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Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 11th, 2020, 1:34 pm
by John Danza
Thomas Keim wrote: February 11th, 2020, 12:12 pm '84 and '87 are highly underrated vintages, and worth seeking out for all the names listed above - the '87 Montelena is still one of my all time favorite Cabs with a little bottle age -
I grab 1984 vintage whenever I can get them at a decent price, since it's the year my wife and I were married. I even ran into a Maryland Cabernet from the 1984 vintage and it was still "ok" (barely) 10 years ago.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 12th, 2020, 1:04 pm
by Andrew A r n t f i e l d
Cali Cab from the mid to late 80s that I've opened in the past 3-4 years and that has been more than superb:

Beaulieu GDL
Beringer Private Reserve
Burgess Vintage Selection
Diamond Creek Volcanic Hill, Gravelly Meadow
Dunn (both HM and Napa)
Heitz Martha's
Ridge Monte Bello
Spottswoode

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 5:18 am
by JDavisRoby
I have a 2001 Forman Cab I intend on opening tonight. Been standing up for a couple days now. Any recommendations on decant time? This will be the oldest Forman I’ve opened by about five years.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 6:10 am
by Ed Steinway
Thomas Keim wrote:
'84 and '87 are highly underrated vintages, and worth seeking out for all the names listed above - the '87 Montelena is still one of my all time favorite Cabs with a little bottle age -
Both are excellent vintages for California Cabernet. The 1984 Ridge Monte Bello we had a few years ago was one of the best bottles of wine I have been fortunate enough to drink.

Ed

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 11:21 am
by Brian Lynch
Jim Clary wrote: December 18th, 2018, 6:26 am Recently drank a ‘59 Charles Krug at Press in St. Helena that someone purchased off their list and sent over to the table for me as a gift. It was the wine of the night, a real feat considering we had an ‘89 Haut-Briton and several other treasures sitting on the table. What struck me the most was how youthful it seemed. Really thrilling stuff.
It could have been the MacDonald fruit

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 11:27 am
by Mich@el Ch@ng
75 Charles Krug at Berns was nice.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 1:30 pm
by John Danza
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote: February 14th, 2020, 11:27 am 75 Charles Krug at Berns was nice.
I had a 1979 Charles Krug Zinfandel at Berns a couple of years ago that cost $29 for the bottle. It was outstanding and nowhere near over the hill. I know it's not a Cab, but it shows the ability for these older wines to stay the course over time.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 2:37 pm
by Howard Cooper
John Danza wrote: February 14th, 2020, 1:30 pm
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote: February 14th, 2020, 11:27 am 75 Charles Krug at Berns was nice.
I had a 1979 Charles Krug Zinfandel at Berns a couple of years ago that cost $29 for the bottle. It was outstanding and nowhere near over the hill. I know it's not a Cab, but it shows the ability for these older wines to stay the course over time.
I had a 1978 Ridge Geyserville a couple of years ago that also was fabulous.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 14th, 2020, 2:56 pm
by Anton D
I think we are entering the age where more and more people discover the splendid beauty of aged Cali cabs.

Great thread.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 16th, 2020, 5:35 pm
by Lee Braem
Just drank a bottle of Michel-Schlumberger Reserve 92. Good cork, color still on red side, adequate fruit and great nose. A very good bottle of wine.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 1:58 am
by Andy Sc
Howard Cooper wrote: February 14th, 2020, 2:37 pm
John Danza wrote: February 14th, 2020, 1:30 pm
Mich@el Ch@ng wrote: February 14th, 2020, 11:27 am 75 Charles Krug at Berns was nice.
I had a 1979 Charles Krug Zinfandel at Berns a couple of years ago that cost $29 for the bottle. It was outstanding and nowhere near over the hill. I know it's not a Cab, but it shows the ability for these older wines to stay the course over time.
I had a 1978 Ridge Geyserville a couple of years ago that also was fabulous.
I can second that. I've found the 1972 Geyserville on a restaurant list last year and it was singing. The head sommelier (of a 3 star restaurant) mistook it for a 20y+ old high-end Richebourg. [swoon.gif]

