My first Keller gmax

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Mark Golodetz
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My first Keller gmax

#1 Post by Mark Golodetz » February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am

At a recent tasting of our SOBER group, our very generous host pulled out a 2006 gmax. It was a glorious wine, full flavored rich, but sporting serious acidity, and wonderful, detailed complexity. I loved the wine, certainly WOTN, and it had some pretty stiff competition, some predictable, some less so. An excellent pair of 1985s, a Lynch Bages from the good release and a Caymus, then a 1989 Mouton, a fine example from a period of coffee flavored wines, and a 1978 Mount Eden Pinot Noir which I was convinced was a superb Côte Rotie. Second wine of the night.

Getting back to the gmax, much as I loved it, I could not get away from the cost. Because we tasted it blind, most of the initial guesses were that it was a Clos St. Hune. When the reveal came, I started calculating. The best white I have had in years, and I would have been looking for this in the $200-300 range. But at around $2000, I would never pull the trigger, even after retasting it. I have bought reds in this price range but never a white, and great as it was, I admit to being color prejudiced. I buy whites for current drinking, since premox reared it’s ugly head, so am not used to having bottles with some cellar age and price. But even without the shadow of premox, even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#2 Post by Robert.A.Jr. » February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am

Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#3 Post by Joshua Kates » February 8th, 2019, 5:12 am

Starting to change for me, though I would not and do not spend $2000 on any single bottle of wine. Curious, Mark, what ones you have found worth that? DRC? Older 1st growth Bordeaux? Rousseau? At this point, I'd be inclined to spend that amount on the right older Coche, as I would a Rousseau Chambertin, and honestly, on a certain scale, I suspect both are "worth it," just not a place I myself want to go. (Where, after all, would it stop?)

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#4 Post by PCLIN » February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.
+2
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#5 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » February 8th, 2019, 5:24 am

Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
...even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
Different strokes.

I would not pay the current rate for G-Max, but there are a number of white wines that hit the same pleasure level for me as the top reds.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#6 Post by Gerhard P. » February 8th, 2019, 5:33 am

I also wouldn´t spend that much money for G-Max ... 2000 is recent market price - some time ago it was available for less than 200, and I guess it is no more at the winery IF you can get some.
I know the 2006 (and 3 other vintages), it is a really great Riesling indeed.
The price increase is due to the recent hype - sad, very sad, but hard to work against it.
Keller´s Morstein (and Abtserde) ist not much worse, sometimes even more interesting - but much cheaper ...

Too many people worldwide have too much money - and they don´t care how much a bottles is ... if only they wanna have it ... that ruins the market for other (less wealthy) wine lovers ...
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#7 Post by Fred C » February 8th, 2019, 5:55 am

PCLIN wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.
+2
Interesting. I’m the opposite.

Hard to beat a well aged white from d’Auvenay, Coche, or Roulot.
Ch!3n

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#8 Post by Jayson Cohen » February 8th, 2019, 5:57 am

PCLIN wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.
+2
-1 (= +1?)

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#9 Post by Mattstolz » February 8th, 2019, 6:05 am

Joshua Kates wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:12 am
Starting to change for me, though I would not and do not spend $2000 on any single bottle of wine. Curious, Mark, what ones you have found worth that? DRC? Older 1st growth Bordeaux? Rousseau? At this point, I'd be inclined to spend that amount on the right older Coche, as I would a Rousseau Chambertin, and honestly, on a certain scale, I suspect both are "worth it," just not a place I myself want to go. (Where, after all, would it stop?)
I'm also curious to hear the answer to this. I've had some $100 wines that I cant imagine being much better, and I definitely cant imagine them being 20x better. I'm curious if a $2000 wine is ever truly worth that much more than those 10x less

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#10 Post by John S » February 8th, 2019, 6:10 am

Never had this wine so no comment there.

