The Sugar Paradox

I see this over and over in our tasting room, no matter the sophistication level.

https://www.wine-searcher.com/m/2018/04/the-sugar-paradox-one-lump-or-two

“Moreover, nations like Australia have been major victims of this dogmatic preaching that “less is more”, largely abandoning their ripe, generous style of Chardonnay in favor of something that is often tight as a fist, bone-dry and lacking all charm; like visiting a brothel staffed by the world’s most beautiful women, and bringing along a good book.”

Wow. Where do you start? Utter nonsense.

+1

I was pretty much mouth agape by that part.

Sweetness sells. Maybe not to most of us here, but to the general population. The article is primarily an acknowledgment of that, though the author does throw a few barbs at those who have reigned in the ripeness, sugar and alcohol. The quoted paragraph above is the most outrageous of those barbs.

I could not agree more about the ‘ludicrousy’ of that single paragraph, but the author is spot on, regardless of what the ‘prevailing thoughts’ are on the subject.

Take a look at commercial roses, for instance. The ones that we discuss on this board are NOT what 95% of people are buying and drinking out there. Look at the KJ or Josh or other ‘mass market’ roses and you’ll see that most still have a good dose of RS.

We’ve discussed ad nauseous the RS content of larger red blends like the Prisoner or ‘pinots’ like Meiomi - and why is this the case? Because as David and others have said, sweetness sells. Now the ‘balance’ is to have something ‘fruity’ without being ‘in your face’ sweet because folks want to drink something sweet without have to call it such.

The old adage still works - talk dry but drink sweet

I guess I should have clarified my remark. I see what Raj is saying as the younger drinkers are asking for, tasting and enjoying more bone dry whites and reds, yet they keep buying that OVZ with RS. It must be ingrained in our DNA.

Evan,

I think we in the industry must always remember that folks are ‘gently pushed’ to drink certain styles of wines based on recommendations from ‘gate-keepers’ like Raj or at wine shops, but that does not necessarily mean that they ‘enjoy’ them per se.

Wine is so darned subjective, and I do find that many both new to drinking wines and even many that have been at it for awhile are taken in by the ‘power of suggestion’, but that ‘dry’ may simply not be their thing - and we really need to take that into account when dealing with them.

I continue to find that our industry - and most consumers - tend to ‘look down upon’ folks who prefer their wines to be ‘not as dry’ as many wine geeks do, and to me, that’s a shame . . .

Cheers.

I went to a winery in Northern Virginia (can’t remember the name) Every single wine of the 20 or so they produced had added sugar. And the place was packed with 20 somethings. So, someone is buying the sugar.

Most people prefer sweet to any other flavor. It is ingrained in our DNA to have this preference. 0% surprising it translates to wine tastes.

Yes, and “sweet” means many things in wine too. In my experience, there are very few customers that look down on sweet wines. If they do it tends to become a difficult tasting experience no matter what I’m pouring as they often will not care about any education that they don’t already know and can comment about. I’m very much an ‘each to his own’ person. It IS interesting to me how may times I get sophisticated drinkers (that say they only drink bone dry) buying the sweet Zin. Maybe I shouldn’t think too hard about it as it is similar to people coming in and saying they don’t like Chard but they like THIS Chard. I don’t look down on people for liking what they like, merely an amusing observation.

RS is a tool for winemakers to provide balance to wines.

What is balance?

Balance means that the proportion of acid, sugar and bitterness is such that not one of these metrics stick out like a sore thumb when you taste the wine.

It is worth pointing out that RS does not necessarily mean that sugar was added to the wine.

Personally I prefer high acid and some RS. RS provides a weight to the mouth feel that is lacking in dry wines. Also when you stop a fermentation before going to dryness you often capture something from the fermentation that is frequently lost when the wine goes to dryness. This can be mitigated with colder fermentations. The aromatic compounds in the wine are very volatile and the more time they are subjected to the rapidly percolating CO2 out of the solution the less aromatics the wine will have.

I spoke to another wine maker about this subject and he pointed out that it is mostly white people who start out with a statement like “I only like dry wines”. That was an interesting observation and I have noticed it too. It seems to be a cultural thing that it is ‘proper’ to only like dry wines. I especially enjoy giving someone who claims to only like dry wines something with RS and see them love the wine.

In my opinion, big reds with RS in them (e.g., 0.5%; left over from a stalled fermentation - usually) serves to make the wine feel smoother and to me does not impart much sweetness.

Chris

I think the generally agreed-upon tasting threshold for RS is between 0.08%-2% RS.

Anything below 3 g/l of RS is generally not tasteable, except in the imagination.

Regarding sweetness, would any of you prefer an unripe peach, apple or cherry to a ripe one?

IMHO people who enjoy wine over a period of time “generally” see their taste preferences move from sweeter to less sweet. It is also likely that the progression “generally” depends on how much wine you drink. People who drink more “generally” like less sweetness. And of course these generalities are blurred by the fact that individual tastes are extremely variable. eg. AFWE vs AAFWE views expressed here.

Agreed. It’s pretty impossible to pick up anything between ~0 and 3 g/l of residual sugar.

However, as one normally tends to drink red wines that have been fermented bone dry, you start noticing it at 4-5 g/l, 6-7 g/l gets quite obvious and anything above 8 g/l is excessively jammy. It’s pretty easy to keep track of the RS in wines here in Finland, because the alcohol monopoly discloses the analytical data of all the wines they sell. Probably the only good thing they have managed to do.

However, I’ve noticed that white wines tend to carry their RS much better - most likely it’s mainly because of the higher acidity. Usually 5-6 g/l can easily go unnoticed and anything under 10 g/l normally doesn’t bother me - unless it’s a Riesling, because then there is no upper limit to RS!

IMHO, it is a sad state of affairs and one that placates the sweetness factor into every form of food and drink. Personally, Im finding that I even prefer champagne with less or no dosage. Additionally, of all the folks in my 3 wine groups, only a few have any desire for sweetness and those are BIG dessert wine people primarily. Its really not a paradox. It`s called marketing to the palates of the masses especially in the US. Sugar sells.

the consumer mentality of “talk dry, drink sweet,” is well known to sommeliers… This is very true and summarizes the article very well!!

I spoke to another wine maker about this subject and he pointed out that it is mostly white people who start out with a statement like “I only like dry wines”

First time I’ve seen this fact posted on this board and it’s something most people don’t really think about or know. The wine industry is really marketing to a small market segment and missing a huge opportunity, but it’s pretty obvious when you see the sales of things like Meiomi.

It’s like being in the music industry and trying to sell bluegrass. There’s a group that is interested and they tend to be kind of fanatic, but there’s a much bigger market out there for other products.

The people who know this are not the folks who work in fine wine shops, they’re observant retailers in the big cities who sell an ocean of wine that people on this site wouldn’t know or drink.

You think that the “hidden” taste for sugar in wine is not well known? I would argue on the contrary. I rarely run into an even remotely competent wine shop employee who is not aware of that reality.

This whole discussion, which of course did not start with and will not end with this thread, is tedious and getting very boring. You know what the best wine is? The wine that you like the most. I don’t have to like what you like, and the fact that I like Saxum and you like Baudry does not make me a better person than you (except for Alfert, of course), nor does it make you a better person than me. Nor does it make one of us right and the other wrong.

I have yet to see someone who insists that they only like bone dry 12.5% ABV wine refuse a glass of Yquem, nor have I ever seen a Saxum/Aubert/Schrader drinker refuse a glass of La Tache.