What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

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Warren Taranow
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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#51 Post by Warren Taranow » August 14th, 2014, 7:40 am

Gilbert Picq in Chablis
Domaine Faury in St. Joseph
La Lagune in Haut-Médoc
Benjamin Leroux in Côte de Beaune
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#52 Post by Bob Hughes » August 14th, 2014, 7:41 am

Ryan just beat me to it, but the entire country of Austria does not get nearly enough recognition on this Board considering how great their rieslings are. Wines by folks like Hirtzberger, Prager, Nigl, Nikolaihof, etc. are literally some of the best whites in the world, but you'd never know it on this Board.

BTW, just an observation as opposed to a criticism, but if anyone has any doubts whatsoever about just how California-centric this Board is, this thread certainly confirms that in spades.

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#53 Post by Martin Steinley » August 14th, 2014, 7:48 am

Cornu (Ladoix, Aloxe-Corton and SLB) and Maume (Gevrey-Chambertin) - broad ranges of fairly priced, old-school red Burgundies for the long haul.

I'd throw Arnaud Ente (Meursault and Puligny-Montrachet) into the Clair camp - gorgeous wines seldom discussed, but the prices take your breath away.
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#54 Post by Terence T-Bone Livingston » August 14th, 2014, 7:52 am

Robert Alfert, Jr. wrote:
Charlie Fu wrote:Pycm cause people still don't know what it stands for.
Didn't Michael Jackson have a song with that acronym?
Not sure, but I do know that his response in this thread would be Clos du Bois, phonetically speaking of course.
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#55 Post by Kevin M L » August 14th, 2014, 8:12 am

Gaja
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#56 Post by D. Wirsig » August 14th, 2014, 8:14 am

Joguet
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#57 Post by Scott Watkins » August 14th, 2014, 8:19 am

Drew Family Cellars
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#58 Post by Larry P » August 14th, 2014, 8:34 am

Chris Seiber wrote:Or like Vince Young in the NFL. He got to the league just before they realized what amazing things you could do with a QB like him, then troglodyte Jeff Fisher convinced everyone he was a bum and ran him off, but very shortly afterwards teams realized that Colin Kaepernik, Robert Griffin, Russell Wilson and others could actually star in the league if you just gave them a chance and tried to build around their skill sets, even though they weren't tall sluggish white guys like Kerry Collins who could grow roots in the pocket and launch the 7 yard out pattern with a super tight spiral.
Chris, why don't you tell us how you really feel? [snort.gif]


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#59 Post by Anton D » August 14th, 2014, 8:35 am

BrianMarshall wrote:
Charlie Fu wrote:Pycm cause people still don't know what it stands for.
They're a big accounting firm, right?
No, it's some sort of digital sound recording protocol.
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#60 Post by Anton D » August 14th, 2014, 8:36 am

Howard Cooper wrote:
But to me there is an entire category of wine that amazingly never gets discussed on this board - non-trophy Bordeaux. Have wines like Gloria, Meyney, Ormes de Pez, Phelan Segur, etc., etc., etc., ceased to exist?
Great point.

Spot on.
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#61 Post by c fu » August 14th, 2014, 8:38 am

Terence T-Bone Livingston wrote:
Robert Alfert, Jr. wrote:
Charlie Fu wrote:Pycm cause people still don't know what it stands for.
Didn't Michael Jackson have a song with that acronym?
Not sure, but I do know that his response in this thread would be Clos du Bois, phonetically speaking of course.
You mean Dun Clos Su Bois?
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#62 Post by Ramon C » August 14th, 2014, 8:41 am

Terence T-Bone Livingston wrote:Not sure, but I do know that his response in this thread would be Clos du Bois, phonetically speaking of course.
Of course he doesn't like to age them. He likes them young.
@brera

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#63 Post by RyanC » August 14th, 2014, 8:46 am

Anton D wrote:
Howard Cooper wrote:
But to me there is an entire category of wine that amazingly never gets discussed on this board - non-trophy Bordeaux. Have wines like Gloria, Meyney, Ormes de Pez, Phelan Segur, etc., etc., etc., ceased to exist?
Great point.

