What BEER are you drinking?

[Mel Hill]

Lots of fruit on this one from my nephew

[Brian Lynch]

And it’s here! Round 1: At Long Last - MT/Societe DIPA collab. No description on the can.

They had just canned that when I was there, but they wouldn't budge when I begged for them to release a four pack. How was it?

[Paul Miller]

Went to the Goose Island "Black Friday" tasting for the new BCBS lineup. Actually got VIP tickets for the grand tasting with food and tchotkes. Got a tote bag, a glass, and a fancy book.

Also included were two bottles of the variants, in which we got lucky. I expected the coffee and the cherry. Instead, we got a Proprietor and a Double Barrel. Then on the way out the door, got a second bottle of the Double Barrel!

Food included a pate made from goose liver, and instead of using brandy, they used the wheated beer. Then a half chicken on mushroom/tomato ragu, also made with BCBS. And then, some rib that looked like it came off of a dinosaur - was delicious, but over the top. Finally a decadent molten lava cake.

The pours were almost each a full size pour. Maybe first time in my life I walked away leaving so much highly sought after beers behind. Everyone did except for the guy to my left, who drank his and his wife's beers! And ate all the food.

The eight beers (I took notes, then left the notes behind, so from a hazy memory, and in order we drank):

1) Wheatwine Ale - Last year this was included instead of a barleywine. Highest alcohol among the group (outside the Double Barrel). Aged in a Larceny barrel, which is a wheated bourbon from Heaven Hill (their "partner" this year). Was probably the easiest to drink. Tended to butterscotch and toffee flavors.
2) Original - Not as sweet as previous years. More leather and earth, with lots of caramel, some vanilla. Lots of cocoa. Easy to drink as well. All from Heaven Hill barrels.
3) Reserve Rye - From what different people have said, this seems to be the one people are going after (in general). Used Rittenhouse barrels. Tended to be more spicy (duh!). To me, it tended to be more tight. Probably my least favorite. Did have some banana flavor to it.
4) 2-Year Reserve - So this one is not from Heaven Hill as it's two years in the making. Used Knob Creek barrels. Had more caramel and vanilla. Was also a little tight still. Seemed and felt stronger.
5) Double Barrel - This is a new one. Aged in a barrel, and then aged again in a second barrel. This is the most limited. They had a lottery to buy these a week ago, that I lost out on. Was surprised we got one in our gift bag, and shocked when we got another one on the way out the door. The Prop is going for about $50 ea. Not sure the list price on these. That said, it was my favorite. Just had more intensity of flavors. Was intense all the way around. And it should be clocking in at 18%. Was aged in Elijah Craig barrels.
6) Proprietors - This year it's full of coconut and vanilla. Decadent, but tasty. Also has cocoa and pecans. Not sure I picked up on the pecan notes, although they said that flavor would probably be the first to dissipate. The coconut and vanilla dominated to me. I found this one enjoyable.
7) Mon Cheri - A cherry version. I liked it, although a bit syrupy. This was the most polarizing one. Also, they said this one they felt would age the best. They also used granola in this variant. Going for a cherry cobbler profile.
8) Cafe de Olla - They no longer make a true coffee BCBS. This one also had orange in it. Last year they made an orange variant, that was also polarizing, and one I actually liked. I generally do not like beers with coffee in them, even though I love coffee. I find it makes the beer too acidic, and I feel like I am burping coffee for two days afterwards. This one I liked. This one is more like a coffee dessert, rather than a coffee beer.

[Scott Butler]

Amazing experience Paul I wish I could have been there. The double barrel sounds up my alley. I was in Detroit all weekend and searched everywhere for any bourbon county beers and only found one bottle of the regular. KBS and CBS were all around but no BCBS. I got back home to Greenville today and stopped up at my local store. They had case after case of the regular, and a large supply of the three year vertical. Crazy how you just need to be in the right spot. Would have been fun to get some specialty bottles but I’m happy to get a few regulars.

[Andrew Kotowski]

And Paul wins the internet today, while I sit at work and realize I'm going home to hazy IPA.

Well freaking done; all I have is this in response...

[Andrew Kotowski]

And it’s here! Round 1: At Long Last - MT/Societe DIPA collab. No description on the can.

They had just canned that when I was there, but they wouldn't budge when I begged for them to release a four pack. How was it?

