RHYS, Open Forum on Rhys and other Darlings

I was just reading a forum topic on dumb purchases and a couple of people mentioned Rhys wines, I was a bit surprised. Rhys has been one of the board darlings as well as critics. Personally I have enjoyed many of their reds and whites with few disappointments. A previous darling of the past had been KB. I tried several and could not find one I liked, so I understand the darling trap. I also got burned on the PC darling,

What have been your impressions of Rhys? What other darling burns have you experienced?

The board has cycled through a number of favorites, loved by all, and then dropped by many. Quilceda Creek, KB, and Paloma are a few that come to mind.

I don’t think that we are allowed to use the term board “darling” here. Neither “fanboy”.

The John Lennon quote is most appropriate. I think the clever definition of Puritanism is something like “The overriding fear that someone, somewhere, is probably happy”.

I have enjoyed the Rhys wines and find they age quite nicely. 2007 is a bit hard and there have been a few stumbles on the way, but his is a young winery in unknown terroir after all. I have been to the winery, they are meticulous, fanatical about production, and don’t wildly overcharge for their product. Yes there are still some GC Burgundy producers that outshine almost every other pinot producer on the planet, at least for some palates. The Rhys wines are not overblown, candied, or spoofed up products meant to wow you immediately out of the glass. They do better with at least a modest degree of age. Is this a huge disappointment? A huge disappointment is pulling a 17 yo GC Burg that is north of $400 on the market and thinking Meh? (a 2001 Cdlr that will stay unnamed…)

There are some here I am afraid that if they do not diss the cheerfully happy, they will feel unsophisticated and common. Better to adore the <0.001% of wines that will never be tasted by most of us, and likely never submitted to the ruthlessness of blind comparison to other wines. This is the same mindset that produced the Judgment of Paris.

I will allow that some palates may find the Rhys wines not to their liking, nor meet the lavish praise heaped upon them by Mr Gilman. I am sorry they are regretful. Many board members would be happy to remove the offending bottles from their cellars at a mild discount if this is how they feel. Perhaps the real disappointment is due to the fact that they have not wildly escalated in price, or become a cult following. Nobody often disses the Second Flight of Eagles for being (IMHO) wildly overpriced second wines, or Harlan for charging 2x-3x as much as many similar cult-like wines.

My 93 points…

It was a great quote when H.L. Mencken said it in 1917 too.

Not sure who first said, “It ain’t bragging if you can do it”, but I can’t see many reversing their enthusiasm for MACDONALD.

The problem with Gilman (and Alan Meadows too) is that neither has tasted a pinot noir that they have not liked. All of their scores are outstanding, low to mid-90’s which is ridiculous when repeated over-and-over ad infinitum.

You obviously have never read some of Gilman’s scathing prose on wines he does not care for. The reason almost all of John’s coverage is positive is because he has a very limited scope, compared to other publications. He mostly tastes the producers he likes. Meadows has stated in the past that if he finds a producer disappointing for multiple years he may just stop tasting from them. It becomes a self selecting process for the top scorers.

Look, I think part of the hobby is learning that some wines thrive with time sideways and others do not. The price has NO bearing on this…it’s the balance, but then again probably 4 out of 5 of the people in this forum already know that. So the value in our experience and tastings is largely in the efforts to suss out the wines that will and will not improve with age, if you like and want to drink older wines. Unless you just want wines that you can drink immediately for pleasure, and if that’s the case then why would anyone want or need more than a 100 bottle wine fridge?

Then they are not really critics then, are they?

Gilman has gotten a ton of shit for bring overly critical, particularly in the world of Bordeaux. If we’re talking Pinot, perhaps he leans more favorably, but I’d be surprised if he hasn’t been critical of some PN as well

Here’s what I think: With any board darlings you have to understand what you’re getting into. What is the style of the wine, and does it fall in line with your interests. KB was always massive. For those long entrenched in burgundy, or big fans of Oregon pinot noir, there was likely to be little appeal generated by 15% abv pinot noir. Some purchased because of the hype, or some were led to KB pinot noir as a transition from big Napa cabs to pinot. It’s a natural transition if that’s the context. The timing was consistent with the “bigger is better” push that existed in most major regions, from Napa to Australia to Bordeaux to Tuscany. There has since been market correction and a seeming acknowledgement that perhaps you can have too much of a good thing. I see the result being noticeable changes in production style from KB, Pride, and many others.

Now board darlings seem to run a fair line of styles. It is now, as it always has and should have been, buyer beware. I like Ceritas because of its style. I like Rhys because of its price and style. It is not KB. It is a more balanced wine, and I prefer that to monsters. It’s also a PPB that I’m much more comfortable with than many other producers.

I’ve gotten nasty PM’s for some previous, somewhat negative comments on some board darlings. Now we have a thread to discuss it openly. I take that as progress.

I’m more than satisfied with my Rhys purchases. I particularly enjoy their Syrahs and Chardonnays and am happy with the pinots as well

Quality is certainly there on the Rhys wines. Value, due to prices, is probably the issue. But many California wines have the same issue.

Sorry about the PM I was having a bad day.

I’m wondering whether these were domestic wines.

Probably cause The whole moderating team are progressive coastal elites

Yay! Transparency is a Good Thing!

Gold plated iPhones for the whole squad.

I was not a big fan of Rhys when it was wildly popular here. These days it’s one of my fav CA producers. This is mostly based on their post 2012 wines, but I’ve also been quite impressed by the older PNs I’ve picked up on auction, even the appellation PNs.