Burgundy's New Generation

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Burgundy's New Generation

#1 Post by Mattstolz »

A few things recently have brought to my attention how some of my favorite Burgundy Domaines are starting to move to the next generation of winemakers. Most recently, a Jasper Morris podcast from a few months ago and a La Paulee event featuring some of those new faces:

The Lafarge sisters, Thibault Clerget, the Mugneret sisters, Lea and Pierre Lafon, Laurene Boss at Drouhin, Ghislaine's son at Barthod [AND and Boillot] just to name a few!

I'm really curious to hear anything anyone knows about other current transitions that are happening and how people are viewing (looking forward to or not?!) these transitions. some of these producers are board stalwarts and favorites. some of this generation has been at the domaine their whole lives and some are brand new to it! any standouts or people everyone's especially excited about?

im also a little curious, because none of my favorite producers have transitioned to new leaders during the time I'm buying their wine: does anything tend to happen to prices during or after the transition?

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#2 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng »

Alix Millot
Charles Lachaux
Amelie Berthaut

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#3 Post by Mattstolz »

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 4:46 pm Alix Millot
Charles Lachaux
Amelie Berthaut
ive been seeing Charles Lachaux pop up a lot recently on social media (the most recent on Thibault Clerget's page!). is he associated with Arnoux-Lachaux or totally apart?

Amelie Berthaut is very talented. how recently did she take over?

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#4 Post by Howard Cooper »

Charles van Canneyt at Hudelot-Noellat (started in 2008) but is still only around 32.
Guillaume d'Angerville
Jeremy Seysses (Dujac)
Armand Heitz (took over domaine that used to lease land to Drouhin)
Last edited by Howard Cooper on February 22nd, 2021, 5:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#5 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng »

Mattstolz wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:12 pm
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 4:46 pm Alix Millot
Charles Lachaux
Amelie Berthaut
ive been seeing Charles Lachaux pop up a lot recently on social media (the most recent on Thibault Clerget's page!). is he associated with Arnoux-Lachaux or totally apart?

Amelie Berthaut is very talented. how recently did she take over?
He’s the wine maker for arnoux-lachaux.

Others:

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#6 Post by Mattstolz »

Howard Cooper wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:26 pm Charles van Canneyt at Hudelot-Noellat (started in 2008) but is still only around 32.
Guillaume d'Angerville
Jeremy Seysses (Dujac)
Armand Heitz (took over domaine that used to lease land to Drouhin)
I didn't realize van Canneyt was so young! also, is the ELDER d'Angerville was also named Guillaume, correct? I'm a big fan of Jeremy Seysses. All three of those took over pretty famous wineries just before I started getting really into wine... it doesnt really seem like prices of Dujac, d'Angerville, or Hudelot took hits when they changed hands, did they?

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#7 Post by R. Frankel »

This list is going to get pretty big pretty fast. The delightful thing about this trend is not just that Mom/Dad (well mostly Dad in Burgundy) is getting old and the kids are taking over - but that it is happening so much all over the wine world. Piedmont, Tuscany, Burgundy, Mosel (Germany) are all seeing lots of young folks coming back to the farm and being eager to learn and help out. This is a huge change from 30-40 years ago when the kids were much more likely to move away and seek careers in other fields. As much as we bemoan increasing prices, these same increases are making wine production a much more attractive career.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#8 Post by Mattstolz »

R. Frankel wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:43 pm This list is going to get pretty big pretty fast. The delightful thing about this trend is not just that Mom/Dad (well mostly Dad in Burgundy) is getting old and the kids are taking over - but that it is happening so much all over the wine world. Piedmont, Tuscany, Burgundy, Mosel (Germany) are all seeing lots of young folks coming back to the farm and being eager to learn and help out. This is a huge change from 30-40 years ago when the kids were much more likely to move away and seek careers in other fields. As much as we bemoan increasing prices, these same increases are making wine production a much more attractive career.
I'm fine with this being a long list. This new generation of winemakers is about my age, so it is likely that most of my wine drinking career will be supporting them and buying their wines! Burgundy is a great place to start with this list because the family element is so strong even in the big companies like Drouhin and Faiveley. but you're right, and the fact that you are I think makes this a very interesting conversation. there are a lot of giants of the wine world who are starting to hand off the reigns!

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#9 Post by Howard Cooper »

Mattstolz wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:39 pm
Howard Cooper wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:26 pm Charles van Canneyt at Hudelot-Noellat (started in 2008) but is still only around 32.
Guillaume d'Angerville
Jeremy Seysses (Dujac)
Armand Heitz (took over domaine that used to lease land to Drouhin)
I didn't realize van Canneyt was so young! also, is the ELDER d'Angerville was also named Guillaume, correct? I'm a big fan of Jeremy Seysses. All three of those took over pretty famous wineries just before I started getting really into wine... it doesnt really seem like prices of Dujac, d'Angerville, or Hudelot took hits when they changed hands, did they?
The older d’Angerville was Jacques I believe.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#10 Post by C. Mc Cart »

If you listened to Jasper's 'new generation' zoom, then you know he also mentioned that this isn't a unique place in time. With over 400 domaines in Burgundy this is happening constantly. Every year there's a transition happening at several if not dozens of domaines.