Spot on.
Yes! This is a category I'd love to learn more about. I like Bordeaux but buy very little of it because most of the bottles I know are in the $100+ range, which is beyond what I normally spend per bottle. I'd love to find a stable of yearly buys in the $50-75 range that fit my preferences (tending toward more subtle, fragrant wines) but I see very little discussion on here in that range and there's not a critic I really trust to lead me.
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#64 Post by Clayton Wai-Poi » August 14th, 2014, 8:50 am

There are plenty of producers that deserve to get talked about that I'm NOT surprised they don't get mentioned, as they're not from regions that dominate the discussion here.

That said one that comes to mind, especially given the chatter here about Cali IPOB wines in general, and Ceritas in particular, is Lioco.

John Raytek is the winemaker and AFAIK applying the same approach as the Ceritas wines in the same facility.

Tremendous vineyard sources. Some very well priced entry level options, and fairly priced Single Vineyards given the sources.

Fairly easily bought direct as opposed to the scrum for very limited quantities of Ceritas.

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#65 Post by Larry P » August 14th, 2014, 8:52 am

Corey N. wrote:
Chris Seiber wrote:Or like Vince Young in the NFL.
Umm, Vince Young sucked as evidenced by his 46-51 TD-interception rating and 74.4 passer rating. He's the football equivalent of a winemaker who gets great grapes and then mucks it up with too much oak. And the wines are bretty. And corked. And smoke-tainted. And...

<ahem>
No no no! Vince Young was handled like grapes picked intentionally underripe in the land of sunshine, trying to make wine that tastes like it was made by some sheepherder in his outhouse in the Jura [snort.gif]
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#66 Post by J. Singleton » August 14th, 2014, 8:53 am

Ryan Caughey wrote:
Anton D wrote:
Howard Cooper wrote:
But to me there is an entire category of wine that amazingly never gets discussed on this board - non-trophy Bordeaux. Have wines like Gloria, Meyney, Ormes de Pez, Phelan Segur, etc., etc., etc., ceased to exist?
Great point.

Spot on.
Yes! This is a category I'd love to learn more about. I like Bordeaux but buy very little of it because most of the bottles I know are in the $100+ range, which is beyond what I normally spend per bottle. I'd love to find a stable of yearly buys in the $50-75 range that fit my preferences (tending toward more subtle, fragrant wines) but I see very little discussion on here in that range and there's not a critic I really trust to lead me.
Seems like a new thread should be a-brewin. Lanessan will be mentioned in the first five posts. Mark my words.
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#67 Post by M. Dildine » August 14th, 2014, 8:58 am

The wines of Central Coast vineyard vagabond and berserker Ian Brand. Le P'Tit Paysan wine is wonderfully distinctive and a terrific value.

Somewhat hard to source though, I usually contact Ian.
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#68 Post by Steve L Gellman » August 14th, 2014, 9:03 am

Steve L Gellman wrote:Shafer doesn't get much mention
Also Bevan

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#69 Post by Ian Dorin » August 14th, 2014, 9:11 am

Martin Steinley wrote:Maume (Gevrey-Chambertin)
The only problem here is the last vintage any one will really want to buy is 2010 since he sold...
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#70 Post by Gerhard P. » August 14th, 2014, 9:14 am

Ryan Caughey wrote:
I'm also shocked there's not more discussion across the board of Austria. In my view, Hirtzberger, Prager, Alzinger, the Pichlers, Knoll, etc are making some of the finest wines on earth, and almost invariably they can be found for less than $100, often less than $50. Yet you see very little discussion of them.


+1 flirtysmile

... and don´t forget that there are a lot of other fine wines - not only from the Wachau (Riesling, GV) but also from Styria (Sauvignon blanc ....), other valleys from Lower Austria and Burgenland (reds and sweeties).

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#71 Post by Howard Cooper » August 14th, 2014, 9:16 am

Gallo.
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#72 Post by Taylor Broussard » August 14th, 2014, 9:16 am

M. Dildine wrote:The wines of Central Coast vineyard vagabond and berserker Ian Brand. Le P'Tit Paysan wine is wonderfully distinctive and a terrific value.

Somewhat hard to source though, I usually contact Ian.
Mike, they sell Le P'Tit Paysan at Trio Carmel on Dolores St. Looks like they have La Marea too which is made by Ian as well.

