TNs: Chinon vs Saumur, Cabernet Franc from 1995 to 2010

TNs: Chinon vs Saumur, Cabernet Franc from 1995 to 2010

@Noreetuh NYC, July 28, 2021


While the wines that were devoured for this (mostly) head-to-head comparison may not constitute nor represent the totality of their respective appellations, the 10 Loire-heads that agreed to dine at NYC’s Noreetuh on a comfortable summer night, assembled and drank what would be, to my Loire-geek view, an epic collection of two of the region’s most iconic and noteworthy producers. I will not go into the specifics of the food, but suffice it to say that they were good complement, including the good service, in highlighting the superstars of the dinner and those would be the wines.

Wherever the vintage availability allowed, same-vintage wines were flighted to allow head-to-head comparisons that proved to be, at least to me, a most enlightening exercise. Otherwise, they were poured without flight partners.


Whites:

2005 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee Blanc, Chinon
Cool whiff of white fruit and that aged chenin. Rounded components of meyer lemon, ripe fruit, hint of pear, touch of hard candy and a long finish. Great starter. A-

2014 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee Blanc, Chinon
Premoxed


Reds:

2010 Clos Rougeard Les Poyeux, Saumur-Champigny
Youthful but with enough exuberance to highlight the silky texture, sweet red fruit, controlled level of fine tannin, and crisp acid. A-/B+

2010 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee, Chinon
Layered red fruit, a little angular, earthiness that complemented, oak, masculine. B+/B


2009 Clos Rougeard Les Poyeux, Saumur-Champigny
This kicked the 2010 version by a slight upward notch by providing more openings, excellent grip, smoothness, and very fine tannin. A-

2009 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee, Chinon
Herbaceous, combined with hints of stems added to the beautiful complexity of this wine. B+/A-


2008 Clos Rougeard Le Clos, Saumur-Champigny
Table reactions to this was quite unanimous in terms of the great balance, very fine drinkability and unabashed pleasure it provided. Terrific showing. A-


2007 Clos Rougeard Les Poyeux, Saumur-Champigny
Completeness. High acidity, broth and elegance. B+

2007 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee, Chinon
Corked


2006 Clos Rougeard Les Poyeux, Saumur-Champigny
The best from Saumur so far. Within the silky texture is precision with enough ripeness, earthiness, and forward-looking age-ability that can still further this beyond its current great drinking status. Darn, this was good. A/A-


2005 Clos Rougeard Les Poyeux, Saumur-Champigny
More tannic than I was expecting. But gives way to grace and elegance. B+

2005 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee, Chinon
Leanish on the fruit. Power, clean, a good classified Bordeaux comes to mind. B+

2005 Bernard Baudry Le Grezeaux, Chinon
One might argue, but in this flight, this registered the upset of the night. The power of a medium-to-big bodied serious Chinon, muscled, delicious acidity, herbs and pure Loire goodness all around. A-


2004 Clos Rougeard Les Poyeux, Saumur-Champigny
One word mote: complete. A

2004 Charles Joguet Les Varennes Franc de Pied, Chinon
With the unavailability of a Baudry, this ably filled in to reveal sweet fruitiness, a bit of spritz, and mainly good easy-drinking wine. B


2000 Bernard Baudry La Croix Boissee, Chinon
Expressive classic Loire bouquet. Youthfulness still quite evident, with lip-smacking acidity, layers upon layers of plump red and blue fruit, and very long finish. Hard to forget. A-


1997 Clos Rougeard Le Clos, Saumur-Champigny
Confection on the very appealing nose. Silky smooth with balance of everything one can want from a red wine. A fine Bordeaux right bank ringer. A-

1997 Bernard Baudry La Croiz Boissee, Chinon
Leather and perfumed fruit on the crazy good nose. Aged to gracefulness with a bits of excellent savory notes and inviting fruit components. A privilege to have tasted. A-


1996 Clos Rougeard Le Bourg, Saumur-Champigny
After the parade of terrific Poyeux and Le Clos that we’ve had so far, this hasn’t spoiled me one bit. Bigger, more masculine than any of the previous CRs. Meat broth, still with a bit of oak component, continuous cool ripe fruit. Length. B+/A-

1995 Clos Rougeard Le Bourg, Saumur-Champigny
Medium-bodied but still shares many traits with the 1996, but this with oak more integrated and fruit just a tad lessened to perfection, especially lively as the wine lingers in the mouth. One can argue, but my take is that there’s still room to get better with age. A-


The postponement of the dinner that we all agreed to do in order to pass off the multiple days of heatwave we experienced in late June did not diminish excitements as we moved the dinner 4 weeks later. It even help induce Faryan to fly in from Florida. As difficult as it is to enable a tasting of nothing but Loire Valley cabernet franc, I was not surprised that the generous attendees actually offered up more vintages than we lined up for the night, but which we agreed to limit so as not to overwhelm any more than necessary. A most fun dinner, with a most-enjoyable group and with wines from producers whose styles are, to me, so consistent in each vintage.