But I certainly have had whites that blow great reds off the table. There is a reason at DRC one tastes Le Montrachet last after the reds. Yes I have had more reds in this category than white but great whites for me can more than hold their own.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#11 Post by dbailey » February 8th, 2019, 6:17 am

I think there are more reds that moght fit into this “super experience” (for want of a better term) category but there are certainly many whites that also do for me. Not that I would actually pay 2k for any of them!
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#12 Post by dbailey » February 8th, 2019, 6:18 am

PS I’ve been lucky enough to have the 06 g-max 3 times and it is fantastic!
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#13 Post by Russell Faulkner » February 8th, 2019, 6:26 am

-1

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#14 Post by Mark Golodetz » February 8th, 2019, 6:39 am

Joshua Kates wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:12 am
Starting to change for me, though I would not and do not spend $2000 on any single bottle of wine. Curious, Mark, what ones you have found worth that? DRC? Older 1st growth Bordeaux? Rousseau? At this point, I'd be inclined to spend that amount on the right older Coche, as I would a Rousseau Chambertin, and honestly, on a certain scale, I suspect both are "worth it," just not a place I myself want to go. (Where, after all, would it stop?)
Most of my really expensive wines are old Bordeaux, many of which are going to be used in verticals. A few I buy whenever I see a great bottle and I love the wine e.g 1955 and 1961 LMHB.

There are a few curiosities I want to taste, a 1947 VCC, a 1921 Yquem, but very few are Burgundies, especially now that prices have gone through the roof. In fact I am happy to sell or trade them.

Last month I traded a pair of 1999 Rousseaus, as I have tasted them several times, and good as they are, they are not worth a fraction of $3k + they are going for. I got in return a magnum of 1947 Ausone and a case of Rossignol Trapet Chambertin 2015.

So no real rules for buying, but I am probably more conscious than most of how much they cost, and whether they make sense to buy, sell or keep.
Last edited by Mark Golodetz on February 8th, 2019, 6:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#15 Post by todd waldmann » February 8th, 2019, 6:54 am

Just last night (as my wife and I were enjoying a too young, but delicious '17 Weinbach Riesling Schlossberg), I was contemplating this very notion of the relative appeal of whites vs. reds. Ten years ago, I would have wholeheartedly agreed with Mark that red wines in general, and the greatest reds in particular, provide more pleasure than whites. I am very much in the opposite camp now.

As to the G-Max question, I have had the opportunity to taste the '09. It was fantastic, but I couldn't rationalize spending $2,000 on any wine, regardless of color....
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#16 Post by Robert.A.Jr. » February 8th, 2019, 6:55 am

Mark -

Love VCC. What’s the story with the ‘47?

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#17 Post by Mark Golodetz » February 8th, 2019, 6:59 am

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 6:55 am
Mark -

Love VCC. What’s the story with the ‘47?
Nothing much; I have feelers out for a great example, but only with top vendors who know what they are doing. A lot of fakes, which I understand were from Rodenstock.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#18 Post by Kirk.Grant » February 8th, 2019, 7:00 am

Gerhard P. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:33 am
I also wouldn´t spend that much money for G-Max ... 2000 is recent market price - some time ago it was available for less than 200, and I guess it is no more at the winery IF you can get some.
I know the 2006 (and 3 other vintages), it is a really great Riesling indeed.
The price increase is due to the recent hype - sad, very sad, but hard to work against it.
Keller´s Morstein (and Abtserde) ist not much worse, sometimes even more interesting - but much cheaper ...

Too many people worldwide have too much money - and they don´t care how much a bottles is ... if only they wanna have it ... that ruins the market for other (less wealthy) wine lovers ...
I agree with this, but finding the Abtserde is getting equally as difficult to obtain and the price is climbing steadily as it often is splitting hairs in quality between that and the G-Max for quality.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#19 Post by William Kelley » February 8th, 2019, 7:06 am

Fred C wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:55 am
PCLIN wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am


+1

Not even close.
+2
Interesting. I’m the opposite.

Hard to beat a well aged white from d’Auvenay, Coche, or Roulot.
Would hate to do without reds but have to agree with you here.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#20 Post by Kelly Flynn » February 8th, 2019, 7:08 am

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.
Keller makes some great stuff, but at the end of the day I easily side with Henri Murger: "The first duty of wine is to be red."

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#21 Post by Joshua Kates » February 8th, 2019, 7:21 am

Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 6:39 am
Joshua Kates wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:12 am
Starting to change for me, though I would not and do not spend $2000 on any single bottle of wine. Curious, Mark, what ones you have found worth that? DRC? Older 1st growth Bordeaux? Rousseau? At this point, I'd be inclined to spend that amount on the right older Coche, as I would a Rousseau Chambertin, and honestly, on a certain scale, I suspect both are "worth it," just not a place I myself want to go. (Where, after all, would it stop?)
Most of my really expensive wines are old Bordeaux, many of which are going to be used in verticals. A few I buy whenever I see a great bottle and I love the wine e.g 1955 and 1961 LMHB.