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#73 Post by Carlton McCrindle » August 14th, 2014, 9:59 am

D'Alfonso-Curran
Refugio Ranch
Stony Hill
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#74 Post by Todd F r e n c h » August 14th, 2014, 10:18 am

J. Singleton wrote:
Ryan Caughey wrote:
Howard Cooper wrote:
But to me there is an entire category of wine that amazingly never gets discussed on this board - non-trophy Bordeaux. Have wines like Gloria, Meyney, Ormes de Pez, Phelan Segur, etc., etc., etc., ceased to exist?
Yes! This is a category I'd love to learn more about. I like Bordeaux but buy very little of it because most of the bottles I know are in the $100+ range, which is beyond what I normally spend per bottle. I'd love to find a stable of yearly buys in the $50-75 range that fit my preferences (tending toward more subtle, fragrant wines) but I see very little discussion on here in that range and there's not a critic I really trust to lead me.
Seems like a new thread should be a-brewin. Lanessan will be mentioned in the first five posts. Mark my words.
I don't agree, necessarily, that there is more high end Bordeaux than low end - ALL Bordeaux is somewhat lacking, and I mourn this, as I love Bordeaux! My entire cellar is essentially sub-$100 (with few exceptions):

2000 Château d'Armailhac
2000 Château Camensac
2010 Château Capbern-Gasqueton
2005 Château Charmail
2000 Château Charmail
2000 Château Clerc Milon
2000 Clos du Marquis
2007 Clos l'Église (Pomerol)
2005 Château Cos d'Estournel
2005 Château Fleur Cardinale
2005 Château Gruaud Larose
2006 L'Esprit de Chevalier
2005 Château La Croix de Gay
2000 Château La Lagune
2005 Château La Vieille Cure
2005 Château Lafaurie-Peyraguey
2000 Château Lagrange (St. Julien)
2000 Château Lanessan
2005 Château Larcis Ducasse
2004 Château Larcis Ducasse
2005 Château Lascombes
2010 Château Le Dome
2005 Château Le Pape L'Excellence
2003 Château Nenin
2005 Château Pavie Macquin
2005 Château Phélan Ségur
2002 Château Pichon Longueville Comtesse de Lalande
2005 Château Pontet-Canet
2004 Château Pontet-Canet
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#75 Post by Todd F r e n c h » August 14th, 2014, 11:05 am

By the way, there's a classic, effective way to encourage more producers to get more attention here...start threads on them! Some time back, it was mourned that Burgundy never got any love here, then Berry Crawford and Ray Walker set out on a quest to flood WB with Burgundy posts, and it worked.

Best way to help encourage more discussion is to lead it.
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#76 Post by Berry Crawford » August 14th, 2014, 11:12 am

Todd F r e n c h wrote:Some time back, it was mourned that Burgundy never got any love here, then Berry Crawford and Ray Walker set out on a quest to flood WB with Burgundy posts, and it worked.
I don't remember having an specific agenda. I was just obsessed.

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#77 Post by CJ Beazley » August 14th, 2014, 11:16 am

Todd F r e n c h wrote:By the way, there's a classic, effective way to encourage more producers to get more attention here...start threads on them! Some time back, it was mourned that Burgundy never got any love here, then Berry Crawford and Ray Walker set out on a quest to flood WB with Burgundy posts, and it worked.

Best way to help encourage more discussion is to lead it.
But then Bill Klapp will make fun of us.
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#78 Post by Jay Miller » August 14th, 2014, 11:21 am

I'm going to go with Ridge and Mayacamas. Two producers who have been making great, ageworthy wines for decades and I almost never see notes on them.
Ripe fruit isn't necessarily a flaw.

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#79 Post by Allan Pannizzo » August 14th, 2014, 11:29 am

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#80 Post by c fu » August 14th, 2014, 11:38 am

Berry Crawford wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:Some time back, it was mourned that Burgundy never got any love here, then Berry Crawford and Ray Walker set out on a quest to flood WB with Burgundy posts, and it worked.
I don't remember having an specific agenda. I was just obsessed.
i actually have been thinking there are a lot less burgundy based posts here now. Leaning more toward CA again.