Exactly what you’d expect for an MT DIPA. Fairly well balanced with the malt on the edge of going sideways, light bite on the finish and orange juice. It’s a good can of beer and I enjoy it, but it’s getting hard to differentiate, given the mass of new DIPAs in MT’s portfolio.

[Paul Miller]

And Paul wins the internet today, while I sit at work and realize I'm going home to hazy IPA.

Well freaking done; all I have is this in response...

Well, if we can get enough people together in Chicago for a beer dinner, I’ll bring the Double. Because I sure as hell can’t drink one of those by myself!

[Steve Eisenhauer]

Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale

https://untappd.com/b/czig-meister-blacksmith/1594830

[Andrew Kotowski]

Totally recognize there's a "Commerce" thread, but given aged beer ask... I'll throw out here with people I know.

Anybody have Dogfish 120 stashed away that they're looking to trade? Interested in 10, 12, 13, 15, 18 if you have available. Could go definitely go older, but that's the sweet spot given I'm helping a friend fill a vertical for a tasting. Would consider flat out purchase, trading aged BBA Stouts (Abyss, etc) or if you want to wait to receive in early Feb... I'll be back in Paris and likely bringing more Cantillon back. Dice role there on what, if anything, is available.

[Brian G r a f s t r o m]

Wish I had some yo trade with you; alas. I don't.

[Brian G r a f s t r o m]

MT - Space Ways IPA
MT - Mega Space Ways DIPA
RIIP / Brouwerij West - Space Criisp IPA
Bell's - IV To A Locomotive In Winter smoked porter
Founders - KBS
Monkish - Bon Bon NEIIPA
Monkish - Dribble Dreams NEIIPA

[Steve Eisenhauer]

My local joint is killing it right now. Besides having stocked several Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale kegs, they have Neshaminy Creek County Leon Russian Imperial Stout and Troeg's Mad Elf on tap at the moment. I'm also interested in the Flying Monkeys Killer Cupcake Panda (IPA) and the Rusty Rail Snow Flyer (Hazlenut Chocolate Porter).

[ClarkstonMark]

Totally recognize there's a "Commerce" thread, but given aged beer ask... I'll throw out here with people I know.

Anybody have Dogfish 120 stashed away that they're looking to trade? Interested in 10, 12, 13, 15, 18 if you have available. Could go definitely go older, but that's the sweet spot given I'm helping a friend fill a vertical for a tasting. Would consider flat out purchase, trading aged BBA Stouts (Abyss, etc) or if you want to wait to receive in early Feb... I'll be back in Paris and likely bringing more Cantillon back. Dice role there on what, if anything, is available.

I have a bottle dated April 2016. Be happy to ship it to you if you want it (I know it's not a year you put out there)

[Andrew Kotowski]

@Mark - thanks for responding! The guy running the tasting already has that year :/

[William Segui]

Had heard that Grapefruit Sculpin was a shadow of its former self. Can confirm. Sad as this was great

[C Chen]

Had heard that Grapefruit Sculpin was a shadow of its former self. Can confirm. Sad as this was great

Lol. Haven't bought anything from Ballast Point in almost a decade.

[Steve Eisenhauer]

Happy to report that the Flying Monkeys Killer Cupcake Panda lives up to its name. Killer. A rich and creamy style of IPA, good for colder weather.

[Mark Y]

Easter island brewery - Marina pale ale and ipa.

Hmm let’s just say beer isn’t the reason why you would come to the most remote inhibited island in the world

[Rick Allen]

We are "gifted" beer at the Brewery all the time. Usually the really good stuff gets taken home and drunk immediately. The rest tends to accumulate and take up cooler space. Last Sunday the younger folks drank through about 40 bottles of various things that had collected - mostly sours (no one at the Brewery particularly cares for these) and stouts. Most of these had a bit of age on them - most had been collected over the past year, and most came from well regarded breweries from around the country.

We decided that beer should be allowed only to have one level of bullshit - one flavor that was un-beerlike. So a chocolate stout is OK, but a coconut chocolate stout has one too many layers of bullshit. A barrel-aged coconut chocolate stout (three layers of bullshit) is undrinkable. Many of the beers we tried had too many layers of bullshit to be enjoyable and many of the sours were just too sour for me to enjoy. One beer of note was a Schlenkerla Oaked-smoked Dopplebock that for me was close to the edge between campfire and ashtray, but still on the good side of things.

