Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

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D@vid Bu3ker
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Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#1 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » October 24th, 2019, 5:19 am

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2 ... acuations/
A fast-moving wildfire aided by powerful winds in Northern California’s wine country has prompted mandatory evacuation orders in Geyserville, an area of Sonoma County 75 miles north of San Francisco.

The Kincade Fire had spread to 10,000 acres by early Thursday, with no containment, according to the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection. The department issued red flag warnings for the area, a critical alert for when weather conditions such as high heat, low humidity, lightning strikes and strong winds could result in intense and quick-burning fires.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#2 Post by Paul Luckin » October 24th, 2019, 5:29 am

Kincade Fire in the Mayacamas Mtns. Mandatory evacs in place. Hope everyone up there (and family/friends) are safe.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#3 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 6:07 am



This is opening old wounds for lots of people in the North Bay.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#4 Post by Dennis Atick » October 24th, 2019, 6:45 am

Hoping for the best for everyone. Scary.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#5 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 6:56 am

Dennis Atick wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 6:45 am
Hoping for the best for everyone. Scary.

I step out on my front porch and not a whisper of wind and I’m only 12miles South. So eerie. 65° outside @ 6:30 am with 26% humidity.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#6 Post by Tom DeBiase » October 24th, 2019, 7:15 am

When my friends from the East Coast ask why these fires are so furious and deadly I tell them "Picture Hurricane Sandy without rain". That really is the only difference. We have fires out here all the time just like other places in the US during "normal" conditions. Fire departments put the fire out in a short time, end of fire but when these Canyon winds occur a simple brush fire literally becomes an inferno. It becomes unstoppable until the winds become more manageable.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#7 Post by William Segui » October 24th, 2019, 7:26 am

Sunday looks scary, be safe everyone

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#8 Post by Siun o'Connell » October 24th, 2019, 7:53 am

A friend was evacuating over night ... photos of the fire which was still far away - were scary.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#9 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 8:25 am

William Segui wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 7:26 am
Sunday looks scary, be safe everyone
Geyserville’s forecast isn’t showing wind Sunday like you’re going to have over the hill. Not yet anyhow.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#10 Post by Glenn L e v i n e » October 24th, 2019, 8:28 am

Some of my best two wheel trips have included runs thru Jimtown and AV. My heart goes out to these people there.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#11 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 9:51 am

9:45am temp rising humidity plummeting.
F8A15F26-D89B-4566-B283-0653D4CD287D.jpeg
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#12 Post by Paul Luckin » October 24th, 2019, 9:55 am

Brian Tuite wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 9:51 am
9:45am temp rising humidity plummeting.

F8A15F26-D89B-4566-B283-0653D4CD287D.jpeg
It never got below 75* in Sonoma Valley last night. And the wind was howling. Not looking forward to Sun/Mon.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#13 Post by Rboinski » October 24th, 2019, 10:22 am

Looks like AME/Stonestreet Estate Vineyards are getting hit pretty hard, keep seeing blocks on the news I used to visit with my wife who was formerly the Assistant Winemaker there.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#14 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 11:04 am

This from 128 before you hit Chalk Hill where they detour traffic.

5AFDE860-D4E3-49AE-849F-85A2B7EA13C4.jpeg
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#15 Post by KyleC » October 24th, 2019, 11:21 am

Smoke is expected to make its way to the Bay Area starting tomorrow morning.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#16 Post by Tom DeBiase » October 24th, 2019, 11:44 am

Finished up a hike at Foothill Regional Park about an hour ago. At the Alta Vista lookout looking North you could see the clouds of smoke moving due West. In downtown Windsor it’s still clear, no smoke though that is likely to change.

Crazy but looking out West from the Alta Vista lookout Windsor is clear but well beyond around Guerneville there is a huge clouds of smoke. The smoke going due West and then turning South as it gets close to the Pacific.