15-6 for CA to burgundy on page one.
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#81 Post by RyanC » August 14th, 2014, 11:39 am

Charlie Fu wrote:
Berry Crawford wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:Some time back, it was mourned that Burgundy never got any love here, then Berry Crawford and Ray Walker set out on a quest to flood WB with Burgundy posts, and it worked.
I don't remember having an specific agenda. I was just obsessed.
i actually have been thinking there are a lot less burgundy based posts here now. Leaning more toward CA again.

15-6 for CA to burgundy on page one.
Mailer season?
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#82 Post by Alan Rath » August 14th, 2014, 11:42 am

Ryan Caughey wrote:I'm also shocked there's not more discussion across the board of Austria. In my view, Hirtzberger, Prager, Alzinger, the Pichlers, Knoll, etc are making some of the finest wines on earth, and almost invariably they can be found for less than $100, often less than $50. Yet you see very little discussion of them.
That's because they aren't "cool" like Burgundy. Thank god! Oh, and BTW, shut up [wow.gif]
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#83 Post by Howard Cooper » August 14th, 2014, 11:43 am

Jay Miller wrote:I'm going to go with Ridge and Mayacamas. Two producers who have been making great, ageworthy wines for decades and I almost never see notes on them.
I agree about Mayacamas, but Ridge, really? Do a search for threads started by Tom Hill, to start with. I love Ridge (probably my favorite California winery), and Ridge deserves all the praise it can get, but I really don't think it is ignored here.
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#84 Post by Jay Miller » August 14th, 2014, 11:48 am

Howard Cooper wrote:
Jay Miller wrote:I'm going to go with Ridge and Mayacamas. Two producers who have been making great, ageworthy wines for decades and I almost never see notes on them.
I agree about Mayacamas, but Ridge, really? Do a search for threads started by Tom Hill, to start with. I love Ridge (probably my favorite California winery), and Ridge deserves all the praise it can get, but I really don't think it is ignored here.
I must just be missing them somehow. Good to know!
Ripe fruit isn't necessarily a flaw.

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#85 Post by PaulMills » August 14th, 2014, 1:18 pm

Thanks guys, more wineries to research. Just what I needed.

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#86 Post by ky1em!ttskus » August 14th, 2014, 1:37 pm

Jay Miller wrote:
Howard Cooper wrote:
Jay Miller wrote:I'm going to go with Ridge and Mayacamas. Two producers who have been making great, ageworthy wines for decades and I almost never see notes on them.
I agree about Mayacamas, but Ridge, really? Do a search for threads started by Tom Hill, to start with. I love Ridge (probably my favorite California winery), and Ridge deserves all the praise it can get, but I really don't think it is ignored here.
I must just be missing them somehow. Good to know!
I would say that Ridge is very well respected around here (deservedly so), but I don't see it mentioned very often.

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#87 Post by Larry P » August 14th, 2014, 1:43 pm

Jay Miller wrote:
Howard Cooper wrote:
Jay Miller wrote:I'm going to go with Ridge and Mayacamas. Two producers who have been making great, ageworthy wines for decades and I almost never see notes on them.
I agree about Mayacamas, but Ridge, really? Do a search for threads started by Tom Hill, to start with. I love Ridge (probably my favorite California winery), and Ridge deserves all the praise it can get, but I really don't think it is ignored here.
I must just be missing them somehow. Good to know!
Funny because I recall a "favorite zin producer" thread where someone comes in page 3 saying "I can't believe Ridge hasn't been mentioned," when a quick scan reveals they were in fact the most commonly mentioned producer in the thread to that point. Something invisible about their name? :D

I can't believe nobody mentioned Ravenswood yet ;)
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#88 Post by Michael S. Monie » August 14th, 2014, 2:03 pm

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#89 Post by Jay $$ Winton » August 14th, 2014, 3:31 pm

in the US-Laurel Glen and Philip Togni.
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#90 Post by John Morris » August 14th, 2014, 3:38 pm

kylemittskus wrote:I would say that Ridge is very well respected around here (deservedly so), but I don't see it mentioned very often.
?? I was going to put it on the list of wineries that get too many mentions. I love their wines, but there's a lot of posting from the amen corner on Ridge.
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#91 Post by H Wallace Jr » August 14th, 2014, 4:06 pm

There's a ton, but these always stick out to me as not being mentioned more
CA stuff
RYME
Massican
Matthiasson
Jolie-Laide
La Clarine
Sandhi & ddlc

Tons from abroad that I am happy are not mentioned
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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#92 Post by Larry P » August 14th, 2014, 4:22 pm

H Wallace Jr wrote:RYME
Good call Hardy. Really enjoyed the wines and meeting Ryan and Megan at the 7% tasting.
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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#93 Post by Jack Linden » August 14th, 2014, 11:46 pm

The region where I live: Alsace. Wonderful, high-quality producers (Mann, Schoech, Zind, Trimbach, etc., etc.), styles ranging from bone-dry rieslings to unctuous SGNs, super value for money, food-friendliness, several different grape varieties. But very little love on this board.