If memory serves - Amelie Berthaut started to take over winemaking at both her father's & her Mother's family (Gerbet) holdings and put together the new hyphenated domaine in 2013. My limited understanding is the transition was short vs many others where the older generation stays on for years & years continuing to influence and assist.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#11 Post by Mattstolz »

C. Mc Cart wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 6:55 pm If you listened to Jasper's 'new generation' zoom, then you know he also mentioned that this isn't a unique place in time. With over 400 domaines in Burgundy this is happening constantly. Every year there's a transition happening at several if not dozens of domaines.

If memory serves - Amelie Berthaut started to take over winemaking at both her father's & her Mother's family (Gerbet) holdings and put together the new hyphenated domaine in 2013. My limited understanding is the transition was short vs many others where the older generation stays on for years & years continuing to influence and assist.
I had to slow down my listening when it got to Barthod because it was so hard to understand what he was saying. but your point (and Jaspers) are still true. I dont think it makes it less interesting to look at how the transitions happen differently at different domaines and between different generations!

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#12 Post by William Kelley »

Howard Cooper wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:26 pm Guillaume d'Angerville
Jeremy Seysses (Dujac)
According to WS's obituary for his father, Guillaume was 47 in 2003, meaning he is 65 this year!

Jeremy Seysses was born in 1975 and this is his 20th year making the Dujac wines.

I think including them in the "new generation", therefore, is testimony to how Burgundy's wines can mitigate the effects of the passage of the years champagne.gif
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#13 Post by Howard Cooper »

William Kelley wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 6:33 am
Howard Cooper wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:26 pm Guillaume d'Angerville
Jeremy Seysses (Dujac)
According to WS's obituary for his father, Guillaume was 47 in 2003, meaning he is 65 this year!

Jeremy Seysses was born in 1975 and this is his 20th year making the Dujac wines.

I think including them in the "new generation", therefore, is testimony to how Burgundy's wines can mitigate the effects of the passage of the years champagne.gif
I thought they were relevant to any discussion of how changes in generations impact pricing - in these cases, not much. Prices have gone up over time, but pretty much consistently with other higher end Burgundy producers.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#14 Post by dcornutt »

Lucie Coutoux granddaughter of Michel Niellon (RIP) of Domaine Michel Niellon. There are some extraordinary wines coming out of this address. She is the new guard.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#15 Post by Nathan V. »

I'm most curious about Clément Barthod-Boillot. What an incredible array of 1er Cru at a single address (as well as Beaujolais). As much as I love the Barthod and Boillot wines (I've been buying Barthod since the 1995 vintage) if they could have a touch less austerity in their youth, that would be great.

In a perfect world, everything would be like Mugneret-Gibourg, delicious whenever you choose to open them.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#16 Post by YLee »

Pierre Duroche took full control I believe in 2009. Not sure if this is considered as "new generation".
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#17 Post by William Kelley »

YLee wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 9:12 am Pierre Duroche took full control I believe in 2009. Not sure if this is considered as "new generation".
I would say that he is pretty well established by now: above all, he is making the wines he wants to make, and has progressed piece by piece to the point that you could say he has a "mature style", even if he still has plenty of projects to carry out. Pierre is 1982 vintage, the same as Raphaël Coche. There are a few others around that age, e.g. Loïc Dugat-Py, Bertrand Dugat, Arnaud Mortet, who are also very well established now as they approach their 40th birthdays.

The domaines that are going through a transition right now, or are about to go through a transition soon, are often those that last went through a transition in the early 1980s. The premise of the thread is quite correct in that many of those estates are what might be considered "leading domaines", so Burgundy's familiar dramatis personae is going to suddenly look very different in just a few more years.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#18 Post by Howard Cooper »

In many domaines, the transition period is something like 20 years and by the older generation is no longer involved, a third generation is coming up.

