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TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 6:37 pm
by Jeremy Holmes
  • 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape - France, Rhône, Southern Rhône, Châteauneuf-du-Pape (12/6/2018)
    Smells of raspberries, moss, compost and meat. It has a low-acid feel with sweet fruit that has a chocolatey edge. It finishes with some wild herb action.
Posted from CellarTracker

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 6:42 pm
by Mark C Johnson
Did you like it? Would you order it in a restaurant? Sounds like you're border-line?

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 6:52 pm
by Mich@el Ch@ng
This is one of my favorite wines. We poured it at our wedding.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 7:04 pm
by Jeremy Holmes
Hi Mark, it was a fairly tasty wine. I wouldn't seek it out but happy to drink another glass if it came my way.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 8:32 pm
by Jason T
Jeremy, it was hard for me to read into whether you liked it as well. Though as always your note was wonderfully concise and compelling such that you had me hooked until I got to the bit about “low acid” and “chocolatey edge”. Sounds interesting though!

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 11:18 pm
by Mark C Johnson
Jeremy Holmes wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 7:04 pm
Hi Mark, it was a fairly tasty wine. I wouldn't seek it out but happy to drink another glass if it came my way.
OK, that makes sense. [wink.gif]

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 6th, 2018, 11:32 pm
by Gerhard P.
Jason T wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 8:32 pm
Jeremy, it was hard for me to read into whether you liked it as well. Though as always your note was wonderfully concise and compelling such that you had me hooked until I got to the bit about “low acid” and “chocolatey edge”. Sounds interesting though!
Sorry, I don´t think a TN is "wonderful ..." if one has to ask if the writer liked the wine, if it was good, fine, less good or whatever.
Me too was left [scratch.gif] until I read further downside ...
[shrug.gif]

BTW: it´s been a while since I tasted the 07 B. but it has always left me unmoved ... good wine, but no better than a good drink, nothing special (even a bit boring) and for that too expensive indeed.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 1:17 am
by joz€f p1nxten
Jeremy Holmes wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 7:04 pm
Hi Mark, it was a fairly tasty wine. I wouldn't seek it out but happy to drink another glass if it came my way.
Good to know, I remember my father buying a couple of cases of this and the Hommage, under the influence of RP. They have been way too powerful for me, curious to know if that is changing.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 3:58 am
by David Glasser
Beaucastel has been one of my favorite CduP, one of my favorite wines, since the late 70s. It’s one of very few 2007 I haven’t sold off, and I’ve been following it in halves while waiting for it to mature before getting into the 750s. I had hopes, but my most recent bottle was not encouraging.
  • 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape - France, Rhône, Southern Rhône, Châteauneuf-du-Pape (11/14/2018)
    Another half-bottle cellared since release, and 2 and 1/2 years since my last try. Perfect cork and fill. Dark red to rim. Dark fruits, sweet cherries, meaty/savory notes on the nose. Ripe sweet fruit sliding into over-ripe and raisiny without carrying the meaty/savory components over from the nose. Decent balancing acidity and a medium long finish. This is disappointing as the last half-bottle was showing signs of starting to go in the right direction, trading the excessively sweet ripeness for more savory notes. This bottle is backsliding. Still very good as a cocktail wine but that’s not what I’ve been cellaring them for. I’ll wait another 3-5 years on the next one but my optimism has faded.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 5:05 am
by Kelly Walker
Sounds like a typical '07. I am not a fan of the ripeness of the vintage in general. Low acid, sweet and chocolatey are not my cup of tea or latte.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 5:07 am
by Fred C
Jason T wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 8:32 pm
Jeremy, it was hard for me to read into whether you liked it as well. Though as always your note was wonderfully concise and compelling such that you had me hooked until I got to the bit about “low acid” and “chocolatey edge”. Sounds interesting though!
I think you have to remember that Jeremy is a nice guy and might even know some of the producers or families making these wines.