There are a few curiosities I want to taste, a 1947 VCC, a 1921 Yquem, but very few are Burgundies, especially now that prices have gone through the roof. In fact I am happy to sell or trade them.

Last month I traded a pair of 1999 Rousseaus, as I have tasted them several times, and good as they are, they are not worth a fraction of $3k + they are going for. I got in return a magnum of 1947 Ausone and a case of Rossignol Trapet Chambertin 2015.

So no real rules for buying, but I am probably more conscious than most of how much they cost, and whether they make sense to buy, sell or keep.
Interesting, when you do verticals are the costs shared/or at least averaged out with the others? (Something like that would make more sense to me.) I've had a fair smattering of 1st growths, none older than from 70's, but for that sort of coin, it would be white or red burg that I would go to...just find a level of complexity there that I experience nowhere else, and in particular, not even in great Bordeaux, but it may well be me who is missing something.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#22 Post by c fu » February 8th, 2019, 8:04 am

William Kelley wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 7:06 am
Fred C wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:55 am
PCLIN wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am


+2
Interesting. I’m the opposite.

Hard to beat a well aged white from d’Auvenay, Coche, or Roulot.
Would hate to do without reds but have to agree with you here.
I am +2 on william And Fred. If I compiled a top 10 all time wines I’ve consumed, white wine would be on the list more than red.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#23 Post by Jonathan Grunzweig » February 8th, 2019, 8:13 am

I'm really enjoying this thread. I've never had a G-Max, and while the dominant share of my spend and of my wine pinnacle moments has each been with reds, not whites, I've found that great Rieslings tend to 'wow' me more than any other red or white, perhaps because of my relative inexperience with, say, an aged Auslese showing that petrol to good effect. I also find that whites are taking an increasing share of my most aspirational spends. Experiencing a Coche or D'Auvenay in fine form (for example) makes it hard not to take that plunge again. I tend to rationalize those stretch purchases by taking note of how the rest of my buys of white wines blend down the average so dramatically. YMMV.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#24 Post by Claus Jeppesen » February 8th, 2019, 8:26 am

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.
Depends among other things on the food
My cellar is 50/50 approx. i drink 50% more white. It pairs better with most dishes IMO
Also it is palate-challenging to drink a red in the kitchen making food, then a white with the first dish, then a red again with the main dish
And red wine with cheese?? Nogo
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#25 Post by Jay Miller » February 8th, 2019, 8:45 am

For me the greatest white wines are just as great as the greatest reds. If not more so.

Not that I'd pay $2K for any bottle of wine unless I win the lottery...
Ripe fruit isn't necessarily a flaw.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#26 Post by MBerto » February 8th, 2019, 9:08 am

I am sqrt(-1) on this
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#27 Post by B. Buzzini » February 8th, 2019, 9:26 am

Hmmm...someone told me 06 gmax sucked? [scratch.gif]

[wink.gif]
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#28 Post by Claus Jeppesen » February 8th, 2019, 9:39 am

2006 sucks in Germany for Trocken Riesling
However Keller did best of all in this discipline
The 2006 G Max is great, but not 2000$ great. Actually the Morstein is better, IMO
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#29 Post by Ed Gonzales » February 8th, 2019, 9:41 am

Fred C wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:55 am
PCLIN wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am


+1

Not even close.
+2
Interesting. I’m the opposite.

Hard to beat a well aged white from d’Auvenay, Coche, or Roulot.
+3.14

or drc monty.

B. Buzzini wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:26 am
Hmmm...someone told me 06 gmax sucked? [scratch.gif]

[wink.gif]
it's not in the same league as the 09. neener
ed s @ n

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#30 Post by David Glasser » February 8th, 2019, 9:51 am

MBerto wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:08 am
I am sqrt(-1) on this
Imagine that...

Never had the G-Max. I've had a few Montrachet and a few Coche and some outstanding Donnhoff and Prum and Chave whites. They rival or equal some of the best reds I've had, but best of the best for my palate are reds. They just push buttons that whites don't. I probably open 10 reds for every white, excluding Champagne and stickies.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#31 Post by c fu » February 8th, 2019, 10:04 am

Ed Gonzales wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:41 am
Fred C wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:55 am
PCLIN wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:23 am


+2
Interesting. I’m the opposite.

Hard to beat a well aged white from d’Auvenay, Coche, or Roulot.
+3.14

or drc monty.

