend is getting at but it doesn't ruin the wine.
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#20 Post by JeromeHan » June 14th, 2016, 10:01 pm

Todd F r e n c h wrote:Is your (wrong) friend going with the 'we'll agree to disagree' thing?
We actually just returned to this discussion again today, but on a tangent. It has not turned into how it is bad to put wine in a refrigerator once you've opened it. I am typically one who thinks that opening a bottle, pouring our what I want to drink into a small decanter, recorking immediately, and putting in in the fridge is okay as long as you let it come back to room temp the next day before you drink. Friend, insists it's better to just leave the wine out (recorked) at room temperature. I just figured the colder temperature of a fridge would slow down the degradation process of the wine compared to room temperature, especially if room temp. is high during the summer months.

He qualified his statement by saying that the wine left at room temp and not the fridge will taste completely different than a wine kept overnight in the fridge. I agreed. deadhorse

Once again, I think we have agreed to disagree.

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#21 Post by JeromeHan » June 14th, 2016, 10:03 pm

Peter Kleban wrote:
JeromeHan wrote:So is the only reason that people don't just put their wines in refrigerators long term that they will not age properly?
Those with a thousand or more bottles have another reason ;-)
What if I just have a realllllly big refrigerator?

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#22 Post by Craig G » June 14th, 2016, 10:06 pm

I think you should ignore everything your friend says and trust your judgment!
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#23 Post by PaulM » June 17th, 2016, 3:21 pm

JeromeHan wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:Is your (wrong) friend going with the 'we'll agree to disagree' thing?
We actually just returned to this discussion again today, but on a tangent. It has not turned into how it is bad to put wine in a refrigerator once you've opened it. I am typically one who thinks that opening a bottle, pouring our what I want to drink into a small decanter, recorking immediately, and putting in in the fridge is okay as long as you let it come back to room temp the next day before you drink. Friend, insists it's better to just leave the wine out (recorked) at room temperature. I just figured the colder temperature of a fridge would slow down the degradation process of the wine compared to room temperature, especially if room temp. is high during the summer months.

He qualified his statement by saying that the wine left at room temp and not the fridge will taste completely different than a wine kept overnight in the fridge. I agreed. deadhorse

Once again, I think we have agreed to disagree.
Here he's diametrically opposed to the truth. Colder temperatures slow oxidation and are better for storage of opened bottles (though you then have to get back to a reasonable serving temperature, for which a tepid water bath is helpful). Tip for cheap and effective wine storage: keep a few screwcap glass bottles of varying sizes around (I use old sparkling water bottles) and, if you don't want a full bottle, fill one of the appropriate size up to the very top - no air - and cap it tightly before drinking the rest. That's worked better for me than pumps, inert gas sprays, etc.
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#24 Post by Scott Wi3gand » June 21st, 2016, 9:42 pm

PaulM wrote:
JeromeHan wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:Is your (wrong) friend going with the 'we'll agree to disagree' thing?
We actually just returned to this discussion again today, but on a tangent. It has not turned into how it is bad to put wine in a refrigerator once you've opened it. I am typically one who thinks that opening a bottle, pouring our what I want to drink into a small decanter, recorking immediately, and putting in in the fridge is okay as long as you let it come back to room temp the next day before you drink. Friend, insists it's better to just leave the wine out (recorked) at room temperature. I just figured the colder temperature of a fridge would slow down the degradation process of the wine compared to room temperature, especially if room temp. is high during the summer months.

He qualified his statement by saying that the wine left at room temp and not the fridge will taste completely different than a wine kept overnight in the fridge. I agreed. deadhorse

Once again, I think we have agreed to disagree.
Here he's diametrically opposed to the truth. Colder temperatures slow oxidation and are better for storage of opened bottles (though you then have to get back to a reasonable serving temperature, for which a tepid water bath is helpful). Tip for cheap and effective wine storage: keep a few screwcap glass bottles of varying sizes around (I use old sparkling water bottles) and, if you don't want a full bottle, fill one of the appropriate size up to the very top - no air - and cap it tightly before drinking the rest. That's worked better for me than pumps, inert gas sprays, etc.
I agree that he is diametrically opposed to the truth. If you get the opportunity, you should try this: invite your friend over for a drink, get 2 bottles of identical red and drink half of each the night before. Re-cork one and stick it in the fridge (ideally in a 375ml bottle or whatever is closest to the amount of wine left), then re-cork the second one and leave it on the counter. When he gets there have him taste them blind and ask him if he can tell which is which.

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#25 Post by JeromeHan » July 6th, 2016, 7:48 pm

I am wondering though, what affect (if any) would refrigerator storage for extended periods of time (6+months) have on a red wine besides maybe drying out the cork?

