If Pomerol did have a classification....?

Questions for a lazy New Year’s Day.

What would be the order? Lots of questions.

Does Petrus have any rivals?
If not, is there a clear cut number 2?
Where do you put Le Pin?
etc, etc.

Mark I did this when I had some spare time in 2013. Mine would go something like this, with the caveat that by no means are all estates are included:

First - Petrus, Lafleur, Le Pin
Second - VCC, L’Eglise Clinet, La Conseillante, L’Evangile, Trotanoy
Third - La Fleur Petrus, La Tour a Pomerol, La Fleur De Gay, Hosanna, Certan De May
Fourth - Gazin, Le Gay, Petit Village, Bon Pasteur, Nenin
Fifth - Bourgneuf, Rouget, De Sales, La Pointe, Clos Rene, Clos Du Clocher

It’s a tough question for anyone (like me) who so infrequently gets the opportunity to taste Lafleur and Le Pin, particularly Le Pin, which I cannot place. With that caveat I would put Petrus on top. Undeniably. Then for my taste VCC a very clear second. Then Lafleur and Trotanoy. Then La Fleur Petrus. Then I think it gets trickier to rank. I would probably group the following although if you force me, I would choose the following order based on peaks they have hit across vintages to my taste: Latour a Pomerol, La Conseillante, L’Evangille, Certan de May. Then probably Petit Village. After which I start to lose some interest.

I suppose Petrus, Le Pin and Lafleur are at the top, in many vintages.

But there are years when Clinet, VCC, L’Eglise Clinet and Trotanoy are at the same level, and can even produce better wines, but not a consistent basis.

Just below, La Conseillante, L’Evangile, Le Gay and La Violette.

From there, perhaps, Gazin, Hosanna, Enclose Tourmaline, La Fleur Petrus.

Certan de May, Latour Pomerol, Bon Pasteur, Feytit Clinet and others compete fairly well, vintage dependent. There are also quite a few Pomerol that have recently stepped up their game and are quite competitive.

I am a big fan of Pomerol and try to taste and write about the wines often. In fact I just finished a massive update to almost all the wines from Pomerol on my site. Learn about Pomerol Bordeaux Best Wines Chateaux Vineyards Character

Great thread. I had actually intended to ask you, Mark, after you highlighted some classic St Em estates, what your thoughts are on Pomerol Chateaux. My guess is, as a group, we reach close consensus on this storied wine region. I love Pomerol. Sadly, as a country lawyer, there is only so much Pomerol that I can purchase. Petrus is the greatest wine that I have had. And every time I have had a bottle - which is very infrequent - I am blown away. I will also concede it is a concentrated, opulent wine, not the style that I orderinarily chase, but Pomerol seems to do it so well. I have never had Le Pin. Lefleur would be my second (also in that rare opportunity where I have it), and I have a huge soft spot for VCC and then Conseillante. The latter two are pricey, but within reach. The top three, not for us paupers.

Le Pin has no right being in the top tier other than its price.

Imagining an adopted St. Emillon style classification, and going by consistency over the past 30 or 40 years I would say:

1ere A: Petrus, Lafleur, VCC, L’Eglise Clinet, and Trotanoy
1ere B: Le Pin, Le Conseillante, L’Evangile, La Fleur Petrus
1ere C: Latour Pomerol, Certain de May, Gazin, Clinet
Grand Cru Classe: About 20-25 or so other properties (including a lot of the more recent producers).

I haven’t had Petrus or Le Pin ever, and Lafleur once. The first two are so stratospherically priced, I wonder how many people would be qualified to assess them. Reputation? Sure.

Otherwise I’d put VCC, L’Eglise Clinet, Trotanoy and La Conseillante in the top rank.

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I seem to recall there was one other ranking system based on price… [stirthepothal.gif]

A terrific question… should consistency, or peak potential, have the greater weight in a ranking system?

Lol, how true.

For me, Lafleur would have to rank about Pétrus. And Le Pin would come in behind Trotanoy, VCC, L’Evangile, Conseillante and probably Eglise Clinet, but ahead of most of the others. La Fleur Pétrus is very solid these days, however.

I have fond memories of visiting the new Le Pin winery back in 2011. Jacques and Fiona were very gracious hosts to a group of college students, and the wine is certainly dramatic and flamboyant; the sort of wine that meets even high expectations. But I think part of the attraction would have been in getting in, as it were, on the ground floor, buying e.g. the 1982 when it could still be had for the asking. The market price is just silly now.

William, have you noticed any change in Conseillante in vintages 2014-16?

A sidelong question, but it seems relevant given the chats we’ve had about the direction of St. Emilion:

Which Pomerol chateau have remained traditional and which have gone full modern? Or has Pomerol mostly avoided the modernist trend?

This matters to my palate almost as much as “quality”.

That all said, I don’t get to enjoy much Pomerol, but l’Evangile has been awesome in all of the vintages I’ve tried (1982, 1983, 1990, 1995, even the 1981 was quite impressive recently).

Jeff, wasn’t it a bottle of '47 Latour that brought Parker to tears?

I do not drink much pomerol, but have tasted a few vintages of L’Evangile, clinet, gazin, la fleur petrus…never blown away though…that is until I tasted a bottle of '98 La Grave a Pomerol, classic right bank heaven

Clos L’Eglise …No love?

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Crickets…

More a question of limited exposure Marc rather than lack of love…as I mentioned my ranking does not cover all the estates…which you can see listed on Jeff Leve’s site.

On my 1855-style classification, maybe some of the thirds were unlucky not to be categorised as seconds, and VCC would surely be a ‘super second’ … like the LLC of Pomerol.

Having been lucky enough to try Le Pin a few times in my opinion it definitely should be a first growth equivalent. When we tried the 90 against Petrus, Le Pin was the clear winner.

IIRC 61 Latour a Pomerol. I loved the 82 and the 94 was solid for a low tariff.