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 3:03 am
by Mark Golodetz
I have been part of several old Zinfandel tastings, and frankly the percentage of disappointments was incredibly high. The only two consistent producers were Ridge and Joseph Swan.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 3:26 am
by Dennis Atick
Andy Sc wrote: February 17th, 2020, 1:58 am
Howard Cooper wrote: February 14th, 2020, 2:37 pm
John Danza wrote: February 14th, 2020, 1:30 pm

I had a 1979 Charles Krug Zinfandel at Berns a couple of years ago that cost $29 for the bottle. It was outstanding and nowhere near over the hill. I know it's not a Cab, but it shows the ability for these older wines to stay the course over time.
I had a 1978 Ridge Geyserville a couple of years ago that also was fabulous.
I can second that. I've found the 1972 Geyserville on a restaurant list last year and it was singing. The head sommelier (of a 3 star restaurant) mistook it for a 20y+ old high-end Richebourg. [swoon.gif]
Ridge Zins from the mid-70s served blind were the best wines of my most recent Berns trips in '16 and '18. Amidst some serious competition.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 4:17 am
by Howard Cooper
Mark Golodetz wrote: February 17th, 2020, 3:03 am I have been part of several old Zinfandel tastings, and frankly the percentage of disappointments was incredibly high. The only two consistent producers were Ridge and Joseph Swan.
Frankly, the only Zins I drink are from Ridge (at any age), although I would like to try Swan.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 4:20 am
by Howard Cooper
Anton D wrote: February 14th, 2020, 2:56 pm I think we are entering the age where more and more people discover the splendid beauty of aged Cali cabs.

Great thread.
I hope that this is not happening at a time when some classic producers (like Phelps) who made wines for a long time that aged very well have moved to the dark side.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 4:22 am
by Howard Cooper
JDavisRoby wrote: February 14th, 2020, 5:18 am I have a 2001 Forman Cab I intend on opening tonight. Been standing up for a couple days now. Any recommendations on decant time? This will be the oldest Forman I’ve opened by about five years.
How was the wine?

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 11:39 am
by Mel Knox
As I recall the old C Krug Vintage Selects were based on fruit from the See Ranch, now part of Silverado

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: February 17th, 2020, 11:51 am
by JDavisRoby
Howard Cooper wrote: February 17th, 2020, 4:22 am
JDavisRoby wrote: February 14th, 2020, 5:18 am I have a 2001 Forman Cab I intend on opening tonight. Been standing up for a couple days now. Any recommendations on decant time? This will be the oldest Forman I’ve opened by about five years.
How was the wine?
It was great! The dusty, cassis and tobacco nose and complex texture I love on older Bordeaux varietals. But, still enough fruit up front and acid in the mid palate which I believe says it had lots of life left. Cork was in great shape.

Opened a 2014 Angelus No 3 after. What a huge difference!

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 19th, 2020, 1:56 pm
by Victor Hong
The early-1990s stuff has really disappeared from auction and retailer sites. Note the observation in Commerce Corner.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=169982

I wonder why.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 21st, 2020, 1:29 pm
by John Danza
Victor Hong wrote: May 19th, 2020, 1:56 pm The early-1990s stuff has really disappeared from auction and retailer sites. Note the observation in Commerce Corner.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=169982

I wonder why.
My go-to for this stuff is typically Winebid. There seems to be a decent number of lots available this week.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 21st, 2020, 2:25 pm
by NED VALOIS
'74/'78 Mondavi Reserve !

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 10:41 am
by Glenn L e v i n e
Just a joyous bottle which made up for some duds on the actual birthday.