Thanks Ramon. What a great tasting. What I thought:

In late June we were supposed to have a Rougeard/Baudry dinner, but forecast was 97 and no one felt with 15-20 red wines. This Wednesday was more temperate, so I jumped on train with John and we headed to Noreetuh. 10 Loire fans gathers, Jin put together a fun menu:
shrimp chips
salmon rangoon
big-eye tuna poke
Musubi platter- lobster with coral aioli, Japanese scallop, sweet corn, fluke with ume
octopus/bacon skewers
Iberico pork belly skewers
pork bowl with cabbage, egg, and rice
imperial steak
mochiko fried chicken

Red wines were I think mostly double-decanted.

2005 Baudry “La Croix Boissee” Chinon Blanc
Fresh and young, like a nutty white Burg with some Chenin waxiness thrown in for fun. Nice length. B+

2014 Baudry “La Croix Boissee” Chinon Blanc
Some called premox, others (me) thought awkward stage. Nose is nutty and lifted and oxidative, but palate doesn’t have oxidative notes, just seems shut down. NR

The reds

2010 Clos Rougeard “Les Poyeaux” Saumur-Champigny
Young and tight and totally spicy oak-dominated at moment, but you can tell there is a potentially great wine underneath. B- for drinking now, probably an A-
2010 Baudry “La Croix Boissee” Chinon
Also pretty oaky at moment, also tight, also loads of potential.Again B- for drinking now, probably an A-

I didn’t enjoy either for now, but would happily own. Next flight more giving

2009 Clos Rougeard “Les Poyeaux” Saumur-Champigny
Oak more integrated, marvelous length. A-/B+
2009 Baudry “La Croix Boissee” Chinon
Again oak more integrated, still some chewy tannin, powerful, rich and long. . B+/A-


2008 Clos Rougeard “Les Clos” Saumur-Champigny
Tangy acids, rich fruit, no noticeable oak, long. A-

2007 Clos Rougeard “Les Clos” Saumur-Champigny
Smoky, black cherry and sandalwood, nicely integrated. B+/A-

2007 Baudry “La Croix Boissee” Chinon
Corked!

2006 Clos Rougeard “Les Poyeaux” Saumur-Champigny
Herby, delicious, in a nice place. A-

2005 Baudry “Les Grezeaux” Chinon
And in the overachiever of the night spotlight, the Grezeaux. Red fruit, herby, peppery, bright acid and long complex finish.with just a slight hint of animal fur. Stunner for the cost. A-

2005 Baudry“La Croix Boissee” Chinon
Spicy oak notes, rich, good length. B+
2005 Clos Rougeard “Les Poyeaux” Saumur-Champigny
Structured, tannic, but rich perfumed fruit. A-/B+
2004 Clos Rougeard “Les Poyeaux” Saumur-Champigny
Exotic, complex, complete, young but drinking beautifully. A-/A
2004 Joguet “Cuvee des Varennes ” Chinon Franc de Pied
As we didn’t have a 2004 Baudry, this was offered by John. Fun wine, structured, crunchy red fruit, tobacco, pine. Styled differently but quite fun. B+/B

2000 Baudry La Croix Boissee” Chinon
A bit like the ‘05, just in a lower key. Red fruit, herb, reminds me of a Cab Franc heavy Bdx.,. B+

1997 Clos Rougeard “Les Clos” Saumur-Champigny
Most ready of the Rougeards. Nice silky texture, bright fruits, resolved tannins. A-

1997 Baudry “La Croix Boissee” Chinon
Earthy, leathery, cranberry and black cherry., ready A-/B+

1996 Clos Rougeard “le Bourg”- Saumur-Champigny
Meaty, still structured, still needs time at 25 (though Don says more approachable than last time he had)
B+
1995 Clos Rougeard “le Bourg”- Saumur-Champigny

I actually didn’t write anything down (these were all phone notes) , but know my impression was very similar to the 1996.

With exception of the corked wine, everything was delicious. I don’t remember a big wine dinner with this much consistency in ages. Rougeard deserves all of its plaudits, but the Baudrys were able to easily hold their own, at a fraction of the price. I obviously need to expand my purchases (especially Grezeaux)

Great wines, great food, great company.

Grade disclaimer: I’m a very easy grader, basically A is an excellent wine, B a good wine, C
drinkable. Anything below C means I wouldn’t drink at a party where it was only choice.Furthermore, I offer no promises of objectivity, accuracy, and certainly not of consistency.

(edited 8/2 because of a bottling error)

Bravo all around for the wines and for the guests. Very cool lineup and write-ups. Some flops, but a lot of solids and even wows. I enjoyed reading about your get together. Thanks for posting. Cheers.