Of the transitions listed above, how many are more abrupt? I can think of Thibault Clerget and Charles Van Canneyt, but are there others?
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#19 Post by Howard Cooper »

dcornutt wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 8:50 am Lucie Coutoux granddaughter of Michel Niellon (RIP) of Domaine Michel Niellon. There are some extraordinary wines coming out of this address. She is the new guard.
When did she take over and have the wines changed?
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#20 Post by Howard Cooper »

Mattstolz wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:47 pm
R. Frankel wrote: February 22nd, 2021, 5:43 pm This list is going to get pretty big pretty fast. The delightful thing about this trend is not just that Mom/Dad (well mostly Dad in Burgundy) is getting old and the kids are taking over - but that it is happening so much all over the wine world. Piedmont, Tuscany, Burgundy, Mosel (Germany) are all seeing lots of young folks coming back to the farm and being eager to learn and help out. This is a huge change from 30-40 years ago when the kids were much more likely to move away and seek careers in other fields. As much as we bemoan increasing prices, these same increases are making wine production a much more attractive career.
I'm fine with this being a long list. This new generation of winemakers is about my age, so it is likely that most of my wine drinking career will be supporting them and buying their wines! Burgundy is a great place to start with this list because the family element is so strong even in the big companies like Drouhin and Faiveley. but you're right, and the fact that you are I think makes this a very interesting conversation. there are a lot of giants of the wine world who are starting to hand off the reigns!
There are also some new domaines floating around. I mentioned Armand Heitz and Heitz Lochardet above, and another one to look at starting pretty much from scratch is Maison MC Thiriet. Have only had regional wines from them but they seem like one to watch. http://grandcruselections.com/maison-mc-thiriet
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#21 Post by Russell Faulkner »

This is an interesting approach. But of course there are quite a lot of ‘new generation’ producers who didn’t (on the whole) inherit the vines and are doing something exciting.

I’d include
Antoine Petitprez
Noe
Santini
Dandelion
Grappin
Marthe Henry Boillot
Horees


(We will sell these wines in Bordeaux because we are excited about them).
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#22 Post by dcornutt »

Howard Cooper wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 9:36 am
dcornutt wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 8:50 am Lucie Coutoux granddaughter of Michel Niellon (RIP) of Domaine Michel Niellon. There are some extraordinary wines coming out of this address. She is the new guard.
When did she take over and have the wines changed?
Her father, Michel Coutoux, is still in charge I guess but she is very much now the winemaker if my info is correct. Michel Coutoux is the son in law married to Michel Niellon's daughter. Lucie is his daughter. He has been making the wines for several years. Not sure of the exact year Lucie became extremely involved. It was recent. I know she made the 2017s if I am correct. They are a brilliant set of wines. The 2018s are not far off. They are still that ultra pure style. Very mineral. I think they are even better than her father or grandfather.

William Kelley knows Msr. Coutoux very well I think. He might be able to tell us the exact year she really took the reins.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#23 Post by Kelly Walker »

Raphaël Coche has some pretty big shoes to fill. Some say the wines are changing but I love his results.

Alexandre Bernier replaced Bernard Noblet at DRC a couple of years ago. The results will be followed closely for sure.

Jean-Baptiste Bouzereau at Michel Bouzereau has been making the wine for 20 years but he has transformed that Domaine into one of the very best producers.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#24 Post by Mattstolz »

William Kelley wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 6:33 am According to WS's obituary for his father, Guillaume was 47 in 2003, meaning he is 65 this year!

Jeremy Seysses was born in 1975 and this is his 20th year making the Dujac wines.

I think including them in the "new generation", therefore, is testimony to how Burgundy's wines can mitigate the effects of the passage of the years champagne.gif
I honestly did not realize Jeremy has been involved that long. That is part of why I think that really works so well, and why I love this conversation about Burgundy as opposed to Bordeaux or many others. Like Howard mentioned, by time the grandfather (or mother) is done teaching, it is almost the grandson (or daughters) turn to start learning! I love that.
Nathan V. wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 8:56 am I'm most curious about Clément Barthod-Boillot. What an incredible array of 1er Cru at a single address (as well as Beaujolais). As much as I love the Barthod and Boillot wines (I've been buying Barthod since the 1995 vintage) if they could have a touch less austerity in their youth, that would be great.

In a perfect world, everything would be like Mugneret-Gibourg, delicious whenever you choose to open them.
I was so frustrated during the Inside Burgundy call with him because I was so interested to hear what his approach would be, and even the other winemakers on the call mentioned not being able to understand him! was such a shame to not get an idea of if he would merge styles or change any approaches. William, any chance you can shed any light on his approach?
William Kelley wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 9:18 am
I would say that he is pretty well established by now: above all, he is making the wines he wants to make, and has progressed piece by piece to the point that you could say he has a "mature style", even if he still has plenty of projects to carry out. Pierre is 1982 vintage, the same as Raphaël Coche. There are a few others around that age, e.g. Loïc Dugat-Py, Bertrand Dugat, Arnaud Mortet, who are also very well established now as they approach their 40th birthdays.