B. Buzzini wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:26 am
Hmmm...someone told me 06 gmax sucked? [scratch.gif]

[wink.gif]
it's not in the same league as the 09. neener
ugh 09 was so good last week. Haunting wine
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#32 Post by Brian King » February 8th, 2019, 10:10 am

I remember buying the 2007's from Crush. < $1000 for a full case that included 1 G-Max, plus Mortein, Kirchspiel, etc. The price on G-Max alone now is downright crazy - I totally agree with the other thread that it seems like price speculation and manipulation is going on behind the scenes. Alas, mine is long gone.. to bad I don't remember it as one of the best wines I've ever had!

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#33 Post by Nathan Smyth » February 8th, 2019, 11:08 am

Last month I traded
Are trades even still legal?

I know the IRS has been chomping at the bit to close that loophole since forever.

Thinking about it some more, and even it strikes me that trades could be felonies in some states.

It's getting to the point where you can't even leave your house without committing one crime or another.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#34 Post by Robert Dentice » February 8th, 2019, 12:18 pm

I am happy you liked it. First all of G-Max is not really $2000. Because of the rarity of it yes there are few stupid examples of retailers trying to sell it for that and I am sure even a person or two that might have paid that for a certain vintage they wanted. Lets assume for this argument that it is a $1000 bottle of wine. What I like about it as a die hard dry Riesling geek it is nice to know that you can buy the rarest and possibly best example of the genre for that price. And of course the wines that are not G-Max but still in this league can be had for $100-200. In Burgundy this would be $4-5k for DRC Montrachet or Coche CC.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#35 Post by Dale Williams » February 8th, 2019, 12:51 pm

This was the first G-Max I had with any age (I'd had a tiny pour at a dinner 10 years ago, when I thought it was expensive but nothing like current pricing). I thought incredible.
Intellectually I don't have any reason to spend less on whites than reds- some of my greatest wines have been whites- but when I sort by price I paid on CT, first 20 or so are red
(and most "whites" that on first page are Champagne or dessert).

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#36 Post by Alan Rath » February 8th, 2019, 1:01 pm

Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:07 am
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
+1

Not even close.
Many less experienced and sophisticated palates say this neener

I'm most interested in Mark's comment that he thought the Gmax was like a Clos St Hune. I have only experienced a couple of each over the years, but I would have said these two wines are at the polar extremes of Riesling (if we take away Zind Humbrecht, and only look at dry Riesling). Especially in 2006, a botrytis vintage in Germany.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#37 Post by Dale Williams » February 8th, 2019, 1:18 pm

I didn't notice any overt botrytis but one person at table immediately said CSH VT when the rest of us were guessing CSH. This had tropical fruit but a lot of minerality, and did remind me of ripe vintage CSH.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#38 Post by Jayson Cohen » February 8th, 2019, 2:05 pm

MBerto wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:08 am
I am sqrt(-1) on this
+exp(i*Pi/2)

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#39 Post by B. Buzzini » February 8th, 2019, 2:13 pm

Since I can't find/afford any GG's...bought some 16 Von Der Fels Trocken. How's it?
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#40 Post by Jayson Cohen » February 8th, 2019, 2:27 pm

I haven’t had g-max in a couple years. 2009 vintage, at a 2017 NY Paulee event I crashed. Pretty remarkable. (Can’t afford it myself.)

I recall the excitement about the 2001 and then the 2002, which IIRC, are what really launched Keller onto the “scene” in the US. The 2001 was very special. My hazy recollection is that Joe Dougherty was very excited, got some on release, and poured it for folks. A Yowsa wine.

On the broader discussion here I’m with Jay Miller. Not surprisingly. Just as many profound red and white wine experiences. So many of my favorite and most memorable wine experiences have been whites. And not just Chardonnays and Rieslings
Last edited by Jayson Cohen on March 17th, 2019, 11:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#41 Post by Robert Dentice » February 8th, 2019, 2:41 pm

Dale Williams wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 1:18 pm
I didn't notice any overt botrytis but one person at table immediately said CSH VT when the rest of us were guessing CSH. This had tropical fruit but a lot of minerality, and did remind me of ripe vintage CSH.
Klaus-Peter commented on a tasting note I posted on another site for 06 G-Max that there was no botrytis.

"2006 was a difficult vintage but the wines develop very well. Yield was low and we did not accept any botrytis for the dry wines. Now - with some bottle age - we know that this was the right decision!"