Wind direction is likely to change during the day.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#17 Post by Jeff_M. » October 24th, 2019, 11:53 am

I am perplexed that the state doesn't clear brush in these areas. Its sad to see these fires devastate every year.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#18 Post by Gabe Berk » October 24th, 2019, 12:18 pm

Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 11:53 am
I am perplexed that the state doesn't clear brush in these areas. Its sad to see these fires devastate every year.
PG&E cut the power off too before the fire even started out there. Really hope this fire gets contained soon and mother nature helps with the winds dying down and humidity rising. Feel horrible for those affected. October has been unrelenting in NorCal the past 3 years...

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#19 Post by Tom DeBiase » October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm

Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 11:53 am
I am perplexed that the state doesn't clear brush in these areas. Its sad to see these fires devastate every year.
Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#20 Post by Paul Luckin » October 24th, 2019, 12:26 pm

New incident in Marin, just north of Muir beach #MuirFire.

Looks like the wind is offshore at the moment, so that’s something positive.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#21 Post by Jeff_M. » October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm

Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 11:53 am
I am perplexed that the state doesn't clear brush in these areas. Its sad to see these fires devastate every year.
Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

Tom
So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#22 Post by brigcampbell » October 24th, 2019, 12:38 pm

In Socal, Irvine, it's 97 and 3% humidity. Nasty, the wind fries your eyeballs. No fires, thankfully.

good resource for checking out the fires.

https://www.fire.ca.gov/incidents/

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#23 Post by PeterH » October 24th, 2019, 12:40 pm

Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 11:53 am
I am perplexed that the state doesn't clear brush in these areas. Its sad to see these fires devastate every year.
Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

Tom
So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
Cows and sheep don't eat brush. Goats maybe, but nothing eats the dried brush, and the area is huge.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#24 Post by Dennis Atick » October 24th, 2019, 12:44 pm

Rakes?
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#25 Post by brigcampbell » October 24th, 2019, 12:49 pm

PeterH wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:40 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm


Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

Tom
So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
Cows and sheep don't eat brush. Goats maybe, but nothing eats the dried brush, and the area is huge.
Typically, it's Chaparral or California Sage Brush. Turns green with rain and then dries out. Tough stuff.

http://www.californiachaparral.com/chap ... arral.html

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#26 Post by Mike Kuller » October 24th, 2019, 12:49 pm

PeterH wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:40 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm


Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

Tom
So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
Cows and sheep don't eat brush. Goats maybe, but nothing eats the dried brush, and the area is huge.
Waist high brush and small trees on steep hillsides. Some larger trees have blown down due to the high winds.

The vineyards provide a firebreak.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#27 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 1:06 pm

Dennis Atick wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:44 pm
Rakes?
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#28 Post by Jeff_M. » October 24th, 2019, 1:07 pm

PeterH wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:40 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm


Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

Tom
So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
Cows and sheep don't eat brush. Goats maybe, but nothing eats the dried brush, and the area is huge.
Well that sucks. You figure as much as we pay in taxes in this state they would manage this stuff better. Its a constant struggle every year with the winds and the fires. Just hate to see so much devastation
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#29 Post by Tom DeBiase » October 24th, 2019, 1:17 pm

The only way to these fires will disappear will be when the average 45 inches of rain per year Sonoma County gets happens over the course of 12 months instead of 5.

I say that in jest of course. Good luck with that happening.

Tom

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#30 Post by brigcampbell » October 24th, 2019, 1:19 pm

Mike Kuller wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:49 pm

The vineyards provide a firebreak.
A vineyard is fuel. Nobody would say "we're safe, we're surrounded by a vineyard" if a wind driven fire is barreling down on you.

When windy, the fires "travel" by embers being blown out in front. Some times *way* in front which is how people get trapped so quickly, the fire can move at 10, 20, 30+ mph. A vineyard won't stop that. Heck, highways, lakes and rivers don't stop it. The fire just blows right over it.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#31 Post by Rboinski » October 24th, 2019, 1:24 pm

Paul Luckin wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:26 pm
New incident in Marin, just north of Muir beach #MuirFire.