The domaines that are going through a transition right now, or are about to go through a transition soon, are often those that last went through a transition in the early 1980s. The premise of the thread is quite correct in that many of those estates are what might be considered "leading domaines", so Burgundy's familiar dramatis personae is going to suddenly look very different in just a few more years.
do you know much about how some of the personalities and domaines mentioned thus far are approaching the transition? at addresses like Lafon, Mugneret Girbourg, Barthod, Boillot, Drouhin, etc, are the older generations planning on spending a lot of time sharing their knowledge or just handing the domaines off and traveling the world?
Russell Faulkner wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 10:09 am This is an interesting approach. But of course there are quite a lot of ‘new generation’ producers who didn’t (on the whole) inherit the vines and are doing something exciting.

I’d include
Antoine Petitprez
Noe
Santini
Dandelion
Grappin
Marthe Henry Boillot
Horees


(We will sell these wines in Bordeaux because we are excited about them).
I'm gonna have to start doing some digging on those! thanks for the post!

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#25 Post by Howard Cooper »

Mattstolz wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 5:26 pm
William Kelley wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 6:33 am According to WS's obituary for his father, Guillaume was 47 in 2003, meaning he is 65 this year!

Jeremy Seysses was born in 1975 and this is his 20th year making the Dujac wines.

I think including them in the "new generation", therefore, is testimony to how Burgundy's wines can mitigate the effects of the passage of the years champagne.gif
I honestly did not realize Jeremy has been involved that long. That is part of why I think that really works so well, and why I love this conversation about Burgundy as opposed to Bordeaux or many others. Like Howard mentioned, by time the grandfather (or mother) is done teaching, it is almost the grandson (or daughters) turn to start learning! I love that.

Yep. A lot of people find Burgundy confusing because of all the similar names. But, this just means they are people and not banks or insurance companies. Like you, I love it. Nothing in the world like going to winery whether in Burgundy, Alsace, Bandol or wherever and getting to meet family members involved in growing the grapes and making the wines. Adds about 5 points to any wine I drink from anywhere if I have visited the winery and have been hosted by the owners. 10 points if it is from Truchot or Dublere.
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#26 Post by Brady Daniels »

Howard Cooper wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 5:33 pm
Nothing in the world like going to winery whether in Burgundy, Alsace, Bandol or wherever and getting to meet family members involved in growing the grapes and making the wines. Adds about 5 points to any wine I drink from anywhere if I have visited the winery and have been hosted by the owners. 10 points if it is from Truchot or Dublere.
I mostly agree with this. I’d only add that visits that are indifferent or worse don’t evoke that same nostalgic feeling that makes mines more enjoyable. And yes, I’ve had a few, even in Burgundy. But they are definitely the exception.

Also, I’m sad I never met Jackie Truchot. Loved his wines and I’m sure it would have been magical. I didn’t visit Burgundy until after he retired. Maybe I should have leaned on Henri Jouan to arrange a meeting. (I’m kidding, I’m not that entitled.)
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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#27 Post by Mattstolz »

Brady Daniels wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 6:17 pm
Howard Cooper wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 5:33 pm
Nothing in the world like going to winery whether in Burgundy, Alsace, Bandol or wherever and getting to meet family members involved in growing the grapes and making the wines. Adds about 5 points to any wine I drink from anywhere if I have visited the winery and have been hosted by the owners. 10 points if it is from Truchot or Dublere.
I mostly agree with this. I’d only add that visits that are indifferent or worse don’t evoke that same nostalgic feeling that makes mines more enjoyable. And yes, I’ve had a few, even in Burgundy. But they are definitely the exception.

Also, I’m sad I never met Jackie Truchot. Loved his wines and I’m sure it would have been magical. I didn’t visit Burgundy until after he retired. Maybe I should have leaned on Henri Jouan to arrange a meeting. (I’m kidding, I’m not that entitled.)
speaking of Jouan, how many years has he been at the helm now? I always group him and Bertheau in the same thought for some reason.

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Re: Burgundy's New Generation

#28 Post by Brady Daniels »

Mattstolz wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 6:24 pm
Brady Daniels wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 6:17 pm
Howard Cooper wrote: February 23rd, 2021, 5:33 pm
Nothing in the world like going to winery whether in Burgundy, Alsace, Bandol or wherever and getting to meet family members involved in growing the grapes and making the wines. Adds about 5 points to any wine I drink from anywhere if I have visited the winery and have been hosted by the owners. 10 points if it is from Truchot or Dublere.
I mostly agree with this. I’d only add that visits that are indifferent or worse don’t evoke that same nostalgic feeling that makes mines more enjoyable. And yes, I’ve had a few, even in Burgundy. But they are definitely the exception.

Also, I’m sad I never met Jackie Truchot. Loved his wines and I’m sure it would have been magical. I didn’t visit Burgundy until after he retired. Maybe I should have leaned on Henri Jouan to arrange a meeting. (I’m kidding, I’m not that entitled.)
speaking of Jouan, how many years has he been at the helm now? I always group him and Bertheau in the same thought for some reason.
Philippe supposedly took over in 2005. But Henri doesn’t really agree with this assessment. [snort.gif]
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