His notes are usually spot on and a little reading between the lines may be required in some instances.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 5:20 am
by Robert.A.Jr.
David Glasser wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 3:58 am
Beaucastel has been one of my favorite CduP, one of my favorite wines, since the late 70s. It’s one of very few 2007 I haven’t sold off, and I’ve been following it in halves while waiting for it to mature before getting into the 750s. I had hopes, but my most recent bottle was not encouraging.
  • 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape - France, Rhône, Southern Rhône, Châteauneuf-du-Pape (11/14/2018)
    Another half-bottle cellared since release, and 2 and 1/2 years since my last try. Perfect cork and fill. Dark red to rim. Dark fruits, sweet cherries, meaty/savory notes on the nose. Ripe sweet fruit sliding into over-ripe and raisiny without carrying the meaty/savory components over from the nose. Decent balancing acidity and a medium long finish. This is disappointing as the last half-bottle was showing signs of starting to go in the right direction, trading the excessively sweet ripeness for more savory notes. This bottle is backsliding. Still very good as a cocktail wine but that’s not what I’ve been cellaring them for. I’ll wait another 3-5 years on the next one but my optimism has faded.
Sorta my experience with the Vieux Telegraphe as well, ended up giving it all to my father.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 5:28 am
by Chris S p i k e s
Gerhard P. wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 11:32 pm
Jason T wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 8:32 pm
Jeremy, it was hard for me to read into whether you liked it as well. Though as always your note was wonderfully concise and compelling such that you had me hooked until I got to the bit about “low acid” and “chocolatey edge”. Sounds interesting though!
Sorry, I don´t think a TN is "wonderful ..." if one has to ask if the writer liked the wine, if it was good, fine, less good or whatever.
Me too was left [scratch.gif] until I read further downside ...
[shrug.gif]

BTW: it´s been a while since I tasted the 07 B. but it has always left me unmoved ... good wine, but no better than a good drink, nothing special (even a bit boring) and for that too expensive indeed.
I'm on the other side of your opinion. I like it when a tasting note is accurate and quickly descriptive and doesn't delve too much into the subjectivity of wine tasting. Each of us have our own preferences. Obviously, if the wine was absolutely terrible or superb to the taster, that would be important if they gave justifications for their opinion.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 5:55 am
by Victor Hong
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 5:20 am
David Glasser wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 3:58 am
Beaucastel has been one of my favorite CduP, one of my favorite wines, since the late 70s. It’s one of very few 2007 I haven’t sold off, and I’ve been following it in halves while waiting for it to mature before getting into the 750s. I had hopes, but my most recent bottle was not encouraging.
  • 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape - France, Rhône, Southern Rhône, Châteauneuf-du-Pape (11/14/2018)
    Another half-bottle cellared since release, and 2 and 1/2 years since my last try. Perfect cork and fill. Dark red to rim. Dark fruits, sweet cherries, meaty/savory notes on the nose. Ripe sweet fruit sliding into over-ripe and raisiny without carrying the meaty/savory components over from the nose. Decent balancing acidity and a medium long finish. This is disappointing as the last half-bottle was showing signs of starting to go in the right direction, trading the excessively sweet ripeness for more savory notes. This bottle is backsliding. Still very good as a cocktail wine but that’s not what I’ve been cellaring them for. I’ll wait another 3-5 years on the next one but my optimism has faded.
Sorta my experience with the Vieux Telegraphe as well, ended up giving it all to my father.
Despicable. neener