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#26 Post by Dennis Kanagie » September 28th, 2016, 10:08 pm

JeromeHan wrote:I am wondering though, what affect (if any) would refrigerator storage for extended periods of time (6+months) have on a red wine besides maybe drying out the cork?
It won't age much at all at the sub 40˚ temperature. If you store the bottle on it's side so the cork stays moist inside you should be okay. We have a small plastic 6 bottle holder in our fridge that the wife uses for whites as a 'grab & go' staging area for her lunches / dinners on girls' night out. Some of those bottles (Riesling, Vouvray) stay in there longer than 6 months and all have been just fine.

To extend what I'm talking about, I have a cellar and 4 small (36 bottle) Danby units. The wine I deem in it's prime drinking window is moved to a Danby (between 54˚ and 56˚), and the stuff that still needs some aging is laying down on a rack (between 59˚ and 64˚). The colder temps extend the drinking window.

Oh, and about your other post above: young red wine is fine to leave in the cellar for a few days after opening if you recork it. Older red wine should be refrigerated once the cork is popped.
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#27 Post by PeterJ » September 30th, 2016, 6:48 pm

I spent six years working at a small wine shop where the owner had been in wine wholesale and retail for 40+ years. He kept partial bottles of whites in a regular fridge but left all reds out with just the same VacuVin preservation as the whites. His reasoning was that overnight at AC controlled 73° was less of an issue for the reds than the swing of temperature from 73° to 30-something fridge temp and back up again. I know wine's don't like huge temp swings but have never seen research on the specific range maximum and related issues.
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#28 Post by Doug Schulman » October 5th, 2016, 4:57 am

JeromeHan wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:Is your (wrong) friend going with the 'we'll agree to disagree' thing?
We actually just returned to this discussion again today, but on a tangent. It has not turned into how it is bad to put wine in a refrigerator once you've opened it. I am typically one who thinks that opening a bottle, pouring our what I want to drink into a small decanter, recorking immediately, and putting in in the fridge is okay as long as you let it come back to room temp the next day before you drink. Friend, insists it's better to just leave the wine out (recorked) at room temperature. I just figured the colder temperature of a fridge would slow down the degradation process of the wine compared to room temperature, especially if room temp. is high during the summer months.

He qualified his statement by saying that the wine left at room temp and not the fridge will taste completely different than a wine kept overnight in the fridge. I agreed. deadhorse

Once again, I think we have agreed to disagree.
Your friend is still completely wrong. What a ridiculous thing to believe.
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#29 Post by Ian Sutton » October 24th, 2016, 4:30 pm

Craig G wrote:I think you should ignore everything your friend says and trust your judgment!
There is a lot to be said for this (and nothing against your friend in saying that). However going further than that, have a healthy degree of scepticism for anything *anyone says about wine, especially when they appear especially confident on what might be a matter of taste. There have also been too many instances where someone confidently trots out patent nonsense, and appallingly some of these have come from the mouths of people for whom wine is a living.

We've all fallen for the 'so and so said that so it must be true'. The truth is in what you taste yourself. We may have experienced wine friends whose palate preferences are very different to our own. They might be incredulous that we don't like a wine, but it tastes unpleasant or just uninteresting to us. It's likely that both are right, for them the wine is great, for you it isn't. The mistake is thinking they must be right and trying to fight what your palate is telling you.

FWIW there are some things that are rarely disputed, and I'm with the other posters here in being surprised at your friend's comments. However context can make a difference. A very young, tightly coiled wine, might indeed be better left out at room temperature after opening, rather than being put in fridge - it might (and I say might) open up better that way.

In saying this I'm not saying don't listen or read opinions about wine - both are often enjoyable and informative, but never lose sight of your own opinions on matters of taste, and on more technical matters, do what you're already doing here and make note of different opinions.

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#30 Post by Chris Blum » October 24th, 2016, 7:16 pm

Maybe he's confused about rapid temperature oscillations being bad for wine. That is only true about long term storage conditions.
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#31 Post by Bdklein » October 25th, 2016, 5:46 am

I think it's time for a new friend.
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#32 Post by cnalda » November 3rd, 2016, 5:25 pm

1. A wise man once said:
"It is easy to agree to disagree.
Especially when you are right and he is wrong...."
2. Everyone else in this thread agrees with you.
3. Further explore the nuances, but see 1 and 2, above......
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#33 Post by Bob Kot » June 18th, 2018, 1:08 pm

Absolutely not true.

Warm temperatures and Heat are the enemies of wine.

Cheers!

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