California 2017

I got some email releases for 2017’s this week from Quivet and Vice Versa. How bad is the vintage? I haven’t seen many reviews.

Heat spikes + smoke damage = Eeek hitsfan [help.gif]

2017 has been great so far from what I have tasted. Not sure where you are pulling your data.

Mike Smith got scores of 95-100 on most all the wines he made in 2017.

Some people had issues with ftuit being in fermenters when the fires hit/power went off/they had to evacuate for 9 days. Many of those wines were declassified and/or blended/bulked out. Lots of wine was made before during and after the fires that is more than just fine.

I’ve been concerned, but the '17s I’ve tasted (mostly Zins from Sonoma and roses) have been quite good.

+1

That’s quite the inviting question you ask…really makes growers and winemakers want to jump right on to answer such a negatively posed “question.”

Barrel tasted the Vice Versa in November and they were pretty damn good.

2017 is my wedding year so I’d like to buy a decent amount of bottles to last the years. Already started with Sandlands, bedrock, Dirty & Rowdy. If the winery is releasing the wine, I’ll buy it. That being said, I don’t buy on the same scale as others around here neener

I think '17 will be very good.

I wasn’t quoting any data, but I also think citing arbitrary points is equally irrelevant. Who here has drank a 98+ point wine and been like “wtf?” [truce.gif]

Like you noted, much has been declassified and bulked out, but bulked out wine still gets produced and bottled, albeit not by the original producer. BOND noted production down ~15%; who is to say for them and others that there is a firm line of “this is where damage stops” in the vineyard? It’s bound to have crept in, even if a little. Also, you’ll need to trust all those with wine in ferment that lost power/evacuated were/are honest enough to do so - I doubt all will toot their horn for such, especially if there are particularly debt laden producers; bills/staff must be paid and food must be put on the table. This isn’t a conversation of purely prominent cult/mailing list wines only, after all, but issues that affected many more.

And sure, wines may taste just fine now - but look at historic vintages like that in Bordeaux of 2003 where heat crippled vintages later on as they aged - who is to say how the heat + fire implications in CA will affect such? You just don’t know, but we have history to look back on. Further, smoke damage aside - how does all of this affect the ambient yeast, for producers relying on such? Kill/alter/speed/slow it? I don’t know, but I’d wager you’d see more intervention/inoculation than you would’ve otherwise - which means different strains and different results. All these things have compounding effect.

I’m not trying to argue, nor am I saying 2017 is a bust. But should it be of concern, most certainly just not at release? Absolutely.

Will there be great wines? Definitely. Will there be garbage wines? Also, definitely.

Just think you need to pick your spots.

It is not a bad vintage at all. The barrel samples were quite good …

It is a very uneven vintage though. In '16, everything across the board was great. Similar to '15, you will have to be a bit pickier with your '17 choices. Compared to recent vintages, 2017 is not as good as '10, '12, '13, '14, and '16, but it is better than '11 and likely will be better than '15 on average. The best of '15 are truly outstanding though while the best of '17 are just great (we’ll see how they are in a bottle). A solid medium-term drinking vintage while you are waiting on your '10s, '13s, and '16s. Although my sample is limited, I largely preferred the fruit that was not on the valley floor.

if you like the producer, I would order from them in '17. If you are on the fence, then there are a lot of leftover '14s remaining.

I don’t know where all this heat damage is that you are talking about.

I DO know because I have spoken with many winemakers and tasted their 2017 wines. They feel that the vintage was exceptional. 2 weeks of smoke does not a harvest make.

Hardy Wallace had to declassify all of his SVD Mourvèdre in 2017, had to blend it, sell as a less expensive wine and lost a ton of money in the process. He disn’t Hide anything and any respectable winemaker will not.

People here don’t drink bulk wine.

If you’re not sure about someone’s wine check reviews. If they disn’t submit wines to be reviewed then perhaps they are hiding something.

If you are worried that the wine being offered in 2017 is less than then perhaps that has more to say about whose wine you drink than the industry as a whole.

I’m supplying facts, you are supplying nothing but hot air.

10 days straight of 100+ heat with not much cooling off at night. Plenty of sugar spiking and acidity dropping, some rot due to that, lots of berry shriveling, and plenty of hand sorting during crush. Some panicked and picked earlier than they should have. On the other side of things, I know of at least one famous winemaker who decided to skip the vintage altogether (Pinot Noir).

And this is just the Sonoma side of things weather wise, let’s not even get into smoke taint elsewhere (since most of Sonoma was already picked by then).

As stated just above, taste before you buy. Painting v2017 with a broad brush, either way, is not the thing to do.

Such an interesting thread - and I agree with Greg and others that have said that you should taste before you buy and not ‘purchase blindly’. I don’t think any winery would ‘knowingly’ try to pawn off smoke tainted wines. With regards to the heat spike and wine left in the fermentors - well, there are plenty of ‘tricks’ that wineries can use to make things ‘better’.

Cheers

So much depends on the region and grape variety. In many cases, the heat spike around Labor Day had little effect unless you were about ready to pick at that time. Smoke taint concerns are way overblown IMHO. Only later-picked fruit from Napa, Sonoma, and Mendocino were likely to be affected from that and a good deal of the crop in those areas was already in by the time the fires broke out.

Overall our wines from 2017 turned out great, and I’m sure that’s the case with many other California vintners.

More irrelevant arbitrary points, but who’s counting? [stirthepothal.gif]

Not heard this discussed but did Paso Robles area suffer from the heat spikes as well ? would this affect Syrah more than Cab as it is typically a slightly cooler climate grape ?

Just curious - wasn’t 18 noted as exceptional too? Feels like 17 and 18 were pretty different. Surprised to see both would be noted as exceptional considering the differences.

What famous winemaker skipped the vintage altogether?

Typically broad post that leads to oddly structured and ultimately contentious answers. California is not one region, unless you are merely concerned about its borders.

Some posters have made comments clearly about the Napa/Sonoma regions.

Others have made general statements that may be accurate in a particular location, but in no way represent the entire state.

Napa and Santa Barbara are about 400 miles apart (similar to the distance between Bordeaux and Burgundy…"how’s France this year?). It’s highly unlikely that the information about one is specifically relevant about the other.

Then there’s the grapes. It appears the OP cares about Cabernet. There’s a whole lot more wine in California that just Cabernet.