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 6:53 am
by Ramon C
Have 2 of these that I never tried, but bought since release. Those "low acid", "chocolatey", "excessively sweet", "over-ripe", and "cocktail wine" notes are not making me enthusiastic about pulling 1 from the offsite storage. Fwiw, thanks for the notes.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 7:59 am
by David Glasser
Robert.A.Jr. wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 5:20 am
David Glasser wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 3:58 am
Beaucastel has been one of my favorite CduP, one of my favorite wines, since the late 70s. It’s one of very few 2007 I haven’t sold off, and I’ve been following it in halves while waiting for it to mature before getting into the 750s. I had hopes, but my most recent bottle was not encouraging.
  • 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape - France, Rhône, Southern Rhône, Châteauneuf-du-Pape (11/14/2018)
    Another half-bottle cellared since release, and 2 and 1/2 years since my last try. Perfect cork and fill. Dark red to rim. Dark fruits, sweet cherries, meaty/savory notes on the nose. Ripe sweet fruit sliding into over-ripe and raisiny without carrying the meaty/savory components over from the nose. Decent balancing acidity and a medium long finish. This is disappointing as the last half-bottle was showing signs of starting to go in the right direction, trading the excessively sweet ripeness for more savory notes. This bottle is backsliding. Still very good as a cocktail wine but that’s not what I’ve been cellaring them for. I’ll wait another 3-5 years on the next one but my optimism has faded.
Sorta my experience with the Vieux Telegraphe as well, ended up giving it all to my father.
Haven’t opened a 2007 VT since release. That and Charvin are the only other 07 CduP still in the cellar. If they don’t show any better in a few years I’ll just have to hold them until my palate is old and numb enough to crave that high octane stuff.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 8:07 am
by Robert.A.Jr.
Hopefully I’ll be dead then. ;)

Here lies Alfert
May green grass grow
And horses come to pasture
He liked his wine
Like his country farm
Just a bit stinky

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 9:10 am
by Paul Jaouen
Kelly Walker wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 5:05 am
Sounds like a typical '07. I am not a fan of the ripeness of the vintage in general. Low acid, sweet and chocolatey are not my cup of tea or latte.
Yep and I love Beaucastel generally.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 9:20 am
by Mich@el Ch@ng
We had a bottle last year which was great. Had s fascinating plum note I haven’t seen in other vintages.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 10:35 am
by Scott G r u n e r
I don't have a ton of 07's, but for the traditionally strong producers that I like (beau, VT, etc) my strategy is just to wait it out and hope for the best. If they are still meh in 5+ more years, I will pour them at an office event.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 11:16 am
by Jim Anderson
Bet it would have shown better had you had the foresight to pair it with a nice piece of white fish.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 12:03 pm
by Jason T
Fred C wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 5:07 am

I think you have to remember that Jeremy is a nice guy and might even know some of the producers or families making these wines.

His notes are usually spot on and a little reading between the lines may be required in some instances.
Fred, fair point. And my read from this note and prior ones from Jeremy was pretty much as he described it in his reply, though I wasn't positive. I definitely don't think it's mandatory that someone says with a note 'I liked this wine'.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 5:46 pm
by David Glasser
Jim Anderson wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 11:16 am
Bet it would have shown better had you had the foresight to pair it with a nice piece of white fish.
[snort.gif]
A magnum would have been 4 times better than my 375.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 6:13 pm
by dsimmons
For my tastes, bottles I drank in 2014 and 2016 were great. I have two remaining but plan to hold for a while.

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 7th, 2018, 6:44 pm
by James Billy
Fred C wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 5:07 am
Jason T wrote:
December 6th, 2018, 8:32 pm
Jeremy, it was hard for me to read into whether you liked it as well. Though as always your note was wonderfully concise and compelling such that you had me hooked until I got to the bit about “low acid” and “chocolatey edge”. Sounds interesting though!
I think you have to remember that Jeremy is a nice guy and might even know some of the producers or families making these wines.

His notes are usually spot on and a little reading between the lines may be required in some instances.
Could be! Or maybe, coming from the Barossa where low acid wines are the normal and chocolate isn't a dirty word, he didn't want to imply those descriptor were automatically negative. Who knows?!

Jeremy? Also did you see the ripeness thread? Someone was asking about Barossa terroir. I'm sure you could enlighten us on certain points!

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 8th, 2018, 3:47 am
by Gerhard P.
Jason T wrote:
December 7th, 2018, 12:03 pm
...
I definitely don't think it's mandatory that someone says with a note 'I liked this wine'.
No, not necessarily, but someone should say whether the wine is good, bad, fine, horrible ... or whatever ... (iho)

Re: TN: 2007 Château de Beaucastel Châteauneuf-du-Pape

Posted: December 8th, 2018, 11:39 am
by Jeremy Holmes
I didn't see the ripeness thread James. I'll have a look for it.