The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

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D@ve D y r 0 f f
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#801 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » June 24th, 2020, 5:14 am

Mattstolz wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 3:32 am

ah I get you. I still think as a buyer, prior to last year, you were hedging against a possible tariff by buying the 2017s, and the retailer was taking that risk, because as a buyer I had locked in MY price. this year its a totally different ballgame because the opposite has happened where retailers have contingencies in the contracts in case of possible tariffs. I see where you're coming from, I think we're just saying it slightly differently maybe. haha. (for the record, my 2017 futures were with Total, so they DID try to pass that risk off on me, and I cancelled them because I disagreed with that based on my same thinking. the contract at that point didn't say anything about it so I thought that should have been on them at that time)
I agree that prior to last year, as a buyer, you were locking in your price and the retailer - not you - was taking the tariff risk. And I think TW should have honored the price rather than just giving you the choice to pay up or cancel.

But again, protecting yourself by shifting the risk to the retailer (or them protecting themselves by shifting it to you) is not the same thing as eliminating the risk for everyone in the supply chain by using deal structure or hedging to lock everyone's cost in. My original point that you quoted a post or two ago was that almost everything that might change the price - currency rates, shipping costs, storage costs, and of course the price everyone up and down the chain is willing to pay/accept for the wine itself, can be locked in/hedged so that the risk for EVERYONE of those costs changing between 2020 and 2022 is eliminated, but tariffs are the exception and there is no way to lock them in or hedge them. So SOMEONE has to bear the risk of having to pay more than originally contemplated to cover any new or increased tariff, without knowing two years in advance what that tariff will be.
Last edited by D@ve D y r 0 f f on June 24th, 2020, 5:22 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#802 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » June 24th, 2020, 5:20 am

C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:51 am
JonathanG wrote:
June 23rd, 2020, 10:40 pm
D@ve D y r 0 f f wrote:
June 23rd, 2020, 8:54 pm
With today's clauses, the inability to lock in the tariff and eliminate the risk is the same, but now all the retailers' terms seem to allocate the risk to the consumer.
I posted way back in this thread a comparison of a few T&C's. I bought all my futures from Millesima, who did not change their T&Cs to charge tariffs, and who will store the wine in France for free until the tariff goes away (optimistic on their part, I'd say), and from wine.com, who also didnt change T&C and who, although they didn't explitly say it, will likely be doing the same as Millesima. Compared to K&L who said they will charge.
I don’t know if that’s entirely true. Millesima doesn’t sound like a free lunch. Direct text from Millesima:

“ Our current prices are shown before taxes and tariffs. Any Futures and Pre-Arrival orders may be subject to the collection of additional tariffs. Additional tariffs will be based on the date of importation. We will offer free storage in our professional wine cellar in Bordeaux in the event of any importation delays.”

Meanwhile, here’s the direct text from K&L:

PLEASE NOTE: 2019 Bordeaux Futures are being offered without any added tariffs. If there are applicable tariffs at the time the wines are imported in 2022, we will contact you with the option to pay tariffs to have the wine delivered, or cancel the order with no penalty.

I’d say K&L is offering a more than friendly approach, especially when some retailers are doing final sale before we know the final tariff costs (if any).
Also, wine.com also said explicitly that their price is pre-tariff, though they don't explicitly say what happens if the tariff is still in place, it's pretty clear that they're not just going to eat it and deliver at the "tariffs not included price" if it's still there:

*Please note that the price on Wine.com of this 2019 Bordeaux Future does not include any tariffs. As of June 2020, there remains a 25% tariff imposed on French wines at or below 14% Alcohol-by-Volume by the U.S. and approved by the World Trade Organization related to the Airbus/Boeing dispute. We are hopeful that this is a short-term tariff which will not be in place when the wine is ready to be imported into the U.S., as Bordeaux Futures typically ship 2-years after they are offered. Should tariffs still be in effect when the wine is ready to be imported, we will contact affected customers with an update to our plans and timing.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#803 Post by Vince T » June 24th, 2020, 6:29 am

Back to wine...

