TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

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Kent Comley
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TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#1 Post by Kent Comley » February 13th, 2020, 4:50 pm

Last night the Coonawarra single bottle club met for a dinner of predominantly wines from the 1990s. It was a night of many successes including a svelte 99 Faiveley Vosne Chaumes, 94 Ogier Chateauneuf Du pape, 96 Ducru amongst others but this wine was a stand out. It is a long time since I have drunk a La La, but this was worth the wait.

Medium bodied, not as big and foreboding as I expected. That's a good thing in my book. What an aroma, what a perfume, lifted violets, passionfruit skins, some meaty inflections. Intoxicating. On the palate its beautifully proportioned, carressing every crevice of the mouth. As it breathes just a hint of finely ground white pepper. It has a wonderful mouth perfume, and a real peacock's tail, the florals lingering on the palate.
Lovely surprise.
Last edited by Kent Comley on February 13th, 2020, 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jeremy Holmes
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#2 Post by Jeremy Holmes » February 13th, 2020, 5:22 pm

They do need a lot of time. Sounds like it is right in the zone Kent.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#3 Post by Kent Comley » February 13th, 2020, 7:04 pm

Smack bang in the zone mate. Nice melange of flavours.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#4 Post by Nathan Smyth » February 13th, 2020, 7:30 pm

I never understood the AFWE aversion to these wines.

1995 La Mouline was one of the best wines I ever tasted.

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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#5 Post by Greg K » February 13th, 2020, 7:38 pm

Nathan Smyth wrote:
February 13th, 2020, 7:30 pm
I never understood the AFWE aversion to these wines.
Why would the AFWE crowd have an aversion to a wine so larded with new oak so that 20 years in it can have absolutely zero varietal typicity, let alone geographical typicity?

It’s a complete mystery.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#6 Post by Kent Comley » February 13th, 2020, 7:53 pm

Interesting, this wine very obviously Shiraz, and the oak was well integrated, and I have quite an aversion to new oak.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#7 Post by Greg K » February 13th, 2020, 8:05 pm

Kent Comley wrote:
February 13th, 2020, 7:53 pm
Interesting, this wine very obviously Shiraz, and the oak was well integrated, and I have quite an aversion to new oak.
I’m glad you liked it!
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#8 Post by Gerhard P. » February 14th, 2020, 12:37 am

Greg K wrote:
February 13th, 2020, 7:38 pm
Nathan Smyth wrote:
February 13th, 2020, 7:30 pm
I never understood the AFWE aversion to these wines.
Why would the AFWE crowd have an aversion to a wine so larded with new oak so that 20 years in it can have absolutely zero varietal typicity, let alone geographical typicity?

It’s a complete mystery.
I have no idea what the AFWE is thinking, but 1995 Guigal LaLas are VERY typical for variety and terroir.
Sometimes it´s difficult to see the woods because of too many trees ... [wow.gif]
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#9 Post by Kent Comley » February 15th, 2020, 8:44 pm

Thanks Gerhard......the voice of reason as always.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#10 Post by Greg K » February 15th, 2020, 9:06 pm

Gerhard P. wrote:
February 14th, 2020, 12:37 am
Greg K wrote:
February 13th, 2020, 7:38 pm
Nathan Smyth wrote:
February 13th, 2020, 7:30 pm
I never understood the AFWE aversion to these wines.
Why would the AFWE crowd have an aversion to a wine so larded with new oak so that 20 years in it can have absolutely zero varietal typicity, let alone geographical typicity?

It’s a complete mystery.
I have no idea what the AFWE is thinking, but 1995 Guigal LaLas are VERY typical for variety and terroir.
Sometimes it´s difficult to see the woods because of too many trees ... [wow.gif]
Indeed, due to all the trees in the wine.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#11 Post by Greg K » February 15th, 2020, 9:12 pm

Kent Comley wrote:
February 15th, 2020, 8:44 pm
Thanks Gerhard......the voice of reason as always.
An interesting sentiment. Some wine drinkers are very averse to oak. Some less so. Some not at all. It’s not a matter of reason, it’s a matter of preference.