[JDavisRoby]

Had my first (likely only) Prairie Christmas Bomb Tuesday night. On tap at a local pub. Was good but a little more nutmeg than I was prefer.

The original Prairie Bomb is still one of my favorite stouts.

[Scott Tallman]

We are "gifted" beer at the Brewery all the time. Usually the really good stuff gets taken home and drunk immediately. The rest tends to accumulate and take up cooler space. Last Sunday the younger folks drank through about 40 bottles of various things that had collected - mostly sours (no one at the Brewery particularly cares for these) and stouts. Most of these had a bit of age on them - most had been collected over the past year, and most came from well regarded breweries from around the country.

We decided that beer should be allowed only to have one level of bullshit - one flavor that was un-beerlike. So a chocolate stout is OK, but a coconut chocolate stout has one too many layers of bullshit. A barrel-aged coconut chocolate stout (three layers of bullshit) is undrinkable. Many of the beers we tried had too many layers of bullshit to be enjoyable and many of the sours were just too sour for me to enjoy. One beer of note was a Schlenkerla Oaked-smoked Dopplebock that for me was close to the edge between campfire and ashtray, but still on the good side of things.

Now I know what bullshit to bring down in February.

[Joe V]

Found the Kern River Citra DIPA in a can at the local store. Still solid, but I don't think it was as amazing as the Kern River Citra of 7-10 years ago.

Also the MT Mega Space Ways (DIPA) and Accumulated Knowledge...and a bunch of solid NE style IPA's from Revision Brewery.

[Robert M yers]

Popped the KBS espresso stout this am...wow Starbucks could sell this. Way too much espresso for me, but a decent day off morning drink I suppose

[Andrew Kotowski]

Popped the KBS espresso stout this am...wow Starbucks could sell this. Way too much espresso for me, but a decent day off morning drink I suppose

Yes! I need to take more days off that start like this.

[Robert M yers]

Popped the KBS espresso stout this am...wow Starbucks could sell this. Way too much espresso for me, but a decent day off morning drink I suppose

Yes! I need to take more days off that start like this.

When you work Friday, Saturday, Sunday, it turns out Tuesday is MY Sunday brunch day!

The whole world is working and I’m drinking Sunday Stouts, neighbors I’m quite sure think I’m problematic

[Mike Maguire]

Popped the KBS espresso stout this am...wow Starbucks could sell this. Way too much espresso for me, but a decent day off morning drink I suppose

You’re my hero! I have no conscience now that I’m retired.

[Matt Allen]

I like the Christmas Bomb, but not as much as the Lagunitas Willitized. Also recently 4 Great Divide Yetis and the Gouden Carolus Noel.

[Mel Hill]

Nicely done DDH version of this beer.

[Andrew Kotowski]

Ft George Fields of Green (Nelson) - Bud would be happy

[Robert Pollard-Smith]

Modern Times is opening a new taproom near Lake Merritt in Oakland, The House of Perpetual Refreshment.

[Brian G r a f s t r o m]

ESBC/Device Brewing- "Dad Hat" IPA ---- a new collabo. In-school west coast IPA. Bright tangerine. 6.3% alc.. I like it.

Pizza Port - Swami's IPA --- this is still a regular in my fridge

MT - Mega Space Ways NEIIPA --- I like the big can, but, if I'm totally honest, I prefer the regular Space Ways more.

MT - Space Ways NEIPA --- this is my kind of NEIPA ---- light(er), with tons of white grapefruit, and none of that thick/sweet/soft palate that is typical of the style.

ESBC - Mayberry IPA ---- this is regularly in my fridge, too.

Founders - Porter --- remains in the conversation for my favorite American Porter

[C Chen]

Got lucky and stumbled upon a can release at Monkish Brewing. Maxed out on Backpack Full of Cans (hazy triple IPA w/ motueka, nelson, & citra) and Catchin' Keys (double dry hopped IPA w/ rakau, galaxy, & sabro).

Both are fantastic, but the edge goes to Backpack Full of Cans. Can't believe how creamy, smooth, and fruity it is for a triple. Not drinking hot at all.

[Mel Hill]

Xmas beer for making gingerbread houses

I like other ones better but this is the one we had in the house!

[Andrew Kotowski]

Popped a 2019 Deschutes Abyss tonight! Good, but needs a couple of years to settle down.