Anyone else pick up Carmes? $90 is a pretty good price, although most big outlets running at $100.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#804 Post by Sc0tt F!tzger@ld » June 24th, 2020, 6:58 am

Ducru sold out on TW.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#805 Post by Br1an Th0rne » June 24th, 2020, 8:54 am

Chris Crutchfield wrote:
June 23rd, 2020, 10:31 pm
I spent some time this evening messing around with the critics' scores for 2019 Bordeaux to produce a rough scatterplot of scores versus price. Standard caveats apply about the usefulness of this sort of analysis, but perhaps it can help some people make some decisions.

Image

Methodology:

Scores were sourced from the wonderful table at Liv-Ex. Scores were then loaded into a spreadsheet and cleaned up. For critics that express their scores as ranges, a scalar value was produced by averaging the bounds of the ranges. For critics that include a "+" in their score (e.g. "94-96+"), the value is imputed as the midpoint between that value and the next value in the scoring rubric. For example, for the "94-96+" example earlier, "96+" is converted to 96.5 and then averaged with 94 to produce 95.25. The score "17.5+" is converted to 17.75. This is not a particularly exact science, but it at least attempts to incorporate these additional features that are included in the critics' scores.

Each critic score for a wine is then normalized by z-score across their scores. Each normalized critic score for a wine is then averaged across all critics (after throwing away the bottom and top quartiles) to produce a final, normalized, aggregated score for each wine.

Price data was pulled from Total Wine and is expressed in US Dollars. Obviously, TW does not have everything so there are some gaps in the data. I also manually entered these in by hand so I may have made some mistakes here and there.

Interpreting the graph:

As we are likely all familiar with, quality is generally not a linear function of price. To reflect this, I plotted the price on a log scale.

So what are the "best values" from this vintage? Well, there is not really a good metric to determine that, but one approach you could take is to roughly look at the convex hull produced by the points in this plot. The vertices of the hull are probably going to be a better QPR than other wines at a similar price point. For this chart, it appears (just eyeballing it) that these are: Gloria, Malescot St. Exupery, Montrose, Ducru Beaucaillou, Figeac, Palmer, l'Eglise Clinet, and Margaux. Honorable mentions are: Leoville Poyferre, Haut-Bailly, Pichon Baron, and Mouton Rothschild. Perhaps these selections are rather obvious to some here more experienced than I, but I found this interesting!

Anyway, happy to share the Google Sheet I used to generate this if others would like to play around with it. Just let me know if anybody is interested and I'll post it here.
Interesting analysis. If you don’t throw out the top and bottom quartiles, what is the impact? The scores are already so compressed, I’m not sure that’s really necessary. Would love to see the google sheet!

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#806 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 8:55 am

Vince T wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 6:29 am
Back to wine...

Anyone else pick up Carmes? $90 is a pretty good price, although most big outlets running at $100.
I expect to! Haven't seen it released on my side (K&L and TW).
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#807 Post by Lee Barnard » June 24th, 2020, 9:02 am

Vince T wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 6:29 am
Back to wine...

Anyone else pick up Carmes? $90 is a pretty good price, although most big outlets running at $100.
I wasn't going to based on the style change, which I haven't personally had the opportunity to try but it didn't seem like what I'd want. But then Alfert tasted the 2016 and said Leve was right about it being excellent. Now my brain is in does not compute mode.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#808 Post by Paul McCourt » June 24th, 2020, 9:09 am

I have decided to pass completely (this after loading up a cart with about 6 cases) on this vintage.

The prices are attractive for the most part, but that comes with caveats. I think the prices are more in line with what I think they should have been, and simply look great based on the comparison to what the prices were recently. That valuation is my own personal one, of course. I also am unable to determine what exactly the end price will be, given the tariffs, etc. situation, which doesn't help.

