Non goverment ID

Wine Pimps
21

That also depends on who is doing the encoding and whether or not the person checking the id is cognizant of the sequencing.

Lots of kids insist that you scan their fake id’s because the seller bragged to them about how it scans. But if the numbers are just gobbledygook it’s obvious. Also, each state has a certain identifier sequence with your birthday embedded in it somehow, it varies state to state. I have seen id’s that were altered on the front but scanned with a different, younger birthdate or a completely different date than what is on the front of the ID, leading you to believe the counterfeiters are just reusing one strip on multiple id copies.

Yet other states are moving away from a magnetic strip to barcode and advanced, next-gen barcode technology. The next-gen is great for law enforcement, but doesn’t help me much. The best universal security feature that is out there, IMO is the UV hologram. Those are tough to duplicate in a forged instrument, but if you have someone on the inside in a DMV who is doing this sort of thing for criminals/illegal aliens then that’s a whole other kettle of fish than young kids seeking ID’s for the purpose of underage drinking.

22

Got a letter from the city today with the explanation. She was a DECOY. We turned her down and they thanked us for our diligence.

23

Bravo 'Beto. Nice work and good job.

24

or you could have just said, “Are you at least 21 years old?” by law, the decoy must answer that question truthfully. also, as it was explained to me in the last Responsible Pouring Seminar i attended, the ID presented by a decoy must be their actual identification - not a mock-up or fake ID.

nice work on following your instincts. [cheers.gif]

25

I am a defense attorney and part time wine salesman. I know of no requirement that a decoy tell the truth or absolute rule that they must show their real ID. In fact, I can almost gurantee that they can lie about their age. the fake ID by a decoy would give you a stong entrapment argument. There laws will vary by state.

26

In California that is correct. They can’t lie about thir age if asked and can’t dress or “look” older. ( ie. They can’t wear a shirt with alcohol advertisement on it etc. And you can’t use a kid who is 18 but looks 30. There is a lot of rules and case law here regarding minor decoys.

27

Does this apply to sex as well?

I’m just askin’. [snort.gif]

28

i’m not sure what other states require as part of their decoy operations, but as far as CA goes the decoy must answer questions about their age truthfully, and must show their own ID if asked during the sting operation.

either that, or the ABC representative who told us that was wrong.

29

the ABC employee who told you that was partially right. ABC guide lines require that the decoy look the underage and that they tell the truth. Court have said that those provisions do not affect whether you have violated the criminal statute. So, as far as criminal law is concerned, you are guilty of selling to the underage even if the decoy looks older and he lies about his age.

The key to an entrapment defense in Cali is that you have to prove you are not predisposed to commit the crime. Both the appearence and the lying might help you set up the defense, but would probably not be sufficient to most juries. This is why the policy of most stores to check all IDs of anyone who looks younger then 30.

By-the-way, just to make sure I was not off base here, since I usually only do felonies, I checked West’s Annotated Code.

30

I used to have one of those “international ID cards”. It never did get confiscated. Although my North Dakota driver’s license did.

Unless there is a quirk of CA law, as a general rule, in sting operations or with undercover cops, there is no requirement from a constitutional perspective that they tell you the truth at any point.

31

We have a card reader that can utilize magnetic strips or next-gen barcodes. We have a wall of shame loaded with fake IDs. The better ones have holograms that match state issued DLs to a certain degree but since many states use multiple holograms and imagery, something usually gets overlooked. The fakes never scan either. I had a customer who was buying about $1600.00 worth of call brand liquor in large format and I routinely check the DL to see if the name matches the credit card (this was not an age issue), he handed me a Florida DL with the “Genuine Authenticity” holograms and the hologram images of keys. I denied the sale and confiscated the license. When the “customer” protested and insisted that I give his license back, I replied that I would be happy to call the local police and if there was no issue with the validity of the license, he could have it back and proceed with the sale.

He left. I presume the CC was fake also.

The giveaway on the better fakes these days is the photo. If it looks two dimensional as if it came from a color printer, it’s probably bogus.

32

You turned away a $1600 sale?
[snort.gif]