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by Otto Forsberg
September 19th, 2019, 1:09 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

Adam, when do you think your Riesling will be ready? Instead of debating whether or not you have a good strategy, I'd rather just taste the wine! Thanks, answer is I don't know exactly. I'm picking this harvest for first time. Riesling is at 17 Brix right now, so has ways to go. Prob another 5 week...
by Otto Forsberg
September 18th, 2019, 10:30 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

Tom G l a s g o w wrote:
September 18th, 2019, 6:50 pm
Hank Victor wrote:
September 18th, 2019, 9:43 am
"Viticulture: An introduction to commercial grape growing for wine production" by Stephen Skelton MW is on sale at Amazon for $28.
But will Otto buy it?
Why not? It might come handy since I have couple of hybrid vines growing nearby. :D
by Otto Forsberg
September 18th, 2019, 10:48 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

Doug Schulman wrote:
September 18th, 2019, 10:00 am
Adam Frisch wrote:
September 18th, 2019, 12:28 am
High acid is easy, just pick earlier.
I don't agree with a lot of what you've said in this thread, but this part really does not make sense, for so many reasons.
It does make sense, but oftentimes not good wines.
by Otto Forsberg
September 18th, 2019, 12:30 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

Adam Frisch wrote:
September 18th, 2019, 12:28 am
Maybe you're not my customer then. High acid is easy, just pick earlier.
Oh my god. :D [winner.gif]

If that is so easy, why haven't the German people realized that sooner? Why they aren't picking the grapes earlier?

Maybe - just maybe - picking early might not be the solution?
by Otto Forsberg
September 17th, 2019, 10:17 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

And I really didn't understand your point on winemakers not being able to make wines without extreme acidity in the Old World. Have you watched news? The current problem is that most producers can't really make much high-acid Riesling in the Old World because of the constantly warmer climates. They'...
by Otto Forsberg
September 17th, 2019, 10:15 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

Giggle away. We should not be creating new categories for a guy who is ITB, but clearly does not understand Riesling. So, your posts on this topic are commercial? About how you are doing drier than anyone else? Ha, I pay a higher yearly fee here (ITB) to be allowed to talk about winemaking, but nob...
by Otto Forsberg
September 17th, 2019, 1:19 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

So then, day 4 - From Sighnaghi to Lagodekhi. After we woke up, we went for a stroll through Sighnaghi to get some breakfast, since the hotel we stayed in had no breakfast option. We settled for a bottle of Saperavi-flavored lemonade, a cheese pastry and a sweet ponchiki (a custard-filled doughnut)....
by Otto Forsberg
September 17th, 2019, 10:29 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Steve beat me to it. I was going to recommend going to Iago's myself, since if staying in Tbilisi, it doesn't really make sense to take a taxi to Sighnaghi (1h15 to 1h30 in one direction) just for one wine tasting in a restaurant. The winery itself isn't even in Sighnaghi, but - to my understanding ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 15th, 2019, 9:58 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

I think that is a very perceptive and nuanced description. I think it is also fair to say that Georgians know how to have a good time with family and friends, and that often involves food, wine and singing, and sometimes dancing. That definitely seems to be the case! We never managed to bear witnes...
by Otto Forsberg
September 15th, 2019, 9:00 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Forgive me if you know already, Otto, but John's interest in Georgian folk music was largely responsible for him travelling to Georgia initially, and his wife is the leader of Zedashe - a song and dance ensemble based in Sighnaghi. So music is very much part of John's life and Pheasant's Tears. If ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 15th, 2019, 2:15 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

I'm just curious if anyone has tried Eva Fricke's wines. Ive gotten a couple offers for them but don't know much about them. Thoughts? I've had a few. The regular Rheingau Trocken isn't particularly interesting, but the higher-tier ones are. The style is lean and crisp, but more in the vein of "ele...
by Otto Forsberg
September 14th, 2019, 6:31 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Barolo Sediment
Replies: 51
Views: 1506

