Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

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YLee
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#651 Post by YLee » February 27th, 2019, 12:55 pm

I am pretty much 95+% when I ask for offers. Speed is the name of the game.
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Nathan V.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#652 Post by Nathan V. » February 27th, 2019, 12:57 pm

Robert M yers wrote:
February 26th, 2019, 12:42 pm
Any idea where all these back vintages come from? Is there a bizarro wine berserkers forum in Europe that they buy from and then peddle over here?
Sort of. For the unheralded producers, they may very well have arrangements direct with the domain and procure ex-cellars. For other things, there is a shadowy world of brokers and such that trade in fine wine. They purchase from collectors, retail outlets, restaurants wherever they can find the labels that people want. Lists are circulated, etc. This breaks a custody chain and makes it difficult for anyone to assess the provenance of the bottles. This is the major issue with grey market wines.

Greg also has a deep reservoir of clients whose cellars he helped build and I'm sure he helps them sell those wines when they need or want to.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#653 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » February 27th, 2019, 1:09 pm

I got a bit of hudelot

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#654 Post by YLee » February 27th, 2019, 6:10 pm

Nathan V. wrote:
February 27th, 2019, 12:57 pm
Robert M yers wrote:
February 26th, 2019, 12:42 pm
Any idea where all these back vintages come from? Is there a bizarro wine berserkers forum in Europe that they buy from and then peddle over here?
Sort of. For the unheralded producers, they may very well have arrangements direct with the domain and procure ex-cellars. For other things, there is a shadowy world of brokers and such that trade in fine wine. They purchase from collectors, retail outlets, restaurants wherever they can find the labels that people want. Lists are circulated, etc. This breaks a custody chain and makes it difficult for anyone to assess the provenance of the bottles. This is the major issue with grey market wines.

Greg also has a deep reservoir of clients whose cellars he helped build and I'm sure he helps them sell those wines when they need or want to.
If provenance is an issue with some of these wines, couldnt some be fakes? I read about 20% of wines are fakes.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#655 Post by Mattstolz » February 27th, 2019, 6:46 pm

YLee wrote:
February 27th, 2019, 12:55 pm
I am pretty much 95+% when I ask for offers. Speed is the name of the game.
I've got about a 80% success rate when I just email Greg and ask him if he has anything from a certain producer coming in soon. it isn't nearly as fun as unpredictable email offers, but it got me some Pergole Torte... so theres that!

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#656 Post by RyanC » February 27th, 2019, 7:07 pm

YLee wrote:
February 27th, 2019, 6:10 pm
Nathan V. wrote:
February 27th, 2019, 12:57 pm
Robert M yers wrote:
February 26th, 2019, 12:42 pm
Any idea where all these back vintages come from? Is there a bizarro wine berserkers forum in Europe that they buy from and then peddle over here?
Sort of. For the unheralded producers, they may very well have arrangements direct with the domain and procure ex-cellars. For other things, there is a shadowy world of brokers and such that trade in fine wine. They purchase from collectors, retail outlets, restaurants wherever they can find the labels that people want. Lists are circulated, etc. This breaks a custody chain and makes it difficult for anyone to assess the provenance of the bottles. This is the major issue with grey market wines.

Greg also has a deep reservoir of clients whose cellars he helped build and I'm sure he helps them sell those wines when they need or want to.
If provenance is an issue with some of these wines, couldnt some be fakes? I read about 20% of wines are fakes.
Anything is possible but most of these back-vintage/cellar wines aren’t prime counterfeit candidates. And that 20% figure surely is wrong. Perhaps for top-vintage or large-format DRC or something like that. But not for Magdelaine and Borgogno.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#657 Post by Nathan V. » February 28th, 2019, 2:04 pm

YLee wrote:
February 27th, 2019, 6:10 pm
Nathan V. wrote:
February 27th, 2019, 12:57 pm
Robert M yers wrote:
February 26th, 2019, 12:42 pm
Any idea where all these back vintages come from? Is there a bizarro wine berserkers forum in Europe that they buy from and then peddle over here?
Sort of. For the unheralded producers, they may very well have arrangements direct with the domain and procure ex-cellars. For other things, there is a shadowy world of brokers and such that trade in fine wine. They purchase from collectors, retail outlets, restaurants wherever they can find the labels that people want. Lists are circulated, etc. This breaks a custody chain and makes it difficult for anyone to assess the provenance of the bottles. This is the major issue with grey market wines.