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#42 Post by Jay Miller » February 8th, 2019, 2:45 pm

David Glasser wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:51 am
MBerto wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:08 am
I am sqrt(-1) on this
Imagine that...
Well played.
Claus Jeppesen wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 9:39 am
2006 sucks in Germany for Trocken Riesling
However Keller did best of all in this discipline
The 2006 G Max is great, but not 2000$ great. Actually the Morstein is better, IMO
The amazing 2006 Morstein GG sent me on a quest to buy their Morstein GG. Still haven't succeeded. I have managed to buy some Keller Morstein Ausleses which are totally different but still fantastic.
Ripe fruit isn't necessarily a flaw.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#43 Post by Sarah Kirschbaum » February 8th, 2019, 3:35 pm

In what is sort of the flip side of Robert's comment about how amazing and wonderful it is that the very pinnacle of dry Riesling is "only" $1000, as compared with many multiples that for the best in other regions, I'm moved to mention how exciting I think it is that a dry Riesling has found a regularly acknowledged place among the very great white wines of world by more than just a few Riesling geeks. Not that many years ago, I doubt many wine lovers' Greatest White Wine lists would have had a Riesling at all, and certainly not a dry one.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#44 Post by Alan Rath » February 8th, 2019, 3:59 pm

Robert Dentice wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 12:18 pm
I am happy you liked it. First all of G-Max is not really $2000. Because of the rarity of it yes there are few stupid examples of retailers trying to sell it for that and I am sure even a person or two that might have paid that for a certain vintage they wanted. Lets assume for this argument that it is a $1000 bottle of wine. What I like about it as a die hard dry Riesling geek it is nice to know that you can buy the rarest and possibly best example of the genre for that price. And of course the wines that are not G-Max but still in this league can be had for $100-200. In Burgundy this would be $4-5k for DRC Montrachet or Coche CC.
I would argue that a goodly number of equally excellent Riesling wines can be had for well under $100. Paying $2000, or even $1000 for G-Max can only be described as idiocy.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#45 Post by Rich K0rz€nk0 » February 8th, 2019, 4:37 pm

Not unusual predominant themes here I see.

Red > white, or white > red, or red and white can get along... Its preferences and palates vary. I love well-aged Rieslings and they can hit notes on the spectrum that reds can't for me, hence why I appreciate them. Reds, my fetish being Burg, can do things you will never find in whites. I appreciate both. Its is about your tastes and honestly your mood some times. So, I split there and I'm equal opportunity.

Now, where I think this all leads IMO, is it worth it? The case in point for Keller (and by extension anything in that magnitude because that's the lot), I struggle with paying that much for any given wine. Like many on here, I feel I can find comparable quality at <3% the cost and I feel that way for QPR and I just like to explore. Then there's just means, everyone's wallets differ. There's things I can splurge on sporadically, and thing's I can't. You don't buy GMax off a Publix shelf. You gotta get out on the market and that leaves you open to counterfeits, bad bottles, bottle variation, shit years, pick something and I would absolutely have an aneurysm if I paid 3 Gs for a flawed bottle.

I like my sanity.
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
At a recent tasting of our SOBER group, our very generous host pulled out a 2006 gmax. It was a glorious wine, full flavored rich, but sporting serious acidity, and wonderful, detailed complexity. I loved the wine, certainly WOTN, and it had some pretty stiff competition, some predictable, some less so. An excellent pair of 1985s, a Lynch Bages from the good release and a Caymus, then a 1989 Mouton, a fine example from a period of coffee flavored wines, and a 1978 Mount Eden Pinot Noir which I was convinced was a superb Côte Rotie. Second wine of the night.

Getting back to the gmax, much as I loved it, I could not get away from the cost. Because we tasted it blind, most of the initial guesses were that it was a Clos St. Hune. When the reveal came, I started calculating. The best white I have had in years, and I would have been looking for this in the $200-300 range. But at around $2000, I would never pull the trigger, even after retasting it. I have bought reds in this price range but never a white, and great as it was, I admit to being color prejudiced. I buy whites for current drinking, since premox reared it’s ugly head, so am not used to having bottles with some cellar age and price. But even without the shadow of premox, even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
Getting back to your impressions, you thought of a Clos St. Hune, did anything else enter your mind on palate? And being more specific toward price range, it was your WOTN, what else at a more reasonable pricing tier stack up to it that you may have thought of (QPR)? There's a great deal in the 200 - 300 range, curious what else ranks there for you to calibrate.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#46 Post by Tom G l a s g o w » February 8th, 2019, 5:01 pm

Rich K0rz€nk0 wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 4:37 pm
Not unusual predominant themes here I see.