Whether or not one likes wine made Guigal or think they have a lot of typicity doesn’t make one the voice of reason. If you enjoy wines made by Ogier and Guigal, that’s great. They clearly fit YOUR palate, and the only palate that matters is one’s own. And if those wines do not fit a hypothetical AFWE palate, that’s fine too. And it’s in no way unreasonable.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#12 Post by Gerhard P. » February 16th, 2020, 3:07 am

Greg K wrote:
February 15th, 2020, 9:12 pm
Kent Comley wrote:
February 15th, 2020, 8:44 pm
Thanks Gerhard......the voice of reason as always.
An interesting sentiment. Some wine drinkers are very averse to oak. Some less so. Some not at all. It’s not a matter of reason, it’s a matter of preference.

Whether or not one likes wine made Guigal or think they have a lot of typicity doesn’t make one the voice of reason. If you enjoy wines made by Ogier and Guigal, that’s great. They clearly fit YOUR palate, and the only palate that matters is one’s own. And if those wines do not fit a hypothetical AFWE palate, that’s fine too. And it’s in no way unreasonable.
That´s partially true - at least the passage about personal preference ...
but imho it´s not a question of preference if a wine has typicity for a certain variety or origin, it´s a question of experience and tasting ability.
One may like or dislike a Guigal Cru from Cote-Rotie, but to claim it´s neither typical for Syrah nor for Cote-Rotie is pretty absurd.
I have a lot of dear wine friends with a lot of experience that will call La Landonne 1995 immediately a LaLa from Guigal when tasting it blind - and then the further discussion will focus on vintage ... and if it´s LM, LL, LT ...
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#13 Post by Greg K » February 16th, 2020, 7:48 am

Gerhard P. wrote:
February 16th, 2020, 3:07 am
Greg K wrote:
February 15th, 2020, 9:12 pm
Kent Comley wrote:
February 15th, 2020, 8:44 pm
Thanks Gerhard......the voice of reason as always.
An interesting sentiment. Some wine drinkers are very averse to oak. Some less so. Some not at all. It’s not a matter of reason, it’s a matter of preference.

Whether or not one likes wine made Guigal or think they have a lot of typicity doesn’t make one the voice of reason. If you enjoy wines made by Ogier and Guigal, that’s great. They clearly fit YOUR palate, and the only palate that matters is one’s own. And if those wines do not fit a hypothetical AFWE palate, that’s fine too. And it’s in no way unreasonable.
That´s partially true - at least the passage about personal preference ...
but imho it´s not a question of preference if a wine has typicity for a certain variety or origin, it´s a question of experience and tasting ability.
One may like or dislike a Guigal Cru from Cote-Rotie, but to claim it´s neither typical for Syrah nor for Cote-Rotie is pretty absurd.
I have a lot of dear wine friends with a lot of experience that will call La Landonne 1995 immediately a LaLa from Guigal when tasting it blind - and then the further discussion will focus on vintage ... and if it´s LM, LL, LT ...
I’m glad you have friends that can readily recognize the oak Guigal uses.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#14 Post by J. Rock » February 16th, 2020, 10:50 am

I've never had the Guigal La Landonne, but I love the Delas La Landonne. Can anyone who's had both tell me how they compare?
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#15 Post by Craig G » February 16th, 2020, 8:41 pm

Gerhard P. wrote:
February 16th, 2020, 3:07 am
I have a lot of dear wine friends with a lot of experience that will call La Landonne 1995 immediately a LaLa from Guigal when tasting it blind - and then the further discussion will focus on vintage ... and if it´s LM, LL, LT ...
This seems to argue that it’s not typical of Cote Rotie, or at least it doesn’t offer any support to your argument.