I also am having trouble seeing the prices moving significantly upwards in a couple years. Since I am old enough to no longer in the market in any significant way, buying was more of a personal routine that was hard to give up (getting old sux) and I was trying hard to justify continuing to do so anyway because the prices were lower this year. I'll just wait and see what it looks like when they hit here. I see little risk in that.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#809 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 9:18 am

Lee Barnard wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 9:02 am
Vince T wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 6:29 am
Back to wine...

Anyone else pick up Carmes? $90 is a pretty good price, although most big outlets running at $100.
I wasn't going to based on the style change, which I haven't personally had the opportunity to try but it didn't seem like what I'd want. But then Alfert tasted the 2016 and said Leve was right about it being excellent. Now my brain is in does not compute mode.
Hahaha, that's my exact thought process, as well. If it sucks, I can just sell it.

Gotta give DanielP a shoutout as I buy this cellar defender. 😭😭
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#810 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 9:22 am

Paul McCourt wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 9:09 am
I have decided to pass completely (this after loading up a cart with about 6 cases) on this vintage.

The prices are attractive for the most part, but that comes with caveats. I think the prices are more in line with what I think they should have been, and simply look great based on the comparison to what the prices were recently. That valuation is my own personal one, of course. I also am unable to determine what exactly the end price will be, given the tariffs, etc. situation, which doesn't help.

I also am having trouble seeing the prices moving significantly upwards in a couple years. Since I am old enough to no longer in the market in any significant way, buying was more of a personal routine that was hard to give up (getting old sux) and I was trying hard to justify continuing to do so anyway because the prices were lower this year. I'll just wait and see what it looks like when they hit here. I see little risk in that.
No argument here. Honestly, if tariffs are imposed and they wipe out any significant discounts from EP, then I'm canceling my order. And a good deal of my participation is rooted in sentimental reasons for the vintage. I'm a sucker of a consumer, for sure!
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#811 Post by DanielP » June 24th, 2020, 9:35 am

C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 9:18 am

Hahaha, that's my exact thought process, as well. If it sucks, I can just sell it.

Gotta give DanielP a shoutout as I buy this cellar defender. 😭😭
lol which one?
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#812 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » June 24th, 2020, 9:41 am

I buy very tiny quantities at this price point, but my thought process on Les Carmes was the exact same as you all have been discussing. I did buy some '16, but haven't tasted it so I don't have that as a data point. I had too many $90-$100 wines on my "possible" list anyway. I went for Haut-Bailly, Canon, Clinet, and P-C, and skipped Les Carmes, Calon, and Lunch Bags in '19, in this price segment, among the ones that were on my "possible" list.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#813 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 10:04 am

DanielP wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 9:35 am
C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 9:18 am

Hahaha, that's my exact thought process, as well. If it sucks, I can just sell it.

Gotta give DanielP a shoutout as I buy this cellar defender. 😭😭
lol which one?
Haha, Les Carmes HB! It’d be nice to have something ready for drinking on delivery day [berserker.gif]
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#814 Post by Sc0tt F!tzger@ld » June 24th, 2020, 10:04 am

Sc0tt F!tzger@ld wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 6:58 am
Ducru sold out on TW.
Ducru back up on TW.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#815 Post by Robert.A.Jr. » June 24th, 2020, 10:09 am


"@lf3rt was clearly raised in an outhouse in the Loire. . . ."

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#816 Post by Lee Barnard » June 24th, 2020, 10:16 am

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:09 am
US doubling-down on tariffs?

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/24/us-asse ... EXGEEfJrL8
Yes, but also the whole list is under reconsideration (both categories and tariff percentage), which is required according to David B. Let's hope <14% wine comes off the list....