Re: Barolo Sediment

This is a subset of a recurring question, how long to stand a bottle for the sediment to settle adequately. I’ve never seen a shred of real science on the topic. I find it really hard to believe that it will take more than a few hours for even fine sediment to fall the 10 or 11 inches (at most) to ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 14th, 2019, 8:33 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Dinner with every wine showing great incl the best Grüner I've had, 4 amazing Barolos
Replies: 14
Views: 1008

Re: Dinner with every wine showing great incl the best Grüner I've had, 4 amazing Barolos

Schloss Gobelsburg's wines have managed to wow me basically every time I have tasted them. Already from the entry level, they are remarkably impressive upon release, but they continue to improve wonderfully in the cellar. GV Lamm 2007 at 7-8 years of age still is one of the most astounding white win...
by Otto Forsberg
September 14th, 2019, 5:32 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Day 3 - to Sighnaghi. After the breakfast we left our guesthouse and walked to the nearest metro station. After having purchased a travel card one needs to use the metro, we traveled to the Isani metro station which is supposed to be the best place to get a taxi to Kakheti, since it is located right...
by Otto Forsberg
September 13th, 2019, 1:22 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Thanks for all the comments! Next up: the day number 2 - Tbilisi. We didn't do much food-wise or wine-wise this day, just spent the day doing pretty touristy stuff. First we went to see the museum of illusions that was right next to our guesthouse in the old town. Lots of fun stuff there, a great pl...
by Otto Forsberg
September 13th, 2019, 5:25 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

I hope the wine is great, and would love to try it, but you have a fundamental misunderstanding of Riesling , and what it can be - from totally dry to amazingly, and deliciously sweet. No doubt - I keep fumbling in the Riesling world, but loving the grape. So far, I can count on one hand the dry Ri...
by Otto Forsberg
September 13th, 2019, 3:20 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

I suppose that's my problem then. If RS can be labeled as dry and still have 4g/l or more, then we have a fundamental problem. That is crazy sweet. We need a new official classification, Bone Dry in that case. Bone Dry: less than 1g/l. Crazy sweet? An oft-cited number is that a normal human tongue ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 13th, 2019, 2:03 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Lisa Granik also has a book on Georgian wine, in the Infinite Ideas series, coming out in the autumn. Thanks for the notes so far Otto. I'm impressed by the detail in your TNs, I always struggle describing wines in that level of detail, but orange wine in particular. Thank you Steve. I must admit t...
by Otto Forsberg
September 12th, 2019, 10:33 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot
Replies: 61
Views: 2135

Re: How German Wine Found Its Sweet Spot

My only beef with Rieslings are that trocken doesn't actually always mean it's dry. Pisses me off. If they could just fix that one little thing, I think we'd forgive them their overly complex classifications. Get it straight, Germany/Alsace: I want bone dry Rieslings. That means RS below 0.5g/l. OK...
by Otto Forsberg
September 12th, 2019, 12:16 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Thanks for the enjoyable travelogue, Otto. If you are interested in Georgian wines, you should connect with Lisa Granik, MW. She is a big promoter of Georgian wines and consults to various wineries in Georgia. I'd be happy to introduce you. I most certainly am interested in Georgian wines; I've bee...
by Otto Forsberg
September 12th, 2019, 10:24 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

On our first day in Tbilisi we slept very late, since we arrived in Georgia after 3 am and the queue to the passport control took something of an hour, so we were at our guesthouse at 4:30 am. We spent the first day mainly getting the lay of the land and trying to get to grips with the chaotic old T...
by Otto Forsberg
September 12th, 2019, 1:15 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Many thanks, Otto. The only thing I'd question is that 50% of Georgian dishes contain cheese. To be sure khachapuri (the cheese bread) is common, and you are often offered slices of cheese, but my memory and impression is that most dishes are dairy-free. Ah, I was just about to write that the food ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 11th, 2019, 11:06 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Re: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