This wine had real energy, both sweet & tart fruit easily appreciated, length without bitterness. Tannins resolved but not completely absent yet. Delicious bottle.
A3C8C12C-7AE7-4CB6-9F30-C7C260671F4A.jpeg

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 11:04 am
by Dave McIsaac
Glenn L e v i n e wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 10:41 am Just a joyous bottle which made up for some duds on the actual birthday.

This wine had real energy, both sweet & tart fruit easily appreciated, length without bitterness. Tannins resolved but not completely absent yet. Delicious bottle.

A3C8C12C-7AE7-4CB6-9F30-C7C260671F4A.jpeg
Birth year wine, G?? [wink.gif]

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 12:41 pm
by William Anzalone
Last nights RIDGE Monte Bello with Age Roundtable featured the 1990, 2001 and 2002. This event has been talked about in another chat but below I attached a link to the 1990 bottle 375 ml that can be purchased directly from Ridge. Its expensive but in-line with the 1 and only 1990 bottle found on Wine Searcher. Since the event was last night, I believe this bottle will only be available for a very brief time. It was for sale for last night's event but its still on the website. Its $190 and if you are a member of any of the Ridges programs you get 10% off ($171). There is also free 2 day shipping.

I drank the 1990 last night and it was a beautiful wine.

https://shop.ridgewine.com/shopping_car ... 375ml.aspx

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 5:45 pm
by Glenn L e v i n e
Dave McIsaac wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 11:04 am
Glenn L e v i n e wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 10:41 am Just a joyous bottle which made up for some duds on the actual birthday.

This wine had real energy, both sweet & tart fruit easily appreciated, length without bitterness. Tannins resolved but not completely absent yet. Delicious bottle.

A3C8C12C-7AE7-4CB6-9F30-C7C260671F4A.jpeg
Birth year wine, G?? [wink.gif]
1/2 way.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 6:59 pm
by AD Northup
Ed Steinway wrote: February 14th, 2020, 6:10 am
Thomas Keim wrote:
'84 and '87 are highly underrated vintages, and worth seeking out for all the names listed above - the '87 Montelena is still one of my all time favorite Cabs with a little bottle age -
Both are excellent vintages for California Cabernet. The 1984 Ridge Monte Bello we had a few years ago was one of the best bottles of wine I have been fortunate enough to drink.

Ed
Been absolutely loading up on these two vintages this year as they are my wife and my birth years. Will start popping them open in June over the next few decades, but appreciative of all the positive notes.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 7:54 pm
by Br1an Th0rne
I buy the ‘92 Togni whenever I see it at a decent price...for me, Togni is one of the few CA Cabs that evolves and significantly improves and develops complexity with age. And the ‘92 is at the top of that short list.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 8:01 pm
by T. Altmayer
I have had some good luck recently at auction with aged Cal Cab. Picked up early to mid 90s Whitehall Lane which has been lovely. Also has some Staglin and Merryvale profile from the late 90s that has really exceeded expectations. All bought on Winebid and not a bad bottle yet.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 22nd, 2020, 9:01 pm
by Glenn L e v i n e
84-87 are the greatest four year run in CA history.

Underrated?

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 23rd, 2020, 8:01 am
by Scott Jameson
Glenn L e v i n e wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 9:01 pm 84-87 are the greatest four year run in CA history.

Underrated?
I might argue with "greatest" but these years are definitely in the discussion, and are far from "underrated".

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 23rd, 2020, 3:11 pm
by Glenn L e v i n e
Exactly. 91-94 as good perhaps.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 28th, 2020, 11:15 am
by S. Stevenson
Glenn L e v i n e wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 9:01 pm 84-87 are the greatest four year run in CA history.