Edit for the link: https://ustr.gov/sites/default/files/en ... 3_2020.pdf

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#817 Post by Chris Crutchfield » June 24th, 2020, 10:23 am

Br1an Th0rne wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 8:54 am
Interesting analysis. If you don’t throw out the top and bottom quartiles, what is the impact? The scores are already so compressed, I’m not sure that’s really necessary. Would love to see the google sheet!
It's fairly similar but there is definitely some movement. I think it helps with some scores that are clearly outliers from the others, but you're right that it may not be necessary. It looks more like this:

Image

The spreadsheet is here. If you would like to run your own analyses, just go to File > Make a Copy

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#818 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 10:26 am

Chris Crutchfield wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:23 am
Br1an Th0rne wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 8:54 am
Interesting analysis. If you don’t throw out the top and bottom quartiles, what is the impact? The scores are already so compressed, I’m not sure that’s really necessary. Would love to see the google sheet!
It's fairly similar but there is definitely some movement. I think it helps with some scores that are clearly outliers from the others, but you're right that it may not be necessary. It looks more like this:

Image

The spreadsheet is here. If you would like to run your own analyses, just go to File > Make a Copy
I always welcome a little r/dataisbeautiful (https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/) action! Total sucker for charts.

Thanks for your contributions!
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#819 Post by Sh@n A » June 24th, 2020, 10:53 am

Chris Crutchfield wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:23 am
It's fairly similar but there is definitely some movement. I think it helps with some scores that are clearly outliers from the others, but you're right that it may not be necessary.
Chris, is it possible to see a blow up of the < $100 category? Thanks
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#820 Post by Chris Crutchfield » June 24th, 2020, 11:04 am

Sh@n A wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:53 am
Chris, is it possible to see a blow up of the < $100 category? Thanks
Note: I pulled prices from the community average on CT instead of using TW prices (which was probably a bad idea to begin with). I also removed the log-scale on the x-axis.

Image

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#821 Post by JonathanG » June 24th, 2020, 11:48 am

C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:51 am
JonathanG wrote:
June 23rd, 2020, 10:40 pm
D@ve D y r 0 f f wrote:
June 23rd, 2020, 8:54 pm
With today's clauses, the inability to lock in the tariff and eliminate the risk is the same, but now all the retailers' terms seem to allocate the risk to the consumer.
I posted way back in this thread a comparison of a few T&C's. I bought all my futures from Millesima, who did not change their T&Cs to charge tariffs, and who will store the wine in France for free until the tariff goes away (optimistic on their part, I'd say), and from wine.com, who also didnt change T&C and who, although they didn't explitly say it, will likely be doing the same as Millesima. Compared to K&L who said they will charge.
I don’t know if that’s entirely true. Millesima doesn’t sound like a free lunch. Direct text from Millesima:

“ Our current prices are shown before taxes and tariffs. Any Futures and Pre-Arrival orders may be subject to the collection of additional tariffs. Additional tariffs will be based on the date of importation. We will offer free storage in our professional wine cellar in Bordeaux in the event of any importation delays.”

Meanwhile, here’s the direct text from K&L:

PLEASE NOTE: 2019 Bordeaux Futures are being offered without any added tariffs. If there are applicable tariffs at the time the wines are imported in 2022, we will contact you with the option to pay tariffs to have the wine delivered, or cancel the order with no penalty.

I’d say K&L is offering a more than friendly approach, especially when some retailers are doing final sale before we know the final tariff costs (if any).
Very interesting, I'll go back and revisit. I double checked all of these before purchasing. Good thing I printed out the T&C's from my purchase dates and have a confirmatory email from them on the point.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#822 Post by Jeff_M. » June 24th, 2020, 12:23 pm

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:09 am
US doubling-down on tariffs?

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/24/us-asse ... EXGEEfJrL8
We can only hope that in 2+ years there is resolution to the tariffs or maybe the amount of tariffs they need to collect to settle the fine is paid up and the tariffs are gone.

