Indeed.
I figure if both Harvey and Dr. J can give me 90/91/92 for wines that are 12.8 to 13.3 then things have begun to shift. Then again, they just might like pretty Pinot noir…
I should add that whole clusters soak up alcohol.
The World of Pinot Noir (WOPN) is hosting a panel discussion on this topic on Friday, March 4th at Wild Horse Vineyards in Atascadero. So far, Eric Asimov, Raj Parr, Jim Clendenen, Adam Tolmach. Josh Jensen, Adam Lee, and Michael Browne have all agreed to participate. It should be a good one!
I don’t know that WS has been silent on this issue, but I do think that they have a vested interest thus far in the fruit bomb, if only slightly less so than the WA. I saw a James Molesworth editorial while perusing the latest Spectator at a restaurant the other day where he supposes the natural wine movement to be “dead on the vine” (his quote I do believe). While only an editorial, it still seems a shout out for the status quo of the past years of higher octane and seems to refute the idea of a revolution of finesse.
But mostly just look at this year’s top ten list. While CA may be putting out the aforementioned lovely lighter weight Syrahs, WS has championed some very big-boned wines. Personally I wonder how many of these periodicals would still be listening to the band as the water washed over the deckchairs.
Re Adam’s comments, are they really that great? I think it is fair to assume that as the US public becomes more knowledgeable about wine that they will also consider cellaring wine at a greater rate than before, that they will demand more properly aged wines from restaurants, and that, most importantly, they will pick the wine that is at the most appropriate stage of aging rather than simply shelling out for the biggest bomb in the book or on the shelf as so many have done for so long. Adam seems very sincere in his beliefs, but he also seems to believe that there is nothing wrong with extremely ripe wines, that the idea of natural wine is some sort of seditious plot against domestic winegrowers, and that the very concept of a movement towards lighter wines is anathema and should be shouted down. I do not agree with him on any of these things.
Many of Copain’s 09 pinots came in around 12%.
Just one quibble here. Do you really think that in medieval Europe most consumers aged their wines? Or even in the 19th century? I suspect only a minority of wealthy nobles with cellars aged wine. Most likely the average consumer (serfs and tradesmen, perhaps) bought wine and drank it the same day.
Probably what is new is that the modern equivalent of landed nobility expect high end wine to be instantly drinkable. But for the middle classes and lower, it’s probably business as usual: buy, then consume.
Michael…can you tell me for sure where this so called “movement” started? Was it the chicken or the egg? The winemaker or the consumer? I quite often feel this “movement” is about selling articles and selling wine…whether or not you believe in what you write or what you make. Please…educate me.
I’m not suggesting that you’ve over-generalized; but rather, noting that the generalization doesn’t hold true with respect to Jamie’s wines - or at least not yet, but it sure might after the 08-10 reviews come out (assuming that RP gets to them). After all, the 07 was still at 14.1%.
Michael,
As someone who has tasted with Adam many times (And debated him many times on many subjects), he has no prejudice against lower alcohol wines and doesn’t wear a tin foil hat. I also don’t believe he particularly likes +15% Pinots.
Since 2004, Adam has lowered the octane on his Pinots and I find them to be balanced and rarely exhibiting heat.
TTT
2004 certainly was a pinnacle for many regarding alc%. Like you, I feel that there is a good variety of Pinot Noir styles on the market today, which I am certainly happy about.
Ahem…Templeton. ![[basic-smile.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/8/83717c74df9b0ce202453063bc4f11baf0ee6b8a.gif "smile"){kind=small}
Paul,
I do not mean to insult, I think Adam makes very reasoned points which he truly believes in; I merely think that he often seems to become very sensitive, and yes perhaps too sensitive, when subjects like this are touched upon; And yes, I am very aware that he makes a wide range of pinots from a wide range of areas. Some I have liked, others I have found too sweet/ripe.
I don’t know that I could “tell you where this movement started,” but if I were to guess I would suppose that there is no real beginning, that there over the course of the past decade or two public taste favored high alcohol, very ripe, dense, concentrated, hedonistic, etc. wines, the type hyped by WA and WS, and that there were always those who bucked this trend and favored wines with less ripeness and concentration. For whatever reasons I also believe that the trend towards heaviness reached a maximum density, the pendulum paused and has begun to swing back with more interest gained in the lighter style of wine. But I would certainly hesitate to name a beginning, since so many winemakers, in the US and abroad, have never embraced a higher octane, sleekly smooth, internationalized style. But if you doubt such a style exists, or that a movement peaked and headed the other way, I would probably point to a region like Barolo, where it seems many producers have given up the modern style they picked up just a short time ago. Others here can speak more eloquently than I on that subject, but I see it mentioned both here and on other boards, as a good example of this phenomenon.
Of course you could mean some other “movement” perhaps the idea of natural wine, with all its inherent conflicts. I really don’t want to digress into a fight for the same ground so often battled for here, so I will leave it at that. I’m not claiming I know, it just looks that way to me, in the time I have paid attention to wine.
In any case, I don’t think that it is merely a construct of vintners or journalists that for a time there was a style of wine which became popularized that was very concentrated and tended towards high alcohol and that the style has since lost some popularity, particularly where it was ill suited to begin with, resulting in blowback and something of a return to a lighter bodied, lower alcohol style in the hopes of gaining nuance and delicacy in the exchange. None of this is whole hog, it is more like watching currents, but i feel very confident that this is clearly the case.
…and the band played on…
If I read one more article on the merits of New World Pinot noir using Burgundy as the basis of what it should be…
When did this stop being about having fun and appreciating differences (for both the wine and the company it is shared with)?
Amen.
![[winner.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/07ec25c9fd71159fe15d7f1ba5fad64e91238d0e.gif "winner"){kind=small}
+42
Crikey Jamie, by 2015 you’ll be at Mosel Riesling levels!
And if I read one more post from someone insisting that no aesthetic standards exist, that taste just a function of personal preference…
So the old world lens if the ‘aesthetic standard’ by which new world pinots should be judged?