Underrated?
'67 to '70 was better.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 9:48 am
by Glenn L e v i n e
No way. The case can be made for 91-94 but not those four vintages.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 12:01 pm
by Mike Maguire
I would include 95 to the 91-94, so really stellar ones that are still drinking great.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 12:55 pm
by Marek Hnatyk
Mike Maguire wrote: May 29th, 2020, 12:01 pm I would include 95 to the 91-94, so really stellar ones that are still drinking great.
I would also add 97, all wines I had from this vintages were at least outstanding or great ( Newton , Ahlgren, Diamond Creek VH, Forman, Staglin). I also read many good opionions on www.cellartracker.com about Napa cabernets from 1996 so in fact vintages 1991-1997 would be the greatest period for Northern California Cabernet Sauvignon. [cheers.gif]

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 1:33 pm
by Mark Golodetz
Br1an Th0rne wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 7:54 pm I buy the ‘92 Togni whenever I see it at a decent price...for me, Togni is one of the few CA Cabs that evolves and significantly improves and develops complexity with age. And the ‘92 is at the top of that short list.
A man of rare taste and intelligence. champagne.gif

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 1:35 pm
by Mark Golodetz
Depends on the type of wine you like. Very few wines post 1990 that I have found developing the interesting stuff I look for in aged wine.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 1:48 pm
by Marek Hnatyk
Mark Golodetz wrote: May 29th, 2020, 1:33 pm
Br1an Th0rne wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 7:54 pm I buy the ‘92 Togni whenever I see it at a decent price...for me, Togni is one of the few CA Cabs that evolves and significantly improves and develops complexity with age. And the ‘92 is at the top of that short list.
A man of rare taste and intelligence. champagne.gif
I had almost 2 years ago Togni 94, very nice wine however without "wow" factor which I hoped for.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 2:55 pm
by Br1an Th0rne
Mark Golodetz wrote: May 29th, 2020, 1:33 pm
Br1an Th0rne wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 7:54 pm I buy the ‘92 Togni whenever I see it at a decent price...for me, Togni is one of the few CA Cabs that evolves and significantly improves and develops complexity with age. And the ‘92 is at the top of that short list.
A man of rare taste and intelligence. champagne.gif
Clearly a case of great minds thinking alike [cheers.gif]

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: May 29th, 2020, 3:10 pm
by Jay Opperman
1951 BV
1974 Heitz Martha’s
1978 Ridge Montabello

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 7th, 2020, 5:44 pm
by Victor Hong
Even older bottles of Kendall-Jackson grocery store wines are catching strong bids.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 7th, 2020, 10:17 pm
by Mark Thompson
Marek Hnatyk wrote: May 29th, 2020, 1:48 pm
Mark Golodetz wrote: May 29th, 2020, 1:33 pm
Br1an Th0rne wrote: May 22nd, 2020, 7:54 pm I buy the ‘92 Togni whenever I see it at a decent price...for me, Togni is one of the few CA Cabs that evolves and significantly improves and develops complexity with age. And the ‘92 is at the top of that short list.
A man of rare taste and intelligence. champagne.gif
I had almost 2 years ago Togni 94, very nice wine however without "wow" factor which I hoped for.
Perhaps another decade or two?

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 8th, 2020, 12:02 pm
by Marek Hnatyk
Mark Thompson wrote: June 7th, 2020, 10:17 pm
Marek Hnatyk wrote: May 29th, 2020, 1:48 pm I had almost 2 years ago Togni 94, very nice wine however without "wow" factor which I hoped for.
Perhaps another decade or two?
I do not think that this particulary bottle which I opened had potencial for further substantial improvment. It was lack of enough concentration of flavours or extra depth to give feeling of multidimensions.
It was ourstanding ( I ranked it 94/100) but not enought good to be ranked as Great Wine. I had two times Dalla Valle 1994 Cabernet Sauvignon and both bottles I ranked 95/100, like only 1 point of difference (compare to Togni 94) but for me Dalla Valle was clearly better wine. Diamond Creek Volcanic Hill 1994 ( which I had in 2014) I would also put in the same range as Dalla Valle 1994.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 16th, 2020, 9:42 am
by Victor Hong
Prices continue to tighten. Ugh.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 17th, 2020, 4:40 am
by Howard Cooper
William Kelley wrote: July 17th, 2016, 12:36 am
Nathan Smyth wrote:
For Togni, don't forget that he was at Chappellet for a long time before setting out on his own - maybe as long as the late 1960s through the early 1980s, and he would have had a hand in making almost all of the Chappellet wines of the 1970s [which are still almost affordable].