I did not buy in fear of the tariffs this year. I bought what I felt were better prices on new releases. If in 2 years there's still a tariff issue, then that decision will need to get made.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#823 Post by Lee Barnard » June 24th, 2020, 12:33 pm

TW has PLL up. I'm sure it will go quick. I'm passing.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#824 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 12:49 pm

Lee Barnard wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:33 pm
TW has PLL up. I'm sure it will go quick. I'm passing.
Oof at $150. I backfill 80s-90s Lalande at or close to that price. Buying some as a YOLO.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#825 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 12:57 pm

Yeesh. K&L just released VCC at $260 and Les Carmes Haut Brion at $120.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#826 Post by Keith Levenberg » June 24th, 2020, 1:17 pm

C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:49 pm
Lee Barnard wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:33 pm
TW has PLL up. I'm sure it will go quick. I'm passing.
Oof at $150. I backfill 80s-90s Lalande at or close to that price. Buying some as a YOLO.
I bought. Wine-Searcher low on the 2016 is $220 right now. Best price I saw on release was $180. I think $150 will end up looking like a pretty good price for this down the line. And we are talking about a property that has a long, long track record of going toe to toe with the first growths.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#827 Post by Alex Frank » June 24th, 2020, 1:21 pm

I bought a couple bottles PLL along with a half-case each of some less-expensive favorites (LB, GPL, Lagrange and Pontet Canet from a few weeks ago), all on TW. Might talk myself into a couple more bottles each of some pricier stuff (maybe Montrose, Pichon Baron and Haut Bailly) but I think I might be done for the 2019s.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#828 Post by Lee Barnard » June 24th, 2020, 1:37 pm

Keith Levenberg wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:17 pm
C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:49 pm
Lee Barnard wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:33 pm
TW has PLL up. I'm sure it will go quick. I'm passing.
Oof at $150. I backfill 80s-90s Lalande at or close to that price. Buying some as a YOLO.
I bought. Wine-Searcher low on the 2016 is $220 right now. Best price I saw on release was $180. I think $150 will end up looking like a pretty good price for this down the line. And we are talking about a property that has a long, long track record of going toe to toe with the first growths.
Ugh, that was the push I needed. I caved. I do love PLL Now I'm done with 2019s, I swear.
Last edited by Lee Barnard on June 24th, 2020, 1:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#829 Post by Neal.Mollen » June 24th, 2020, 1:38 pm

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:09 am
US doubling-down on tariffs?

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/24/us-asse ... EXGEEfJrL8
I'm quoting Robert here so he doesn't miss the opportunity to shame me. I bought. Branaire Ducru 375s for 19.97. Halves are so hard to find and although I keep buying back vintages, I just can't keep up with consumption. Sigh.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#830 Post by Jeff_M. » June 24th, 2020, 1:40 pm

Keith Levenberg wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:17 pm
C Chen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:49 pm
Lee Barnard wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 12:33 pm
TW has PLL up. I'm sure it will go quick. I'm passing.
Oof at $150. I backfill 80s-90s Lalande at or close to that price. Buying some as a YOLO.
I bought. Wine-Searcher low on the 2016 is $220 right now. Best price I saw on release was $180. I think $150 will end up looking like a pretty good price for this down the line. And we are talking about a property that has a long, long track record of going toe to toe with the first growths.
Same deal for me. Went in for a half case of PLL. Thought $150 was a great release price.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#831 Post by Robert.A.Jr. » June 24th, 2020, 1:44 pm

Neal.Mollen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:38 pm
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:09 am
US doubling-down on tariffs?

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/24/us-asse ... EXGEEfJrL8
I'm quoting Robert here so he doesn't miss the opportunity to shame me. I bought. Branaire Ducru 375s for 19.97. Halves are so hard to find and although I keep buying back vintages, I just can't keep up with consumption. Sigh.
Heck no, I admire you, that you think you will live long enough with a palate to appreciate these wines! ;). I am only buying Rolland wines for my dotage.

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#832 Post by Sc0tt F!tzger@ld » June 24th, 2020, 1:46 pm

I just ordered the PLL and then broke down and picked up the Ducru, which mysteriously reappeared on TW's site. Okay, I'm officially done with 2019 futures, full stop.

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Neal.Mollen
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#833 Post by Neal.Mollen » June 24th, 2020, 1:50 pm

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:44 pm
Neal.Mollen wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:38 pm
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:09 am
US doubling-down on tariffs?