I haven’t had very many LaLas but they have mostly been mid to late 90’s and I didn’t particularly like any of them. I found them hard and oaky. The last time I tasted a few of them, an older Guigal Brune & Blonde was much more enjoyable than the LaLas.
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#16 Post by Gerhard P. » February 17th, 2020, 1:00 am

J. Rock wrote:
February 16th, 2020, 10:50 am
I've never had the Guigal La Landonne, but I love the Delas La Landonne. Can anyone who's had both tell me how they compare?
I had far less Delas LL than Guigals, only 4 or 5 vintages, but I´d say it seems to have slightly more prominent and harder tannins, the texture is less velvety - and sometimes I noted a certain hint of tar/graphit ...
Craig G wrote:
February 16th, 2020, 8:41 pm
Gerhard P. wrote:
February 16th, 2020, 3:07 am
I have a lot of dear wine friends with a lot of experience that will call La Landonne 1995 immediately a LaLa from Guigal when tasting it blind - and then the further discussion will focus on vintage ... and if it´s LM, LL, LT ...
This seems to argue that it’s not typical of Cote Rotie, or at least it doesn’t offer any support to your argument.

I haven’t had very many LaLas but they have mostly been mid to late 90’s and I didn’t particularly like any of them. I found them hard and oaky. The last time I tasted a few of them, an older Guigal Brune & Blonde was much more enjoyable than the LaLas.
What kind of logic is this? When it´s easy for an experienced taster to recognize a Guigal LaLa ... then the wine is not typical for Cote Rotie?
[scratch.gif]
If you easily recognise Mouton-R. it´s proof that it´s not a typical Bordeaux?

However - I give up. It´s senseless to discuss Guigal with Guigal-haters ... deadhorse
I only hope it´s not typical for most berserkers ...
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#17 Post by David Glasser » February 17th, 2020, 5:32 am

Gerhard, Craig and Greg are saying that an easily identifiable wine may not be typical or representative of the region precisely because what makes it easily identifiable is that it stands out as very different from other wines from the region. The LaLa's key identifying feature is that of Guigal's oak treatment, not of Côte Rôtie.

Personally, I think they taste of Syrah but stand apart from most other Côte Rôties. I love the LaLas, but in a very different way and for a different setting than a Chave or Jamet, which I love (among other things) for their Côte Rôtie-ness.

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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#18 Post by Craig G » February 17th, 2020, 6:57 am

David Glasser wrote:
February 17th, 2020, 5:32 am
Personally, I think they taste of Syrah but stand apart from most other Côte Rôties. I love the LaLas, but in a very different way and for a different setting than a Chave or Jamet, which I love (among other things) for their Côte Rôtie-ness.
I hope we can agree that Chave doesn’t make typical Cote Rotie :-)
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#19 Post by David Glasser » February 17th, 2020, 7:04 am

Craig G wrote:
February 17th, 2020, 6:57 am
David Glasser wrote:
February 17th, 2020, 5:32 am
Personally, I think they taste of Syrah but stand apart from most other Côte Rôties. I love the LaLas, but in a very different way and for a different setting than a Chave or Jamet, which I love (among other things) for their Côte Rôtie-ness.
I hope we can agree that Chave doesn’t make typical Cote Rotie :-)
And thank goodness for that! [cheers.gif]

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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#20 Post by Gerhard P. » February 17th, 2020, 10:18 am

David Glasser wrote:
February 17th, 2020, 5:32 am
Gerhard, Craig and Greg are saying that an easily identifiable wine may not be typical or representative of the region precisely because what makes it easily identifiable is that it stands out as very different from other wines from the region. The LaLa's key identifying feature is that of Guigal's oak treatment, not of Côte Rôtie.

Personally, I think they taste of Syrah but stand apart from most other Côte Rôties. I love the LaLas, but in a very different way and for a different setting than a Chave or Jamet, which I love (among other things) for their Côte Rôtie-ness.
I think some people have a very selective tasting reception ... they taste/smell some new oak ... that's it - and they do not recognise anything else anymore ... and neglecting all the other very typical components, black and green olives, smoked meat, cold tar, black currants and a very typical balanced texture ...
all that is not a sign of any professional attitude ... imho kind of black and white-thinking ... oak (BAD), no oak: GOOD
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Re: TN : 1995 Guigal Cote Rotie La Landonne

#21 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » February 17th, 2020, 10:39 am

I am no fan of wine that tastes like furniture, but the reaction against oak, which has been used for centuries, baffles me.

What really baffles me is when someone who endorses cork as the only closure is also anti-oak.
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