Looks like the wind is offshore at the moment, so that’s something positive.
Saw this pop on GOES-17 about an hour ago in the fire temp band, but didn't see it in visual. I had assumed it was an artefact
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#32 Post by Brian Tuite » October 24th, 2019, 1:32 pm

brigcampbell wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 1:19 pm
Mike Kuller wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:49 pm

The vineyards provide a firebreak.
A vineyard is fuel. Nobody would say "we're safe, we're surrounded by a vineyard" if a wind driven fire is barreling down on you.

When windy, the fires "travel" by embers being blown out in front. Some times *way* in front which is how people get trapped so quickly, the fire can move at 10, 20, 30+ mph. A vineyard won't stop that. Heck, highways, lakes and rivers don't stop it. The fire just blows right over it.
In the Tubbs Fire the vineyards acted as firebreaks in numerous locations. They are green and irrigated. The areas that burn have not had any moisture since early May.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#33 Post by Rboinski » October 24th, 2019, 1:33 pm

Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 1:07 pm
PeterH wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:40 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm


So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
Cows and sheep don't eat brush. Goats maybe, but nothing eats the dried brush, and the area is huge.
Well that sucks. You figure as much as we pay in taxes in this state they would manage this stuff better. Its a constant struggle every year with the winds and the fires. Just hate to see so much devastation
It sucks but its part of living with nature. Whether the cause of this was natural or man-made, historical records show events of this size are not uncommon. Even if we had 10x the resources we have now for prevention,you will never fully prevent the possibility of a fire like this when the winds are gusting 60+ mph. Sad but on the upside far this has been kept to a relatively sparsely populated area and we are doing what we can to mitigate the risks to residents.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#34 Post by Jeff_M. » October 24th, 2019, 1:53 pm

Definitely have to give props to the firefighters for doing everything they do to try and contain the fires
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#35 Post by Casey Hartlip » October 24th, 2019, 2:47 pm

PeterH wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:40 pm
Jeff_M. wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 12:23 pm


Jeff, the area where this “Kincaid” fire started is DESOLATE. Even a experienced hiker would have trouble hiking to the area where this fire started no less have brush cleared.
The problem is with 60 MPH winds the fire goes from desolate to populated pretty damn quick.

Tom
So they can't allow cows or sheep to graze the hillsides to help cut down on the brush? There has to be a better way to manage these desolate areas so they can't erupt into fireballs.
Cows and sheep don't eat brush. Goats maybe, but nothing eats the dried brush, and the area is huge.
Controlled burning in the spring and early winter to reduce the fuel load.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#36 Post by Alan Rath » October 24th, 2019, 5:50 pm

Casey Hartlip wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 2:47 pm
Controlled burning in the spring and early winter to reduce the fuel load.
Or, just don't start fires, at least not on red flag days. Every single one of the recent big fires has been man started in one way or another.

And don't build your house in the hilly wilderness, not without having substantial cleared space around you, and with every fire-resistant material you can get your hands on.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#37 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » October 24th, 2019, 6:24 pm

Alan,

Do you know how this one started?
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#38 Post by Paul Gordon » October 24th, 2019, 6:27 pm

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 6:24 pm
Alan,

Do you know how this one started?
It appears to be a PG&E high voltage line.

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#39 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » October 24th, 2019, 6:57 pm

So not applicable to Alan’s “don’t start fires” scold.
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#40 Post by Alan Rath » October 24th, 2019, 7:19 pm

Of course it is. Human caused, whether purposeful, accidental, or negligent. A PG&E release said that, despite them turning off power in the area, a high voltage transmission line had been left on. They detected a problem at 9:20, Fire was reported at 9:27. Not sure why they didn’t de energize immediately, assuming they have that capability.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#41 Post by Randy Bowman » October 24th, 2019, 7:38 pm

Listening to one of the CalFire supervisors trying to explain how the Kincade fire got so big so fast, he pointed out the terrain was a major factor and wind. That area is steep hills and narrow valleys. When the fire crested one hill, the wind pushed flaming debris a quarter to half mile, to the top of the next hill and the next. The valleys burn slowly unless the wind is blowing through instead of across the valley.