Greg also has a deep reservoir of clients whose cellars he helped build and I'm sure he helps them sell those wines when they need or want to.
If provenance is an issue with some of these wines, couldnt some be fakes? I read about 20% of wines are fakes.
Sure, they could be fakes but that's no different than any secondary market source. The stuff they get either through official channels or direct from domains like Gaunoux are probably as good as it gets. Envoyer is one of the best in the business. There is just an inherent risk in purchasing these wines. Everything can seem right, labels perfect, capsules spin, etc. but then you open the bottle and the cork is soaked and the wine suffers. This is why I don't buy Burgundy in the secondary market anymore. There is no way for even the best merchants, like Envoyer, to insure the provenance before it got to them. I have violated this rule for HDH auctions, but I generally bid on OWC and for wines that aren't highly traded since I'm looking to drink the wines.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#658 Post by ky1em!ttskus » February 28th, 2019, 2:11 pm

I'm okay if my wine is fake so long as it tastes good. newhere

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#659 Post by YLee » March 1st, 2019, 3:06 pm

A lot of Burgs coming out. Tempted but passed.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#660 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » March 1st, 2019, 3:07 pm

asked for 01 lambrays

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#661 Post by Sh@n A » March 1st, 2019, 3:12 pm

Asked for 1x each of lambray and Camus narbuton
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#662 Post by RyanC » March 1st, 2019, 3:22 pm

Lots tempting in that one but I’m staying strong.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#663 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » March 1st, 2019, 4:06 pm

Thought about the ravaneau but passed.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#664 Post by Dale Bowers » March 1st, 2019, 4:41 pm

I held strong at only 1 bottle.
Cheers!

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#665 Post by Troy Stark » March 6th, 2019, 12:41 pm

Hervieux-Dumez Special Club @ $49.99 = case buy IMO. Great price on great juice.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#666 Post by Mike C. » March 6th, 2019, 12:44 pm

YLee wrote:
March 1st, 2019, 3:06 pm
A lot of Burgs coming out. Tempted but passed.
Don't think I got that March 1 offer (checked spam/deleted emails too). Does Envoyer limit the distribution of some offers to people who've bought the longest/the most?

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#667 Post by ky1em!ttskus » March 6th, 2019, 12:49 pm

Troy Stark wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 12:41 pm
Hervieux-Dumez Special Club @ $49.99 = case buy IMO. Great price on great juice.
Can you give a sense of style? I was tempted, but that’s a new producer for me.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#668 Post by Troy Stark » March 6th, 2019, 12:54 pm

I would say they strike the perfect balance between the two competing styles in Champagne right now (non-dosage high acid vs. briochey-toasty high dosage). Fruit is very pure. Acid is great. Just a touch of brioche.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#669 Post by RyanC » March 6th, 2019, 1:15 pm

The '16 Lumpp Givry today was a no-brainer. The '15 'Clos du Cras Long'--which I grabbed from Envoyer a year or two ago--was phenomenal and a historically great QPR. The Burghound scores for these Lumpp's are high and, in my view, amply justified. They are just silly values and far better than many exalted Cote d'Or premier crus. My experience with the '15 inspired me to grab some Lumpp whenever I find it.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#670 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » March 6th, 2019, 3:31 pm

restocked ramonet 15 clos de la boudriette and 15 chevillon roncieres.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#671 Post by YLee » March 6th, 2019, 8:15 pm

Mike C. wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 12:44 pm
YLee wrote:
March 1st, 2019, 3:06 pm
A lot of Burgs coming out. Tempted but passed.
Don't think I got that March 1 offer (checked spam/deleted emails too). Does Envoyer limit the distribution of some offers to people who've bought the longest/the most?
I'm not aware if they limit to longest/most purchasers but I do know you have to select the types you are interested in. I did that by logging into my account online.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#672 Post by Troy Stark » March 6th, 2019, 10:29 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 3:31 pm
restocked ramonet 15 clos de la boudriette and 15 chevillon roncieres.
How is the boudriotte? I purchased some when it was first offered but haven't opened one yet.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#673 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » March 7th, 2019, 2:43 am

Amazing, fantastic wine.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#674 Post by AndrewH » March 7th, 2019, 6:40 am