[Scott Tallman]

Zoiglhaus Pils and Wayfinder/Heater Allen/Modern Times Terrifica Pils before moving on to sparkling wine

[Scott Tallman]

that line up is from 2018 I'm sayin' Scott should repeat that for this year

Enjoy Munich!

Still often think about a lot of those amazing bottles... I got a cantillon to provide for the next one. Along with some other aged lambic "beauties"

I’m happy to host again (when Sheela’s our of town ), but also happy to visit Eastside if Mark or Andrew want to host.

I could Th, Jan 23 if that works for others.

[Rick Allen]

We got an email from someone who had a bad Bobtoberfest. Lisa wrote him back apologizing and suggesting that he check the date on the bottom of the package. It turned out that the Bobtoberfest in question was in a bottle, and we've been canning for the last nine months, meaning the bottle in question was well over a year old...

[Scott Tallman]

We got an email from someone who had a bad Bobtoberfest. Lisa wrote him back apologizing and suggesting that he check the date on the bottom of the package. It turned out that the Bobtoberfest in question was in a bottle, and we've been canning for the last nine months, meaning the bottle in question was well over a year old...

I’m glad you brought this up as touches on a subject I’ve become keenly interested in of late - how long past canning/bottle should beer be sold by retailers and breweries. Of course some beer styles can last longer than others, but as I’ve become hyper focused on canning and bottling date info when buying beer, I’ve been shocked at the age of beer I’ve found at both breweries and retailers (both grocery stores and specialty bottle shops).

I will no longer buy any hoppy beer if it’s date is more than a month out or if there is no date provided. Have had enough bad experiences with skunky/off old hoppy beers.

Not sure what the right cut off dates for lagers should be - preferably under 2 months is where I’ve come out for Pilsners, Helles, and other pale lagers. 3-4 months for amber lagers and under 6 months for dark stuff (knowing that some dark lagers can age gracefully well past that - like Sandy Paws).

I’ve had some recent 2 month old Pilsner cans (not Heater Allen) that tasted bad, while a different producer’s can of same age was great. During a recent Portland trip, bought some Pilsner cans direct from a brewery. Maybe because I’ve always bought super fresh cans direct, I did not even bother to check the canning date. Upon returning home, I discovered they were almost 4 months old. Fortunately, they weren’t bad, but we’re definitely a step down from the draft version.

A PortLand grocery store with a great beer selection had oceans of hoppy beers that were 4-6 months old! I would have bought some if they were fresher, but feel bad for the consumers who buy those beers and the breweries who may be written off by said consumers as a result.

Curious what the group thinks about canning/bottle date cut-offs, and whether breweries and retailers should do a better job of pulling DOA beers.

[Rick Allen]

Scott, your posts brings up a number of issues that are important for Craft Beer. I'll try to go through those that I find important below:

Provenance - I think this is the most important issue. The speed at which beer deteriorates doubles for every 10 degrees C increase in temperature. This means that beer stored at 50 F will age twice as beer stored at 32 F. Get temps into the 80s, like the back-stock conditions at many stores in the summertime, and your concern is real. While we can't refuse to sell beer to anyone, we don't reach out to those that we feel don't store their beer well.

Canning Dates - All beer should have a date stamp of when it was packaged. Don't give me a "best by" date (see above).

Bottles vs Cans - Cans are rapidly taking over the Craft world, and as much as I'd like it to be otherwise, this is a good thing. At one point in time the liners in cans were terrible. You could literally taste the liner in the beer after a couple of months. While cans have improved a lot, bottles haven't changed. They let light into the beer, which can cause skunkiness. They also leak - very slowly, but they do leak. A ten year old beer won't be as carbonated as at packaging, unless other funky things are going on in the bottle.

Filtering - Yeast is a natural anti-oxidant. Why would I want to filter that out of a beer? That said, after a year or so, the yeast will start to break down and can cause off flavors. In big dark beers this is part of the aging process.

[Scott Tallman]

Scott, your posts brings up a number of issues that are important for Craft Beer. I'll try to go through those that I find important below:

Provenance - I think this is the most important issue. The speed at which beer deteriorates doubles for every 10 degrees C increase in temperature. This means that beer stored at 50 F will age twice as beer stored at 32 F. Get temps into the 80s, like the back-stock conditions at many stores in the summertime, and your concern is real. While we can't refuse to sell beer to anyone, we don't reach out to those that we feel don't store their beer well.

