Opened and tasted a couple of F Alessandria Barolos (nórmale and San Lorenzo) in preparation for tomorrow’s Osso Buco and risotto Milanese. Moved on to sushi and decided to open a 2002 Domaine de l’Ecu Expression Gneiss.
Full straw color. Expressive nose. There’s some stoney minerality, lanolin, lemon curd, green almond, and chamomile. Like a hypothetical cross of 2/3 Chablis and 1/3 Vouvray. Full honeyed mouthfeel. Quite rich, actually. The acidity has integrated nicely — it’s balanced. Not showing its age at all. This is much more interesting than it was 15 years ago. I have one more bottle and, while unlikely to improve, I’ll hold it a few more years as an experiment. There’s still a lot of stuffing and structure here.
I’m always surprised how well these stranded bottles of Muscadet age…
Some time in the mid 2000s, a local retailer where I was living at the time offered me some randomly assorted older bottles (all between 10 and 20 years old, speaking from memory) of Claude Branger’s Gras Moutons. Being a fan of Claude Branger, well, nothing to lose, I reckoned, bought the whole lot for a song. These were the first bottles that totally changed my perception of Muscadet (probably only applies to those from truly outstanding producers, but what do I know…). This was followed over the years by many absolutely stunning aged bottles (and some magnums) by Vincent Caille’, Guy Bossard, Jo Landron, and others. Some producers like Luneau-Papin occasionally offer late-release vintages that are 15 or more years old. Aged Muscadet can be amazing and entirely unique.
Since they don’t see oak and have no residual sugar, I don’t totally disagree, but I do find they pick up a more waxy character and the fruits go a bit more yellow while there tends to be an almond skin note, while the lemon or lime tends to become secondary vs. primary note.
I have a random mag of 1976 Sauvion Sevre et Maine Muscadet made by Pierre’s father. Need to open it.
About seven or eight years ago, I bought several 1999 and 2002 Luneau-Papin Le “L” d’Or from Chambers. Those were still youthful. I agree, they get that waxy lanolin notes like you see with Chenin Blanc.
I like stashing some of these, although my usual preference is the fresh crispness of younger vintages. I have a lot of muscadet in the cellar, the oldest 2010, predominantly Pépière (mostly Briords) and Luneau-Papin (Butte de la Roche, and L d’Or).
I haven’t had a l’Ecu in years, and I’ve never seen a Branger. I’ll have to remedy that.
I wish there were more Muscadet threads here. Thanks all for posting
I generally agree with both of you. However, this particular bottling has picked up a honeyed note and it is much rounder and fuller than it ever was in its first few years. So, I do think they vary a bit in what happens to them as they get older.
I tried aging some Briords. They age just fine. I just didn’t think they really got better. They didn’t really go downward. Just became different. I prefer the mineral showcase they are when younger so I’m not aging them any longer. That richer character they take is certainly interesting in it’s own right. I just didn’t see that uptick in complexity or character you get with say a good Chardonnay.
Yeah, it’s the difference between aging and surviving, I suppose. I probably have a half dozen bottles of various Muscadets from around 2002. I need to work through them.
I would respectfully disagree on “doesn’t seem to change that much” and “tends not to become more complex”. The way I see it, the best ones actually do change and become more complex. I think the question is more “change - how exactly?” and “more complex - in what way and to what extent”. It’s also a question of what yardstick we’re applying for “complexity”. No Luneau-Papin will magically transform into a Corton-Charlemagne/name your own reference, if you just give it twenty years… Muscadet isn’t Chardonnay/Riesling/Chenin Blanc etc., it exists for a different reason and, even as it ages, serves a different purpose, I thought that was obvious.
I’m not sure of your point but since you are addressing me I suppose I need to respond. I never claimed to expect them to suddenly be Corton Charley. The point of aging wine for me is for them to get better. That is, while they might be fine when young I expect they will get to a place where I will enjoy them more. I tried aging some fav Muscadet and found they did not get to a place where they were better than they are when young. Just different. A wine can change while not getting better or worse. Muscadet is a prime example of that to me. The fresher, bright more mineral thing they are when young is better to me than the richer, secondary thing they become. I don’t find the secondary phase to be more enjoyable than the primary zone they are in their first few years of existence.
The best wines made from Chardonnay, for example, tend to get better if for nothing else they need time to open. Plus, they tend to gain complexity while often carrying those youthful characters along for the ride. I’ve found I enjoy these wines more with time.
I still buy Muscadet. I’ve bored some friends talking about it and putting it front of them. I find it can be one of the great values in the wine world. I just think they are best closer to release than they are under the gaze of time.
I have a few cases of Muscadet in the cellar, the majority dated 1997 to 2004, so I’ve taken a position on the aging question. Good young; good old (but different, evolved). They don’t always age gracefully but a few like Luneau-Papin Semper Excelsior desperately need age. The 2002 Excelsior is still not really ready but getting there.
I wasn’t actually addressing you specifically, sorry if it came across that way. Rather, I was trying to address some salient points that I had gleaned from the discussion in this thread. Nonetheless, thank you for a reasoned and interesting post.
I’ve probably done a very poor job explaining my point, you’re quite right about that . Let me have another go. To me Muscadet is a food wine, almost par excellence. I’ve spent nearly half my life in countries where the seafood culture, specifically, is very close to Muscadet’s original “cultural” setting. So much so, in fact, that the primary ingredients are very often sourced from the same places. I have also spent a fair amount of time along the coast in Normandy, Brittany, and indeed the Nantais itself.
Now, of course, great Muscadet covers a much broader culinary range than this, but, just for simplicity’s sake… let’s assume I have a platter of freshly shucked Gillardeau oysters right in front of me. My choice is to go with a fresh vintage of, say, Clos de Briords or with a 20-year-old Vincent Caille’ (and I’ve done both, often over a single meal). To me, picking a fresh top-notch Muscadet, delivering tons of primary salinity, brine, bilge water and what have you, is more about a kind of really powerful head-on impact, and the result can be fantastic. Now, in my world, pairing this same platter with a great aged Muscadet often delivers a synergy that is both much “sneakier”, less obvious, and somehow much more profound and multi-layered at the same time. A bit more “meditational”, if you like. Hence, the complexity.
But, as you and some others, I think, seem to suggest, most of this is purely a matter of personal terminology and, ultimately, a matter of taste.
Nice discussion, though. Thank you!
My limited experience with aging Muscadet (and, to be fair, I don’t think I’ve ever seen a bottle at even 20 yo) has been mixed. For the most part, my experience mirrors Cris’s. However, I’ve had a couple that seemed to have that “aged magic.” I’ve some Briords I’ve socked-away, so I’ll see how that goes.
. Let me have another go. To me Muscadet is a food wine, almost par excellence. I’ve spent nearly half my life in countries where the seafood culture, specifically, is very close to Muscadet’s original “cultural” setting. So much so, in fact, that the primary ingredients are very often sourced from the same places. I have also spent a fair amount of time along the coast in Normandy, Brittany, and indeed the Nantais itself.![[cheers.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/0ff9bfcdb0964982cd3240b6159868fbdf215b1a.gif "cheers"){kind=small}