http://www.sfgate.com/wine/thirst/artic ... 396208.php

http://www.wine-searcher.com/find/chappellet
While I would eagerly drink any 1970s Chappellet, Philip had already left by at least 1975; by '83 their winemaker was Cathy Corison. Never been able to get a definite answer as to who made the '75, which is an amazing wine, but a number of candidates have been suggested.
Loved the 1975 and 1980 Chappellet Cabs.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 17th, 2020, 4:48 am
by Howard Cooper
J a y H a c k wrote: February 11th, 2020, 10:30 am I vote for 1974 as the vintage of the second half of the last century for Cali Cabs. I have one bottle of the 1974 Fetzer generic cabernet left from a case I bought in 1977. $2.50 a bottle by the case. The last one I drank was in 2002. I keep one as a curiosity, planning to open it at a Berserkerfest at my house, but I always forget. Too much sediment to travel. Color looks pretty ugly and the storage was horrible for at least the first 9 years. BUT if I have a chance to buy a 1974 in good condition, I grab it.
1974 was a great vintage, but so were 1970, 1978, 1984, and 1991. I really like 1991. Not sure it is better than the others, but I have had a bunch of really good ones.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 17th, 2020, 4:52 am
by Howard Cooper
Mike Maguire wrote: May 29th, 2020, 12:01 pm I would include 95 to the 91-94, so really stellar ones that are still drinking great.
If you are going to extend the range, just go all out and say 1990-1997. Not a dud in the bunch.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 17th, 2020, 6:47 am
by P. Dias
I was recently bitten by the wine bug, probably after an amazing trip to Tuscany, joined this forum, and have been doing a good amount of reading. Similarly to the OP, I also wanted to taste some aged cali cabs. Given my sister's 30th bday was canceled and she's visiting me in NYC this weekend, I figured I'd open a couple of bottles.

- 90 S Anderson Cab Richard Chambers, 1.5L
- 90 Kenwood Artist Series

Do you recommend decanting these? If so, how long? Any other tips?

Thanks!

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 17th, 2020, 8:41 am
by Victor Hong
P. Dias wrote: June 17th, 2020, 6:47 am I was recently bitten by the wine bug, probably after an amazing trip to Tuscany, joined this forum, and have been doing a good amount of reading. Similarly to the OP, I also wanted to taste some aged cali cabs. Given my sister's 30th bday was canceled and she's visiting me in NYC this weekend, I figured I'd open a couple of bottles.

- 90 S Anderson Cab Richard Chambers, 1.5L
- 90 Kenwood Artist Series

Do you recommend decanting these? If so, how long? Any other tips?

Thanks!
Chill them before serving. Use a tea or coffee mesh to filter out any broken cork bits.

Re: Aged Cali Cab

Posted: June 17th, 2020, 9:47 am
by P. Dias
Victor Hong wrote: June 17th, 2020, 8:41 am
P. Dias wrote: June 17th, 2020, 6:47 am I was recently bitten by the wine bug, probably after an amazing trip to Tuscany, joined this forum, and have been doing a good amount of reading. Similarly to the OP, I also wanted to taste some aged cali cabs. Given my sister's 30th bday was canceled and she's visiting me in NYC this weekend, I figured I'd open a couple of bottles.

- 90 S Anderson Cab Richard Chambers, 1.5L
- 90 Kenwood Artist Series

Do you recommend decanting these? If so, how long? Any other tips?

Thanks!
Chill them before serving. Use a tea or coffee mesh to filter out any broken cork bits.
Thank you, Victor!