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/24/us-asse ... EXGEEfJrL8
I'm quoting Robert here so he doesn't miss the opportunity to shame me. I bought. Branaire Ducru 375s for 19.97. Halves are so hard to find and although I keep buying back vintages, I just can't keep up with consumption. Sigh.
Heck no, I admire you, that you think you will live long enough with a palate to appreciate these wines! ;). I am only buying Rolland wines for my dotage.
According to Jeffois it is only 13.7% abv, so a total fail
I don't have to speak; she defends me

A drunkard's dream if I ever did see one

D@ve D y r 0 f f
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#834 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » June 24th, 2020, 1:55 pm

Yes, I just bought a few cases of wine that I will drink between the time I'm, oh maybe 78 and maybe 90, give or take.

So what?

What are you looking at?

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Sc0tt F!tzger@ld
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#835 Post by Sc0tt F!tzger@ld » June 24th, 2020, 1:57 pm

D@ve D y r 0 f f wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:55 pm
Yes, I just bought a few cases of wine that I will drink between the time I'm, oh maybe 78 and maybe 90, give or take.

So what?

What are you looking at?
To living old! champagne.gif champagne.gif champagne.gif

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D Zurcher
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#836 Post by D Zurcher » June 24th, 2020, 2:08 pm

OK-I'm done-I swear.

More 375's than 750's:

Pichon Baron
Haut Brion
LMHB
Lynch Bages
Lafite
Cheval Blanc
Branaire Ducru
Leoville Poyferre
Domaine de Chavalier
Mouton
d'Armailhac
Duhart Milon
Pichon Lalande
Ducru
Montrose
Leoville Barton
Talbot
Brane Cantenac
GPL
Gloria
Lagrange

I have an issue... :)
DanZ

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A1ex H
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#837 Post by A1ex H » June 24th, 2020, 2:15 pm

I thought I was done too but picked up some PLL, Canon and Clinet. Managed to resist a few other things even though pricing is good in certain instances.
H@ns£n

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Mark Golodetz
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#838 Post by Mark Golodetz » June 24th, 2020, 2:46 pm

D Zurcher wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 2:08 pm
OK-I'm done-I swear.

More 375's than 750's:

Pichon Baron
Haut Brion
LMHB
Lynch Bages
Lafite
Cheval Blanc
Branaire Ducru
Leoville Poyferre
Domaine de Chavalier
Mouton
d'Armailhac
Duhart Milon
Pichon Lalande
Ducru
Montrose
Leoville Barton
Talbot
Brane Cantenac
GPL
Gloria
Lagrange

I have an issue... :)
Why no Palmer? You need to go back and get some.
ITB

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D Zurcher
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#839 Post by D Zurcher » June 24th, 2020, 3:02 pm

Mark Golodetz wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 2:46 pm
Why no Palmer? You need to go back and get some.
[/quote]

Ugh-I haven't had any vintage of Palmer since the big price increase many years ago. I see the notes but I have to draw the line somewhere believe it or not...LOL. Brane Cantenac almost got cut but I have had a few memorable bottles over the last few years and I really like the 2015.
DanZ

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#840 Post by DanielP » June 24th, 2020, 3:03 pm

I sort of regret not picking up LMHB, but maybe a blessing in disguise.
P@ik

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Vince T
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#841 Post by Vince T » June 24th, 2020, 3:48 pm

DanielP wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 3:03 pm
I sort of regret not picking up LMHB, but maybe a blessing in disguise.
I feel the same.

I still ended up with cases of
Figeac
Canon
Rauzan Segla
Lynch Bages
GPL
Carmes HB
Branaire
Laroque
Meyney

With a couple assorted cases (mostly 375s) of Montrose, Cos, Leoville Barton, Poyferre, Langoa, and Clinet.

