Orange wines are so dead at retail they are zombies.

No store has them and them that do can’t sell them. The zombie of wines. I’m pretty sure Binny’s doesn’t even have any, and they do, they keep them in the basement away from prying eyes.

Dead on arrival.

rarely ever see em on resto wine lists, website listings or email offerings as well

A cadre of hipsters has effectively cornered the market, so if you don’t have a connection with the in-crowd, content yourselves with the obtainable, pedestrian, un-transmogrified, pale Wonderbread wines you deserve.

Really looking forward to “The Walking Skin-Fermented Pinot Gris” on Netflix.

Such strange times now that Binny’s has become the bellwether of fine wine.

RT

top 4

Anyone wanna split a half case?

Wow Kim Crawford 2018! That was a quick turnaround.

They’re 6 months ahead down there mate, and that’s not one for any significant barrel aging.

Why all the hate on orange wines?

Duh
www.floridawine.com

Ahh there ya go. We could take that out to the parking lot and toast!

Or marinate meat

This

Wouldn’t you need to split the Manage a Trois with two other people??? Depending on the third I might be interested…

Skin fermented whites have always come across as more of a gimmick than anything else to me that does nothing to improve the wine. The art and craft of winemaking is literally centuries old. Does anyone really think that in the centuries that preceded us, not one person tried skin contact on white wines previously? Of course it’s been tried historically and rejected. Yet other outright accidents like Amarone and Pineau have survived. There’s likely a good reason red wine and white wine production evolved the way that they did. Of the few orange wines I have tried, not one convinced me that white wine should be produced with the skin contact method.

Orange wines are skin fermented whites that have oxidized in the winemaking process. White grapes are very susceptible to oxidation, so that’s what you get if you make them traditionally/passively. But, importantly, they don’t have to be made in an oxidative fashion. Done well, that means they don’t lose freshness or complex aromatics, or become oxidative (and mucky), while gaining complexity, texture and tannin from the skins. I don’t use the two terms interchangeably, as one is a subset of the other.

Also, I am finding more well done orange wines. I suspect we’ll be seeing more as things sort out, More inspired winemakers will figure it out and the sub-mediocre ones will no longer be acceptable to the uberhipsters… These have a controlled oxidation, like you might get with a flor, retaining vibrancy and gaining complexity.

So you’ve tried a few orange wines and based on that you are condemning a whole style of wine? Sounds like as reasonable if I claimed no red wine should be made, I’ve tasted both a Gallo Cabernet AND a Yellow Tail Shiraz!

This was an odd claim. I’ve had lots of orange wines showing no oxidative character.

Odd. Orange from what, then? If it’s from skin color (ie. Ramato), that’s the other category that I talked about. I think it’s important to differentiate between oxidative and non-oxidative skin contact whites. Color is from one, the other, or both. (Then again, my experience making skin contact whites is limited to the last two vintages, with Semillon, Grenache Blanc, Pinot Gris, Ribolla Giala and Falanghina, so what do I know…)

Why is it important to differentiate between oxidative and non-oxidative skin contact whites? No-one differentiates oxidative red wines or white wines either (and I’m now speaking of wines that are aged in oak, clay or concrete, i.e. oxidatively - not truly oxidative wines like vin jaune, tawny port, madeira or vi rancio).

After all, most of the orange / amber wines I’ve had have most of their color mainly from skin contact, not from oxidation - seeing that they are more golden yellow than true orange in color. Some that are from the deeper end of the orange hue definitely are made more oxidatively or are made from varieties with more red skin color for sure, but wines like those are in a minority among the numerous orange wines I’ve had.