Great tips Otto. I don't know if I will be able to visit there, but some of the Georgian varietals have shown promise in the Finger Lakes wine region in central New York. In particular, Saperavi, Sereksiya Charni, and rkatsiteli. That's what I've heard and I'd be very interested to have an opportun...
by Otto Forsberg
September 11th, 2019, 10:36 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Travelogue: Georgia (the country)
Replies: 29
Views: 783

Travelogue: Georgia (the country)

So, some people here have visited this country known as the cradle of wine before me, but I guess writing about the experience can't hurt. So, here's the part 1. As a preface: we stayed in Georgia for a week, arriving there Saturday 3 am in the morning and leaving a week later, on Sunday morning at ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 11th, 2019, 9:20 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: The New Yorker on Orange Wines
Replies: 41
Views: 1706

Re: The New Yorker on Orange Wines

Agreed, maceration and phenolics is a whole science. I learned from last vintage that certain grapes do well with longer skin contact and other's less so. Generally speaking, varieties that already are quite tannic can get overpowered and need a lot of time, and those that are a little less so seem...
by Otto Forsberg
September 11th, 2019, 5:20 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: TN: 2009 La Spinetta (Rivetti) - Barbaresco Vigneto Bordini (Italy, Piedmont, Langhe, Barbaresco)
Replies: 5
Views: 474

Re: TN: 2009 La Spinetta (Rivetti) - Barbaresco Vigneto Bordini (Italy, Piedmont, Langhe, Barbaresco)

Can't remember if I've had a single good Nebbiolo from La Spinetta. To me, all of them have been super-modern, excessively oaky and unbalanced, showing too much toasty wood, a bit too ripe fruit and often all too little acidity. Some of them have managed to show quite decent tannic structure for mod...
by Otto Forsberg
September 10th, 2019, 2:59 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: The New Yorker on Orange Wines
Replies: 41
Views: 1706

Re: The New Yorker on Orange Wines

Once again, when wine people here hear the term "orange wine" they think deeply colored and oxidative. That's where the term has its meaning here. It's sort of like you're telling me we should call all motor vehicles "trucks". Once again, I need to point out that that is a local thing. When I go ar...
by Otto Forsberg
September 9th, 2019, 3:43 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: 1945 Vintage but New Looking Bottle
Replies: 8
Views: 1166

Re: 1945 Vintage but New Looking Bottle

If the bottle was old, the wine would've been most likely less interesting, since Rivesaltes (as other oxidative wines as well) develop only in the barrel. Once the wine is bottled, the development grinds down to a halt. It took some explaining for a few people to understand why a 1874 Sisqueille Ri...
by Otto Forsberg
September 9th, 2019, 3:34 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: The New Yorker on Orange Wines
Replies: 41
Views: 1706

Re: The New Yorker on Orange Wines

Where's Otto? He should have some interesting points to add here. Travelling in Georgia, drinking orange wines - ranging from pale straw yellow to deep amber. [wink.gif] Plus, this is exactly why I'd prefer we only use the term "orange wines" to wines that are actually orange, as a sub-category of ...
by Otto Forsberg
September 4th, 2019, 10:36 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Worst wines you've had?
Replies: 128
Views: 5966

Re: Worst wines you've had?

Andrew Dodd wrote:
September 4th, 2019, 9:21 am
Cappellano Barolo Chinato, most god awful thing I've probably ever ingested
What? Barolo Chinatos are absolutely delicious!
by Otto Forsberg
September 3rd, 2019, 9:27 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Underrated burgundy vintages
Replies: 76
Views: 3333

Re: Underrated burgundy vintages

Are we talking about whites or reds? If whites, I fail to see how 2014 would be underrated, as it is consistently hailed as one of the greatest recent vintages of white Burg.
by Otto Forsberg
August 31st, 2019, 6:48 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Phases of Aging Riesling
Replies: 57
Views: 2082