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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#94 Post by Rick.T » August 15th, 2014, 2:15 am

Kosta Browne use to get allot of attention but rarely get mentioned anymore. I understand why or least have some theories.
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Markus S
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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#95 Post by Markus S » August 15th, 2014, 4:34 am

Bob Hughes wrote:Ryan just beat me to it, but the entire country of Austria does not get nearly enough recognition on this Board considering how great their rieslings are. Wines by folks like Hirtzberger, Prager, Nigl, Nikolaihof, etc. are literally some of the best whites in the world, but you'd never know it on this Board.
Yeah, great wines, but THE PRICES, man! Good Austrians are now about $75/bottle, which is not nightly drinking material!
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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#96 Post by Matt Latuchie » August 15th, 2014, 5:06 am

Charlie Fu wrote:
Berry Crawford wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:Some time back, it was mourned that Burgundy never got any love here, then Berry Crawford and Ray Walker set out on a quest to flood WB with Burgundy posts, and it worked.
I don't remember having an specific agenda. I was just obsessed.
i actually have been thinking there are a lot less burgundy based posts here now. Leaning more toward CA again.

15-6 for CA to burgundy on page one.
CA is the fastest growing segment of my wine collection.

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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#97 Post by J a y H a c k » August 15th, 2014, 5:19 am

Robert.Fleming wrote:Maison Ilan.
newhere
Chx. Margaux, Petrus, Lafite, Latour, Haut Brion and Mouton. Except in some threads about a guy named Rudy.

Serious answer:

Knebel from the Mosel. I'm not actually surprised, but they don't get what they deserve.
Yes, that's a DM of 1978 Mouton!

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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#98 Post by Peter Chiu » August 15th, 2014, 7:06 am

Talking about Bruno Clair.

In Quebec, Canada, his wines are not that pricey when compare with the same wines from other producers. We still tons and tons of his high-end reds CSJ and CdBeze of many vintages ( from 2007 on )....still on the shelves.

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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#99 Post by RyanC » August 15th, 2014, 7:12 am

Markus S wrote:
Bob Hughes wrote:Ryan just beat me to it, but the entire country of Austria does not get nearly enough recognition on this Board considering how great their rieslings are. Wines by folks like Hirtzberger, Prager, Nigl, Nikolaihof, etc. are literally some of the best whites in the world, but you'd never know it on this Board.
Yeah, great wines, but THE PRICES, man! Good Austrians are now about $75/bottle, which is not nightly drinking material!
Yes, not nightly drinking material, but neither is Chevalier Montrachet. I just picked up a bunch of '12 and '13 Alzinger Steinertal and and Loibenberg for $40-50/bottle. I honestly honestly don't think there is a better value in the wine world. For my pallet, those wines can compete (in terms of quality and class, despite being very different wines) with grand cru White Burgs from good producers that are hundreds of dollars more. I'm not complaining.
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What producers are you suprised dont get more mention on WB?

#100 Post by S. Lancaster » August 15th, 2014, 7:17 am

Clayton Wai-Poi wrote:There are plenty of producers that deserve to get talked about that I'm NOT surprised they don't get mentioned, as they're not from regions that dominate the discussion here.

That said one that comes to mind, especially given the chatter here about Cali IPOB wines in general, and Ceritas in particular, is Lioco.

John Raytek is the winemaker and AFAIK applying the same approach as the Ceritas wines in the same facility.

Tremendous vineyard sources. Some very well priced entry level options, and fairly priced Single Vineyards given the sources.

Fairly easily bought direct as opposed to the scrum for very limited quantities of Ceritas.
I had an 07' Lioco Demuth vineyard Chardonnay last week that was excellent. Good call.
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