Killer wines. I love Grezeaux and have bottles back to ‘02. Appreciate the note on the ‘05 as I haven’t touched any of mine yet. Wonder how the ‘09 Grezeaux is doing? Tempted to try one. Thanks for writing up.

#speechless

This is next level stuff. I’m happy for you and jealous.

Ramon lowballed the epicness of this outing with the headline.
For the best; will keep the lurkers away.

Shoutout to Tim O’Rourke for turning DC wine geeks on to Rougeard back when it was under the radar. Brings to mind my folly for only taking a handful of bottles when he sourced some mid 2000s Poyeux/Bourg for what now are stupid prices.

Shoutout to Salil Benegal who opened 2005 Baudry Grezeaux like 7 years ago, which summarily smoked a 70s Haut Brion. That night made it crystal clear for why said producer should (and would) be the biggest holding in my cellar. Even better showing at this dinner.

I personally thought a few of the wines were profound (solid OHYEAH territory for moi), namely the 95 and 96 Rougeards (the pair of 97s were lovely as well), but if you have experienced Ramon and Dale’s notes, you get a sense for how strict they are with the grades (no gentlemans Cs here).

Unbelievable lineup. Wow.

Geeze, this is a great tasting. And the reason we don’t buy quantities of Loire cab Franc is what?

Well done!

Epic. Thanks for posting this.

I’m curious about the ‘09 Grezeaux, too.

The Baudry wines showed so well in our dinner that I’m tempted to re-load on past vintages if/when I find at reasonable prices. Grezeaux or LCB.

I had the 2009 Grezeaux almost exactly 2 years ago, and still noted “grippy” tannins.

Wow, Ramon, you did it, because Robert has never lacked for words before.

Haha, ‘twas a figure of speech! I was dropping big expletives, especially since my invite apparently got lost in the ether-space!

I thought we scattered enough interest-gauging send-outs already, but were met with chirping crickets. Would have been an honor to have the Lord of Loire grace our little gathering in the East Village.

Ha, I’m but a Poseur compared to y’all!

Would have loved to have seen a 2005 Joguet in that line-up, especially the Franc de Pied, but the Chene Vert would have been cool too. Dioterie probably too large-scaled but it’s been years since I cracked one. I do like that 2004 Franc de Pied but I can see where it may not have the additional gear for the line-up that you had.

I was tempted to bring a 2005 Rougeard Les Poyeaux to a function in October, but these notes convince me to sit longer on them.

There are two wines in hindsight that I immensely regret not buying more: Rougeard and Allemand. And now both priced accordingly.

Just out of curiosity, does Noreetuh generally support BYOB possibilities in any way, or was this a one-off accommodation (presumably based on a large event with a unique line-up of this caliber)?

Generally very good about BYO. I’ve been to 10+ wine events there, and on child’s 30th I took couple 1988s for our family. I think normal corkage (for family event) was $25/bottle (3 years ago, unsure about now). Bigger events we negotiate. And I think Sundays are still no corkage.

Wow, what a great line-up. I wish that my helicopter could have landed me in NYC for that dinner… I might have to do a Southern version of this.

Really interesting. My Croix Boissée Blanc 2005 is long gone as I didn’t expect it to make old bones. Sounds like I was wrong. I didn’t have many bottles of 2014 and those are gone as well. I hope that premox doesn’t become a pervasive issue with Loire Chenin.

I’ve yet to tap into any 2010 Rougeard, but the last 2010 Croix Boissée I had was really good. I didn’t get any oak notes but I did get that driving CB chalkiness.

Again, I haven’t cracked my 2009 Rougeards yet but 2009 Croix Boissée was fantastic, one of the best versions of this wine (although maybe surpassed by 2014). The tension between the generous fruit and the crystalline structure is perfectly poised.

Too bad about the corked wine. I haven’t had any of these 2007s in 4 years, so thanks for the notes. I’ll put some in the queue.

2006, like 2004, has been drinking great, the Brézé as well.

2005 Poyeux is a tough one. I’m not sure how to project when it will come around but it doesn’t lack for depth or intensity. The 2005 Croix Boissée is great, but my bottles of 2005 Grézeaux have seemed drying to me. This vintage was surreal for many Loire winemakers as the analytics of the grapes was unheard of in terms of potential alcohol, tannins, and concentration. They’ve obviously figured a lot of those things out with their experience farming in a changing climate, but I liked that Grézeaux when it was young and boisterous. Like me, it hasn’t aged gracefully.

2004s from Rougeard have been great for a long time and don’t seem to ever be fully shut down. 2004 is usually cheaper than surrounding vintages, so this is the one that gives the most value.

These are wines with which I have no record or memory, although I’m sure I’ve had that CB and Rougeard at some point. Thanks for the notes.

This is a memorable wine for me as I opened it, as one of a series of last bottles of LDM wines, the week Joe died. It was great then and I’m happy to see it’s still great.

I’m sitting on singles of these so thanks for the notes.