Re: Phases of Aging Riesling

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
August 31st, 2019, 5:50 am
2018 requires careful selection. There are some really wonderful wines that strike the right balance, but you cannot buy blind.
Agreed. This seems to be the case with most non-top vintages of German Riesling. With great vintages you can buy blind pretty care-free.
by Otto Forsberg
August 31st, 2019, 2:29 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Phases of Aging Riesling
Replies: 57
Views: 2082

Re: Phases of Aging Riesling

I thought that 2015 and 2017 were too warm and ripe for my taste, but experience has proven me wrong. These wines certainly show ripeness, but also remarkable levels of acidity and intensity. I guess these vintages had cool enough nights to keep the acidity levels high and growing season long. 2016 ...
by Otto Forsberg
August 30th, 2019, 7:23 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: TN: 2010 R. López de Heredia Rioja Blanco Viña Gravonia
Replies: 15
Views: 925

Re: TN: 2010 R. López de Heredia Rioja Blanco Viña Gravonia

Hi John, I got this wine and the 05 Tondonia Blanco At Vinopolos In PDX Tight allocations. Even Gravonia getting parsed out. First time I can't get as much as I wanted. Vinopolis still seems to be most reliable source north of CA. I had the same experience with getting Gravonia this year. My usual ...
by Otto Forsberg
August 29th, 2019, 8:47 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience
Replies: 33
Views: 1172

Re: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience

I'm confused, why do you insist on using "saki" instead of "sake"?
by Otto Forsberg
August 29th, 2019, 5:48 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Phases of Aging Riesling
Replies: 57
Views: 2082

Re: Phases of Aging Riesling

Ian S wrote:
August 29th, 2019, 5:36 am
Howard Cooper wrote:
August 29th, 2019, 5:26 am
Where are you guys finding all these $60 Spatlesen?
They're buying 2 bottles. [snort.gif]
At $60? At that price one should buy a case of 6 bottles and still get some change. neener
by Otto Forsberg
August 29th, 2019, 4:36 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience
Replies: 33
Views: 1172

Re: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience

One question, my understanding of the word junmai is that it stands for using native yeast in fermentation instead of introducing the yeast. Is this true? I think junmai simply meams it's 100% rice sake i.e. not fortified. This is correct. One can use cultivated yeasts or spontaneous fermentations,...
by Otto Forsberg
August 29th, 2019, 2:00 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Phases of Aging Riesling
Replies: 57
Views: 2082

Re: Phases of Aging Riesling

Age is the #1 most important thing for German riesling, in my opinion. I think $20 90 point kabinett at age 20 is not only better, but far better, than $60 95 point spatlese when young. Young riesling is a sweet grape beverage which tastes nice, but isn't really a wine experience to me. And I think...
by Otto Forsberg
August 29th, 2019, 1:56 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience
Replies: 33
Views: 1172

Re: Sake. Very interesting beverage. I'm going to have to learn more

BTW, anyone in Kyoto who wants to learn about sake, I 100% recommend Bar Yoramu (www.sakebar-yoramu.com/ ). Tiny place with a passionate owner. Thanks for this. We're planning a trip to Japan and are sake enthusiasts! Wadachi bar very close to the Gion-Shijo station was also a very nice place with ...
by Otto Forsberg
August 28th, 2019, 11:13 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)
Replies: 59
Views: 1796

Re: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)

Thomas Keim wrote:
August 28th, 2019, 12:26 pm
Ribolla Gialla
Chasselas
Txakoli
Riesling

Pinot Noir
Gamay
Refosco
Teroldego
Finally something more up my alley instead of those usual suspects everybody keeps on repeating here! [cheers.gif]
by Otto Forsberg
August 28th, 2019, 12:46 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Phases of Aging Riesling
Replies: 57
Views: 2082

Re: Phases of Aging Riesling

It either stinks or doesn't of petrol If not, lucky you If so, the stink keeps getting worse And worse Then reportedly the hydrocarbons fade and degrade or morph and you have old Riesling. RT I'm always disappointed when I open some of my aged Rieslings and they don't smell of petrol. I opened a 20...
by Otto Forsberg
August 28th, 2019, 12:06 pm
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Favorite Vintners in Savoy?
Replies: 22
Views: 837

Re: Favorite Vintners in Savoy?