YLee wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 8:15 pm
Mike C. wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 12:44 pm
YLee wrote:
March 1st, 2019, 3:06 pm
A lot of Burgs coming out. Tempted but passed.
Don't think I got that March 1 offer (checked spam/deleted emails too). Does Envoyer limit the distribution of some offers to people who've bought the longest/the most?
I'm not aware if they limit to longest/most purchasers but I do know you have to select the types you are interested in. I did that by logging into my account online.
There's something odd though because I'm signed up for "Champagne" but on the Champagne Envoyer thread there are discussions of offers I didn't receive.
Andrew H e i m e r t

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#675 Post by Sh@n A » March 7th, 2019, 6:50 am

If you email them they will ensure you get everything.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#676 Post by Frank Murray III » March 7th, 2019, 7:43 am

ky1em!ttskus wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 12:49 pm
Troy Stark wrote:
March 6th, 2019, 12:41 pm
Hervieux-Dumez Special Club @ $49.99 = case buy IMO. Great price on great juice.
Can you give a sense of style? I was tempted, but that’s a new producer for me.
Kyle, new to me, too. Had to look them up. They're against the hill along D26, just west of Rilly where Vilmart is located. D26 is such a beautiful, 2-lane road that runs along the Montagne...seeing that on the map reminded me of my last trip.

I hate these Special Club bottles but I decided to ask for one bottle so I could give it a go.
My WOTY candidates for 2019:
2014 Marie Courtin Eloquence Blanc de Blancs Extra Brut
2017 Rivers-Marie Pinot Noir Occidental Ridge SC PN
2017 Rivers-Marie Pinot Noir Platt SC PN
2017 Kutch Pinot Noir SC PN
2009 Roederer Cristal Brut

My best wines of 2018:
2017 Kutch Falstaff Sonoma Coast PN
2012 Marguet La Grande Ruelle Ambonnay

Kindness matters.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#677 Post by Sh@n A » March 7th, 2019, 8:17 am

I am a fan of the Roagna 2013s (Pira and VV); already own a bunch at similar pricing.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#678 Post by Troy Stark » March 7th, 2019, 10:18 am

Frank Murray III wrote:
March 7th, 2019, 7:43 am
I hate these Special Club bottles but I decided to ask for one bottle so I could give it a go.
I'm curious why you would lump them all together? There is such a huge variance in all the Club Tresors producers, from Grongnet's oxidative style to Gimonnet's freshness, it seems strange that you couldn't find one you might like.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#679 Post by Neal.Mollen » March 7th, 2019, 10:24 am

Troy Stark wrote:
March 7th, 2019, 10:18 am
Frank Murray III wrote:
March 7th, 2019, 7:43 am
I hate these Special Club bottles but I decided to ask for one bottle so I could give it a go.
I'm curious why you would lump them all together? There is such a huge variance in all the Club Tresors producers, from Grongnet's oxidative style to Gimonnet's freshness, it seems strange that you couldn't find one you might like.
I think that frank is talking about the fat-ass bottles
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#680 Post by Troy Stark » March 7th, 2019, 10:36 am

Neal.Mollen wrote:
March 7th, 2019, 10:24 am
I think that frank is talking about the fat-ass bottles
D'oh! [thankyou.gif]
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#681 Post by Steve Brickley » March 7th, 2019, 9:35 pm

Remembering the good old days when you could reply to Greg and actually get the wine. Lots of sorry these days.
Steve

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#682 Post by Mike C. » March 7th, 2019, 10:07 pm

Somehow did not get a bottle of the Roagna after replying within four minutes.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#683 Post by YLee » March 8th, 2019, 2:57 am

I have been on a vacation. Feels good to actually not buy wines impulsively.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#684 Post by Frank Murray III » March 8th, 2019, 2:09 pm

Troy Stark wrote:
March 7th, 2019, 10:36 am
Neal.Mollen wrote:
March 7th, 2019, 10:24 am
I think that frank is talking about the fat-ass bottles
D'oh! [thankyou.gif]
Correct. Aside from Cedric Mousse's wines, which I love, I won't keep these Special Club bottles in my cellar. It was a weak moment for me to ask for the Hervieux...........I can live with one, I guess. [head-bang.gif]
My WOTY candidates for 2019:
2014 Marie Courtin Eloquence Blanc de Blancs Extra Brut
2017 Rivers-Marie Pinot Noir Occidental Ridge SC PN
2017 Rivers-Marie Pinot Noir Platt SC PN
2017 Kutch Pinot Noir SC PN
2009 Roederer Cristal Brut

My best wines of 2018:
2017 Kutch Falstaff Sonoma Coast PN
2012 Marguet La Grande Ruelle Ambonnay

Kindness matters.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#685 Post by Mattstolz » March 12th, 2019, 5:08 pm

ooohhh envoyer anniversary offers and a NEW WEBSITE!!