Red > white, or white > red, or red and white can get along... Its preferences and palates vary. I love well-aged Rieslings and they can hit notes on the spectrum that reds can't for me, hence why I appreciate them. Reds, my fetish being Burg, can do things you will never find in whites. I appreciate both. Its is about your tastes and honestly your mood some times. So, I split there and I'm equal opportunity.

Now, where I think this all leads IMO, is it worth it? The case in point for Keller (and by extension anything in that magnitude because that's the lot), I struggle with paying that much for any given wine. Like many on here, I feel I can find comparable quality at <3% the cost and I feel that way for QPR and I just like to explore. Then there's just means, everyone's wallets differ. There's things I can splurge on sporadically, and thing's I can't. You don't buy GMax off a Publix shelf. You gotta get out on the market and that leaves you open to counterfeits, bad bottles, bottle variation, shit years, pick something and I would absolutely have an aneurysm if I paid 3 Gs for a flawed bottle.

I like my sanity.
Mark Golodetz wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:04 am
At a recent tasting of our SOBER group, our very generous host pulled out a 2006 gmax. It was a glorious wine, full flavored rich, but sporting serious acidity, and wonderful, detailed complexity. I loved the wine, certainly WOTN, and it had some pretty stiff competition, some predictable, some less so. An excellent pair of 1985s, a Lynch Bages from the good release and a Caymus, then a 1989 Mouton, a fine example from a period of coffee flavored wines, and a 1978 Mount Eden Pinot Noir which I was convinced was a superb Côte Rotie. Second wine of the night.

Getting back to the gmax, much as I loved it, I could not get away from the cost. Because we tasted it blind, most of the initial guesses were that it was a Clos St. Hune. When the reveal came, I started calculating. The best white I have had in years, and I would have been looking for this in the $200-300 range. But at around $2000, I would never pull the trigger, even after retasting it. I have bought reds in this price range but never a white, and great as it was, I admit to being color prejudiced. I buy whites for current drinking, since premox reared it’s ugly head, so am not used to having bottles with some cellar age and price. But even without the shadow of premox, even the greatest white wines do not have the appeal to me of the great reds.
Getting back to your impressions, you thought of a Clos St. Hune, did anything else enter your mind on palate? And being more specific toward price range, it was your WOTN, what else at a more reasonable pricing tier stack up to it that you may have thought of (QPR)? There's a great deal in the 200 - 300 range, curious what else ranks there for you to calibrate.
Well if you think you can find G-Max quality for under $30 a bottle more power to you.

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#47 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » February 8th, 2019, 5:08 pm

It’s not under $30 (more like $50) but a Nigl Riesling Privat that I had late in 2018 was one of the single greatest wines of my life. It stopped me in my tracks, which is something I have experienced with very few wines, red or white.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#48 Post by Tom G l a s g o w » February 8th, 2019, 5:53 pm

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 5:08 pm
It’s not under $30 (more like $50) but a Nigl Riesling Privat that I had late in 2018 was one of the single greatest wines of my life. It stopped me in my tracks, which is something I have experienced with very few wines, red or white.
I’m not disputing that there may be occasional examples, but as a regular occurrence? How many mature GMax have you had?

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Re: My first Keller gmax

#49 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » February 8th, 2019, 6:22 pm

Only a couple.

I had G Max before it became a thing. I thought it was good, but didn’t consider it some sine qua non of Riesling. I am generally not bowled over by Keller.

I have been blown away by other white wines, including Trimbach CSH Hors Choix, J. J. Christoffel Eiswein, J.J Prum Auslese, Muller Catoir Scheurebe Spatlese, Hirtzberger Singerriedel, etc.
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Re: My first Keller gmax

#50 Post by Tom G l a s g o w » February 8th, 2019, 6:26 pm

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
February 8th, 2019, 6:22 pm
Only a couple.

I had G Max before it became a thing. I thought it was good, but didn’t consider it some sine qua non of Riesling. I am generally not bowled over by Keller.

I have been blown away by other white wines, including Trimbach CSH Hors Choix, J. J. Christoffel Eiswein, J.J Prum Auslese, Muller Catoir Scheurebe Spatlese, Hirtzberger Singerriedel, etc.
Never Donnhoff? Careful.

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