Although Bugey wines are a great suggestion, they are not part of Savoie anymore!

Nevertheless, a place definitely worth a visit, since the easternmost vineyards of Bugey are only a stone's throw away from the westernmost vineyards of Savoie.
by Otto Forsberg
August 28th, 2019, 6:39 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience
Replies: 33
Views: 1172

Re: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience

I have a very good friend who is a Saki Master and we drink a lot that he imports, sometime only single bottles. Some amazing stuff. My go to house saki is 'Otter Fest 23' from Dassai. It is Junmai Daiginjo and as the name implies it is polished to 23%. Very pure but fruity with a complex but clean...
by Otto Forsberg
August 28th, 2019, 3:37 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience
Replies: 33
Views: 1172

Re: Sake. Very interesting beverage. My Kyoto experience

I've been building some sake understanding for some years now and visited Japan a year ago. I've noticed that many Daiginjos are currently made with some obvious sweetness. This makes them feel bigger, more concentrated and weighty, leaving to a more "impressive" feel when somebody who knows very li...
by Otto Forsberg
August 28th, 2019, 3:08 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)
Replies: 59
Views: 1796

Re: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)

Otto, This thread and your post has introduced me to the existence of a wine named Timorasso and your high personal ranking will lead me to look for a bottle. So there's that. [cheers.gif] -Jim Thank you for your kind words, Jim. It's great that thread like these manage to benefit some people. If y...
by Otto Forsberg
August 27th, 2019, 8:53 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Why Is Pronunciation Such An Issue??
Replies: 71
Views: 2193

Re: Why Is Pronunciation Such An Issue??

Am I missing something here? You posted an excerpt that says exactly the same thing what I said and then say that you are correct. I may have misread your post. I thought you were saying it was grouped with modern Italian and other languages further south on the Italian peninsula, rather than with ...
by Otto Forsberg
August 27th, 2019, 7:16 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Why Is Pronunciation Such An Issue??
Replies: 71
Views: 2193

Re: Why Is Pronunciation Such An Issue??

In written form, Catalan is pretty close to Spanish, though -- certainly close enough that a Spanish wine expert (as this guy is) could figure it out if he wanted. My point was that Castillian-speaking Spaniards sometimes aren't interested in understanding Catalan! (I am nowhere near fluent in Fren...
by Otto Forsberg
August 27th, 2019, 7:12 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: Why Is Pronunciation Such An Issue??
Replies: 71
Views: 2193

Re: Why Is Pronunciation Such An Issue??

Not sure about Gascon, but Piedmontese is in the same subgroup as Catalan and Provençal. To my understanding, no. Piedmontese belongs to the Italian family of languages. It certainly has lots of features from the neighboring Occitan language family, but it bears closer resemblance to the Italian (y...
by Otto Forsberg
August 27th, 2019, 5:34 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)
Replies: 59
Views: 1796

Re: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)

Kiitos paljon Otto. Ilo oli puolellani. Going to Ruche country next week (Castagnole) and I see that Timorasso country is nearby. Certainly visiting some winemakers there. Never tried the wines I've only visited Alba, Alto Piemonte and Carema (+ Aosta Valley) during a trip to Piedmont, but since To...
by Otto Forsberg
August 27th, 2019, 4:53 am
Forum: Wine Talk
Topic: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)
Replies: 59
Views: 1796

Re: 8 Favourite Varieties (4 red, 4 white)

I really don't think that a thread that is just people listing things is proper discussion, but what the hey. . . . Otto, This thread and your post has introduced me to the existence of a wine named Timorasso and your high personal ranking will lead me to look for a bottle. So there's that. [cheers...

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