Canning Dates - All beer should have a date stamp of when it was packaged. Don't give me a "best by" date (see above).

Bottles vs Cans - Cans are rapidly taking over the Craft world, and as much as I'd like it to be otherwise, this is a good thing. At one point in time the liners in cans were terrible. You could literally taste the liner in the beer after a couple of months. While cans have improved a lot, bottles haven't changed. They let light into the beer, which can cause skunkiness. They also leak - very slowly, but they do leak. A ten year old beer won't be as carbonated as at packaging, unless other funky things are going on in the bottle.

Filtering - Yeast is a natural anti-oxidant. Why would I want to filter that out of a beer? That said, after a year or so, the yeast will start to break down and can cause off flavors. In big dark beers this is part of the aging process.

Thanks for these points. As a consumer, the one that stands out to me is provenance. I can't control what happens to the beer before I buy it, but I store most of my beer in the fridge (much to Sheela's chagrin) save stouts and certain Belgian beers rather than the passive wine cellar. Has worked out fine thus far, but many folks I drink with store all their beers in passive basements and for certain beers it definitely shows!

[Andrew Kotowski]

Irony - sitting at the bar until 5:00ish at Modern Times in Portland... and Rick’s collab is on tap (smoked marzen)!

[Andrew Kotowski]

Couple of thoughts re: Scott/Rick’s post - I’m generally ok with an IPA that’s less than two months. Aside from the fact that it’s hard to find them stocked on shelves at a month or less (I’ve seen IPAs at Total Wine that were 9 months old), I just don’t see that big of a drop-off at 8 weeks. There’s a good video with the guy from the Alchemist where he talks about how IPAs age and then opens cans at different stages of age.

I got on the can train when Hopworks (HUB) started canning their IPAs. Felt like I was getting a more consistent product and they were easier to store or travel.

Re: temp - I had about $500 in BBA stouts in a garage fridge that died three weeks before I was going to sell them to a friend. I couldn’t, in good conscience, sell them... but I haven’t noticed a material difference drinking them three years later. I’m kinda glad I didn’t sell now

Funny story - I walked out of the house with an EMPTY wine case this AM, en route to Portland to hang out with a buddy for a few days. My wife was confused as to why I was bringing it... not realizing I needed it to bring bottles home

[Mark Y]

Funny story - I walked out of the house with an EMPTY wine case this AM, en route to Portland to hang out with a buddy for a few days. My wife was confused as to why I was bringing it... not realizing I needed it to bring bottles home TO SHARE

FIFY!

[Andrew Kotowski]

Rick’s pretty cans and, yes Mark, I’ll bring this and the goze nonsense back. Trying to make 1/23 work.

[Mark Y]

Rick’s pretty cans and, yes Mark, I’ll bring this and the goze nonsense back. Trying to make 1/23 work.

1/10 u mean? what's happening 1/23?

[Andrew Kotowski]

I saw 1/23 above; don’t know anything about 1/10.

[Scott Tallman]

Rick’s pretty cans and, yes Mark, I’ll bring this and the goze nonsense back. Trying to make 1/23 work.

1/10 u mean? what's happening 1/23?

He’s referring to my earlier post noting I could host a beer share on 1/23 if that works for others.

I assume I’ll see you at one or both of the FI pre-opening patties on 1/10 and 11 (I’ll attend both)?

[Mark Y]

Rick’s pretty cans and, yes Mark, I’ll bring this and the goze nonsense back. Trying to make 1/23 work.

1/10 u mean? what's happening 1/23?

He’s referring to my earlier post noting I could host a beer share on 1/23 if that works for others.

I assume I’ll see you at one or both of the FI pre-opening patties on 1/10 and 11 (I’ll attend both)?

Yes sir! Will be there sat for sure. Likely Friday as well!

[Mark Y]

I saw 1/23 above; don’t know anything about 1/10.

Check ur email!

[Brian G r a f s t r o m]

My cut-off for IPAs is usually 2 months, and that's the vast majority of beer I drink. Stouts and Porters --- I don't mind buying stuff that's months old, and -- in some cases -- I'd actually *rather* have some months on them already.

It's also *very* rare for me to buy a hoppy beer that doesn't have a bottling or canning date ---- I will sometimes buy one with a Best By date, if I'm familiar with that brewery's practice w/r/t how far out from canning/bottling they put their BB dates.