I’m heading out to a wine bar tonight with my kids who are much cooler than I am. I’m sure there are a number of really good options here, but most of these things are not in my wheelhouse. I’m willing to go in any direction. What looks like the best bet?
Thanks, Doug.
Canonica Barolo 2013.
Hipster list, but well chosen in the idiom.
Some recommendations:
2011 Valette Pouilly Fuisse – a semi-oxidative style, a distinctive Macon
2011 Puffeney Arbois – the cuvee isn’t named, but likely a lightly oxidative wine from a retired master of the Jura
2014 Pinon Vouvray Trois Argiles – Pinon is a wonderful vigneron
2012 Emidio Pepe Pecorino – Expensive, but a delicious indigenous grape done very well
2013 Debize Apinost – A delicious Beaujolais made using Burgundian winemaking (disclosure, I have a minority stake in the importer). Debize recently retired.
2012 Chamonard Morgon – A domaine on the level of Foillard that gets talked about much less.
2013 Texier St. Alban – So long as you’re not dining with David Z., this is a delightful Syrah.
2013 Envinate Lousas – A nice Mencia from Ribeira Sacra. Worth trying if you’re not familiar.
Some of those markups are not bad at all. The Emidio Pepe pecorin sells for around $120 retail, so $155 is not a stretch. The Canonica is great vintage if you like nebbiolo, and the Texier serine is well-priced as well.
You didn’t mention what your ‘wheelhouse’ is. If it’s Apothic, this is the House of Doom!
Hipster list
Totally.
Marcus makes a good point, if you’re looking for Apothic or Rombauer, you’re screwed.
But if you’re there anyway, just go for it!
Prices aren’t too bad and there are a lot of interesting wines, but there’s enough on the white side that you don’t even need to head to the reds.
Domaine de Bongran Viré-Clessé - an iconic wine and worth trying if you’re not familiar. Can even have a bit of botrytis on the grapes but the wines aren’t sweet wines.
Goyo Garcia Cobrero Blanco - it’s made from 100 year old Palomino vines. Very few people actually make Palomino into a still wine in Spain, but there are a few who are experimenting. This has sherry-like oxidative notes, partly from the way it’s made and partly I think, because that’s the nature of Palomino, although I’m not quite certain of that yet. Interesting wine with some cheese or ham or anchovies.
Vigneti Massa, Derthona - that’s made from a grape that was almost extinct for some reason, Timorasso. It has high sugar and spends an extraordinary amount of time on the lees, so it has rich and complex overtones with a lot of fruit. Massa is the guy who saved it from extinction, and it’s a cool wine.
These are all interesting wines too. Although the Bongran and Cobrero are not crowd pleasers. These are idiosyncratic wines.
Musar? Allemand? Not that hipster?
wow! fun list!!! where is this place?
A few of my favorites:
Souhaut Syrah
Enfield’s Huron Lake Chard
Dirty & Rowdy’s Especial
Jolie Laide Trousseau Gris OR Grenache/Syrah
Cornelissen Contadino
Enviante - there’s two, so either of them
and the Bobinet Les Iles – I don’t know this bottle – but Bobinet makes some interesting Loire Cab Francs (natural wine producer ), so at $40 it may just be a fun try and see bottle.
But honestly, everything here looks amazing.
I’m not sure I know what a hipster wine list is, but if someone put a list together with the idea that they wanted it to scream, “I’m smarter than you so look at all the obscure stuff that I know about that you never heard of,” then this is it. If it were me, I would probably be a jerk, call over the sommelier and say, “How could you possibly serve a 2009 Petite Syrah. Everyone knows it’s not drinkable until it’s at least 25 years old.” Then I would order the Dirty and Rowdy and make conversation about being on the same wine discussion BB as the winemaker. I might even throw in a, “What, you’ve never heard of PYCM!” just for emphasis. The Raveneau should be delicious if you want to go that high, but be sure to ask the somm, “Do you think a 2011 Chablis might be premoxed?” Then drop a line about how you hope that Musar doesn’t get bombed by Hezbollah in the Bekka Valley and isn’t it too bad that Gaston passed away.
So. Much. Win.
The thought of 25 year old Coturri is pretty scary (on the other hand the thought of 9 yr old Coturri is pretty scary)
Lots of stuff on that list I’d like to drink, and prices are reasonable for a wine bar. If you don’t want to be especially adventurous, the Cotats, several of the Austrians, all of the Cru Beaujolais, etc are well known examples of their appellations. The Falfas is usually decent for cheap Bordeaux. I’d probably go for the Souhaut Syrah as I used to be a buyer and haven’t seen in a while.
Can confirm that you’ve zeroed in on Doug’s wine preferences. He has a vertical of Cougar juice stretching back to 1980. It’s weirdly impressive, but mostly just weird.
That is one cool list. What do you and your kids like, and what are you looking to spend? I would not be able to pass up the 2013 Gonon St Joseph for $118. If you want to splurge, the 2012 Allemand Reynard at $250 is an absolute restaurant steal (as crazy as that sounds). As Greg says, the Derthona is a delicious crowd pleasing white, especially if you want something more affordable.
I would have gone with the Gonon too, but I have it on good authority that Doug doesn’t drink St Joseph.
Are we allowed to ask the name of this mystery wine bar?
Yes an interesting list and some value (I’ll put in a good word for the Massa Derthona as a very flexible wine with food matches). Bongran with some age on it might be worth a thought
I did a bit of a ![[shock.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/0b1dcf699ec319f43254f92e3f145786dcd93904.gif "shock"){kind=small}
at the price of the 1993 Musar though
Musar is significantly more expensive here than it is in the UK. There’s also a relatively steep cost increase once you get anything older than the late 90s.
+1 on what Alan has said. Hard to pass on Allemand at those prices if you like the wines. Pretty much below retail in 2018 dollars.
For a red, I am a Burg guy so I would go with the Meo-Camuzet Marsannay. For a white, maybe the Pattes Loup or the Bongran. On the white side, if you like Vouvray the Pinon seems like a killer value.
Do note that just because I know of some of these wines does not make me cool or a hipster. If anyone suggested such, my children (adults) would roll their eyes and start laughing.
Same here. I’m about as far from a hipster as can be, but I’ve owned or own some of these wines. In some respects a few of them exemplify what people complain about regarding different not meaning better, or even good, but you never know until you try, right? I guess it’s the literal point of jolie-laide, which we don’t have a good English translation of unfortunately.
And some of the wines are not quite so obscure.
He has a vertical of Cougar juice stretching back to 1980. It’s weirdly impressive, but mostly just weird.
I’d be sure to mention that as soon as I stepped into this place.
It would be fun not necessarily to do as Jay suggested, but to ask them for suggestions. Tell them you like the wines made from the SQN grape and ask if they have anything like that. Explain that you don’t like wine that tastes sour but you had one that tasted like marshmallows and you’re looking for something in that vein. I would definitely go to this place.
Wow, what a great list. Gonon and Allemand and Pinon and Nikolaihof and Brundlmayer and Cotat and Pepiere and Texier and Foillard and Chamonard and Fonsalette…
Any of those would be great. I’d avoid Coturri which is always a crap shoot. Lots of producers I’m not familiar with of course but the ones I know lead me to believe that you’d be pretty safe asking the somm for advice.