My sister-in-law lives on Mt. Tamalpias in Marin County and is watching that fire from her front porch and fortunately, wind is still offshore keeping the fire from climbing Mt. Tam. She has electricity but as Murphy's Law dictates, her waterline from the street to her house ruptured this morning so she has no water.
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#42 Post by brigcampbell » October 24th, 2019, 7:38 pm

We don't get much lightening in California except the the high Sierra so every fire is man made. Unfortunate but true.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#43 Post by Casey Hartlip » October 24th, 2019, 7:42 pm

brigcampbell wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 7:38 pm
We don't get much lightening in California except the the high Sierra so every fire is man made. Unfortunate but true.
Not buying that statement.
Ordway's Valley Foothills

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#44 Post by Paul Luckin » October 24th, 2019, 7:42 pm

Sarah is a good follow on the Twitter machine

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#45 Post by Paul Gordon » October 24th, 2019, 7:44 pm

Casey Hartlip wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 7:42 pm
brigcampbell wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 7:38 pm
We don't get much lightening in California except the the high Sierra so every fire is man made. Unfortunate but true.
Not buying that statement.
The 2008 fires in Mendocino were caused by dry lightning.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#46 Post by brigcampbell » October 24th, 2019, 7:47 pm

Casey Hartlip wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 7:42 pm
brigcampbell wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 7:38 pm
We don't get much lightening in California except the the high Sierra so every fire is man made. Unfortunate but true.
Not buying that statement.
Okay, which big fires in the last 10 years were not caused by people? I'm including powerlines, etc.

You have lightening and spontaneous combustion as other options.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#47 Post by Chris Seiber » October 24th, 2019, 9:19 pm

Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 1:17 pm
The only way to these fires will disappear will be when the average 45 inches of rain per year Sonoma County gets happens over the course of 12 months instead of 5.
When we get a heavy rain winter, they say “lots of bushes and grasses grow, high fire danger.” When it’s a dry winter, they say “very dry, high fire danger.”

Same thing for allergy season — every year is worse than average. They never say “you know, this year is going to be very mild for allergies and low fire risk.” Which makes no sense, but what are you gonna do.

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#48 Post by Tom DeBiase » October 24th, 2019, 9:49 pm

Chris Seiber wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 9:19 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 1:17 pm
The only way to these fires will disappear will be when the average 45 inches of rain per year Sonoma County gets happens over the course of 12 months instead of 5.
When we get a heavy rain winter, they say “lots of bushes and grasses grow, high fire danger.” When it’s a dry winter, they say “very dry, high fire danger.”

Same thing for allergy season — every year is worse than average. They never say “you know, this year is going to be very mild for allergies and low fire risk.” Which makes no sense, but what are you gonna do.
Even better, if Sonoma County gets that 45 inches of rain equally over 12 months you don’t have to worry about fires or vineyards because Sonoma County then becomes New Jersey. [cheers.gif]

Tom

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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#49 Post by Eric Lundblad » October 24th, 2019, 10:20 pm

Chris Seiber wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 9:19 pm
Tom DeBiase wrote:
October 24th, 2019, 1:17 pm
The only way to these fires will disappear will be when the average 45 inches of rain per year Sonoma County gets happens over the course of 12 months instead of 5.
When we get a heavy rain winter, they say “lots of bushes and grasses grow, high fire danger.” When it’s a dry winter, they say “very dry, high fire danger.”

Same thing for allergy season — every year is worse than average. They never say “you know, this year is going to be very mild for allergies and low fire risk.” Which makes no sense, but what are you gonna do.
I have allergies...every year is worse...same for fires now unfortunately, I think
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Re: Fires in Sonoma...again - Geyserville

#50 Post by Sean_S » October 24th, 2019, 11:17 pm

In recent years near us in the SCM we had two started due to cars catching fire on highway 17. We had some arson stemming from some redneck love triangle and best of all the F&*^*&in morons who think somehow they can have a small brush fire without consequence. In our neck of the woods so far PGE hasn't been the issue like up north. In recent history its been burning cars and rednecks near me. I Hope all effected are safe and sound somewhere.

Doing my rain dance.

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