I'm done. For real.
T s 3 n g

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#842 Post by Vinod S. » June 24th, 2020, 3:52 pm

In the end just Pichon Lalande and Lynch Bages (in 375), but would have gladly taken Mouton at original release if I hadn’t gotten shut out on allocations.
Vinod Stalam
Booth 2015

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#843 Post by Br1an Th0rne » June 24th, 2020, 4:55 pm

I think I’m finished...will probably pick up some Smith Haut Lafitte (we visited last October, my wife loved the place, the wine too) if it’s still available at TW later this week. I’m 47, so most of my purchases this year were as a mixed case of regular bottle and 375. First time buying futures since 2009, the pricing with 2010 disgusted me, and I hadn’t been tempted until this year. Did a lot of backfilling the last 10 years of 90, 95, 96, 98, 00 and 05. Looking back, I see I actually paid less for the ‘19 than I did for the first tranche of ‘09 for Pontet Canet, Lynch Bages, and Clinet!

Branaire-Ducru
Calon-Ségur
Cantenac Brown
Domaine de Chevalier
Clinet
Haut Brion
La Mission Haut Brion
Léoville Poyferré
Lynch Bages
Malescot St. Exupéry
Mouton Rothschild
Pichon Lalande
Pichon Baron
Pontet Canet

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#844 Post by AD Northup » June 24th, 2020, 5:05 pm

Biggest EP for me yet (still only 32, so mostly 750’s):

Lynch Bages
Leoville Barton
Pontet Canet
Cos
Ducru Beaucaillou
Tour St. Christophe
VCC
Canon
Montrose
A n d r e w N o r t h u p

2020 WsOTY:

2015 Roses de Jeanne / Cédric Bouchard Champagne Blanc de Noirs La Presle (#1)
1954 Fontanafredda Barbaresco
2015 Ultramarine BdB

2019 WsOTY:
1994 Edmunds St. John Les Côtes Sauvages
2016 P. S. Garcia Grenache Piedra Lisa
2002 Perrier-Jouet Belle Époque
2005 Faja dos Padres Malvasia

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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#845 Post by HMechbal » June 24th, 2020, 5:11 pm

Went much deeper than initially anticipated. Mostly x3, a couple x2 and Laroque x6. Only 75s. I'm not 30 yet, what better time to stock up on young Bordeaux ?
Still looking at Lynch-Bages but kinda outspent myself.

Pontet Canet
Roc de Cambes
Branaire Ducru
La Mauriane
Laroque
Clos Floridene Blanc
Calon Segur
Giscours
Phelan Segur
Grand Puy Lacoste
Montlandrie
Clinet
Leoville Barton
Leoville Poyferre
Chevalier
Les Cruzelles
Rauzan Segla
Canon
Carmes HB


Btw, has Climens chosen not to produce a Barsac two years in a row ?
Hamza

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Sc0tt F!tzger@ld
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#846 Post by Sc0tt F!tzger@ld » June 24th, 2020, 5:12 pm

Who would’ve thought this thread might hit 1,000 posts?

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Andrew K.
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#847 Post by Andrew K. » June 24th, 2020, 5:15 pm

My first EP. Relatively small, all 750s.

Canon x30
Cheval x6
Mouton x6
Carruades x3
Petit Mouton x3
к𝓁ย𝐠

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Mark Golodetz
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#848 Post by Mark Golodetz » June 24th, 2020, 5:41 pm

LMHB
Mouton
Palmer
Pichon Lalande
VCC
Langoa Barton (halves)
Figeac
Ducru
La Conseillante
Pontet Canet
ITB

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Vince T
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#849 Post by Vince T » June 24th, 2020, 6:02 pm

HMechbal wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 5:11 pm

Btw, has Climens chosen not to produce a Barsac two years in a row ?
It’s an interesting question, and perhaps deserving of its own thread.
T s 3 n g

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Curtis Chen
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Re: The 2019 Bordeaux are coming out.

#850 Post by Curtis Chen » June 24th, 2020, 6:02 pm

Terribly fun EP this year. Loved all the discussions and banter we shared. It ain't over yet!

VCC
Pichon Lalande
Leoville Barton
Pichon Baron
Sociando
Cantemerle

Missed out on LMHB, but I'm sure I'll make up for it during the next great vintage (like 2020! Jk). Also, I bought a Laroque in honor of Leve. flirtysmile
Add me on CellarTracker: C Chen

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