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#686 Post by Joshua Kates » March 12th, 2019, 5:13 pm

Tried for the '16 C. Moreau Chablis Le Clos magnums, having fallen in love with this wine, though not this vintage, at La Paulee. Not fast enough, darn. Any lucky souls here?

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#687 Post by RyanC » March 12th, 2019, 5:49 pm

Joshua Kates wrote:
March 12th, 2019, 5:13 pm
Tried for the '16 C. Moreau Chablis Le Clos magnums, having fallen in love with this wine, though not this vintage, at La Paulee. Not fast enough, darn. Any lucky souls here?
I tried within minutes but also missed out. I’m obsessed with C Moreau. Close to Raveneau/Dauvussat for me.
C@ughey

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#688 Post by Mike C. » March 12th, 2019, 9:30 pm

Picked one up--got the email 6:00 and responded 6:01.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#689 Post by CJ Beazley » March 13th, 2019, 4:24 am

Looks like all y’alls wishes have come true...
It's C(raig)

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#690 Post by Joshua Kates » March 13th, 2019, 4:26 am

RyanC wrote:
March 12th, 2019, 5:49 pm
Joshua Kates wrote:
March 12th, 2019, 5:13 pm
Tried for the '16 C. Moreau Chablis Le Clos magnums, having fallen in love with this wine, though not this vintage, at La Paulee. Not fast enough, darn. Any lucky souls here?
I tried within minutes but also missed out. I’m obsessed with C Moreau. Close to Raveneau/Dauvussat for me.
Yep, I love these too--remind me of Raveneau, maybe more than Dauvissat, as they are perhaps less Chablis-like and more just a great, pure white burgundy experience.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#691 Post by Dennis Atick » March 13th, 2019, 1:34 pm

Nice price on Roilette Tardive mags. In.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#692 Post by RyanC » March 13th, 2019, 1:52 pm

Dennis Atick wrote:
March 13th, 2019, 1:34 pm
Nice price on Roilette Tardive mags. In.
No brainer
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#693 Post by Warren Taranow » March 13th, 2019, 1:52 pm

Dennis Atick wrote:
March 13th, 2019, 1:34 pm
Nice price on Roilette Tardive mags. In.
X 4
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#694 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » March 13th, 2019, 4:19 pm

i asked for some too; need to slow my beaujolais purchases though.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#695 Post by Dennis Atick » March 13th, 2019, 4:32 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
March 13th, 2019, 4:19 pm
i asked for some too; need to slow my beaujolais purchases though.
Me too. Hence only asked for a couple.
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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#696 Post by ky1em!ttskus » March 13th, 2019, 4:39 pm

Dennis Atick wrote:
March 13th, 2019, 4:32 pm
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
March 13th, 2019, 4:19 pm
i asked for some too; need to slow my beaujolais purchases though.
Me too. Hence only asked for a couple.
Silly price except.... Beaujo is grosso. [smileyvault-ban.gif]

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#697 Post by alan weinberg » March 14th, 2019, 8:45 am

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
March 13th, 2019, 4:19 pm
i asked for some too; need to slow my beaujolais purchases though.
realized a few months ago I had 10 cases of 2009 Bojo and I don’t even drink it. Kids and a couple avenues fixed that issue.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#698 Post by Adam Noble » March 15th, 2019, 3:11 pm

Well, I'm now priced out of the Gonon market. C'est la vie. I have plenty from previous vintages and if I can find any for less that $90 perhaps I'll spring, but it's not a $90 wine to me.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#699 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » March 15th, 2019, 4:09 pm

Its def pricey. I grabbed a few for the vertical but that's it.

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Re: Envoyer Thread #2: Everything else

#700 Post by Adam Noble » March 15th, 2019, 4:12 pm

There are plenty of N Rhone syrahs I like at least as much for less money. Including from Cote Rotie and Cornas.

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