Lettie Teague on "Good" versus "Great" Wine with some WB Board Members

[Bill_Tex_Landreth]

@Keith Levenberg

Someone needs to send you guys to Huet Reeducation Camp.

Is that better or worse than band camp?

[Phillip_F_r_a_n_k_s]

Only thing I could think of to sum up this article and it’s participants.

[ToddFrench]

+1 Franks.

I would challenge anyone who thinks that way to spend some time drinking wine blind. Look at some recent notes about a Dehlinger syrah that blew (I think it was Loren Sonkin) away!

Great wines are NOT priced at a certain level - they can be at any price. I’ve had many an expensive wine that was incredibly disappointing.

[G_D_y_e_r]

@Alan Rath

A good article, interesting, but also a bit sad in a way.

It’s the end that’s the saddest, and probably not by accident. Teague opens up that CdP, which should have been an enjoyable experience, but it has been made dull not because of what it is, but because of what it isn’t.

[Jorge_Henriquez]

@Bill Tex Landreth

@B Stucker

@Todd F r e n c h

I read it, and enjoyed it. Chris Freeman, in particular.

Yes. Never has a description been more apt than " Chris, the amateur".

…or that Mr. Freeman has the palate of a yak.

Wait wait wait, are you saying that Chris “Amateur” Freeman is in reality our very own lovable Freeker, A.K.A. Yak-man?!?!?!?

[Keith_Levenberg]

@Scott Manlin

Also not entirely true… I have been drinking Austrian wines (thanks to my good friend Klaus Puck) since 98… love Austrian Riesling and Gruner Veltliner… though for me, they are more summery or “fish” and “poultry” wines…

Can’t get on board with that one at all. What makes Austrian riesling summery but white Burgundy profound? I have had far many more profound, great Austrian wines than profound, great white Burgundies. And I think the world is divided between people who know this (and, indeed, figure it’s so obvious it’s not even debatable) and people who just don’t feel like wrapping their heads around the esoterica of another wine region…

[M_A_T_T_H_A_R_T_L_E_Y]

@WvanGorp

One of my greatest wine memories is a $15 white from Spain that Josh Raynolds brought to my home when I lived in NYC and we all tasted it blind. It was stunning. I said “This proves one doesn’t need to spend a fortune for a fine bottle of wine.” Anyone can pick a great First Growth; it takes a special quality to find a gem that’s not famous or expensive.

What was the wine!?!?!?!?!?!

[Loren_Sonkin]

The other problem with this kind of thinking is that it ignores the single best part of drinking wine and that is sharing bottles with others. Lettie’s CdP, shared with her friends, is infinitely more enjoyable than any bottle of wine drunk alone. I think we all agree on that or most of us anyway. Way too much emphasis on price (and the tradtions that created the pricing structure) in this article.

I am not a fan of blind tasting in general, but one thing it is good for is to get rid of these preconcieved notions that price equal quality.

[Bob_Kaminski]

Well, if I had not been a wine BB participant reading and exchanging TNs and comments with the people listed in the article, I might conclude that they were pretentious wine snobs. I know that not to be the case due to that interaction, but the article does lead to some interesting debate about why many are intimidated by wine in general.

Why are the great wines great? Mostly because we have been taught that they are great by fancy classifications from centuries past and the omnipotent and infallible professional wine critics where many have reduced the totally subjective quality of wine to a numerical score.

As Yoda says to Luke…“you must unlearn what you have learned”

I guess that mean we must think outside the box!

We have been trained to equate greatness with numerical score or label pedigree which directly correlated to price of admission. So, is it any wonder why people tend to perpetuate this paradigm?

The simple brown bag, into which the expensive and the moderate priced (OK so that is a relative scale right there) wine is placed, is the great truth teller.

In the end regardless of the price, be it $10, $100, or $1000, you just pee it out anyway.


Oh crap I must be one of those AWFEs

[Bill_Tex_Landreth]

@Bob Kaminski

In the end regardless of the price, be it $10, $100, or $1000, you just pee it out anyway.

Not necessarily…

[Bob_Kaminski]

@Keith Levenberg

@Scott Manlin

Also not entirely true… I have been drinking Austrian wines (thanks to my good friend Klaus Puck) since 98… love Austrian Riesling and Gruner Veltliner… though for me, they are more summery or “fish” and “poultry” wines…

Can’t get on board with that one at all. What makes Austrian riesling summery but white Burgundy profound? I have had far many more profound, great Austrian wines than profound, great white Burgundies. And I think the world is divided between people who know this (and, indeed, figure it’s so obvious it’s not even debatable) and people who just don’t feel like wrapping their heads around the esoterica of another wine region…

Hey Keith, don’t you know that premox adds complexity.

[Peter_C]

@Rick Gregory

"Great wine is something else altogether. Great wine is produced in small quantities and commands big prices, especially in the much-hyped vintages. Great wine can only be experienced once in a while. But, as great wine only gets more and more expensive and good wine gets cheaper and cheaper, I’ve been wondering lately if greatness is overrated. "

I stopped at that point.

It got worse, good call.

[Alan_Rath]

@Loren Sonkin

The other problem with this kind of thinking is that it ignores the single best part of drinking wine and that is sharing bottles with others…

You can’t say that the group (and I mean no disrespect to the group of folks at the dinner, they are all fine, upstanding wine geeks) didn’t share these bottles with others. But I agree with what I think the underlying sentiment of your comment is: too many wine-themed dinners end up with a dozen or more great bottles (regardless of how greatness is defined, either by quality, rarity, price, you name it), flashing past all of the participants at high speed. If this had been a dinner where any single one of those bottles was the only wine on the table (or at most 2-3), and it was savored and discussed at length for the evening, then I think you’d have something worth talking about. But this kind of event (again, not to single out this group, it happens everywhere, over and over) is almost more a display of ostentation then of wine appreciation.

[Bob_Kaminski]

@Bill Tex Landreth

@Bob Kaminski

In the end regardless of the price, be it $10, $100, or $1000, you just pee it out anyway.

Not necessarily…

You got a closed-loop system there Tex?

[Bill_Tex_Landreth]

@Bob Kaminski

@Bill Tex Landreth

@Bob Kaminski

In the end regardless of the price, be it $10, $100, or $1000, you just pee it out anyway.

Not necessarily…

You got a closed-loop system there Tex?

I was thinking more along the line of reversal of fortune if you consume too much.

[Bob_Kaminski]

@Bill Tex Landreth

@Bob Kaminski

@Bill Tex Landreth

Not necessarily…

You got a closed-loop system there Tex?

I was thinking more along the line of reversal of fortune if you consume too much.

Ah, different exit…got it.

[Faryan_Amir-Ghassemi]

Cheers to Scott, Jim and Wilfred for opening up some fantastic wines for a neophyte reporter. I don’t know why people are lambasting them. Blind tasting is a great leveler, but honestly, the ratio or frequency of profound to cheap is far less than the ratio of profound to expensive, as long as one is looking in the right places.

I agree, that anyone can buy first growths. What impresses me about one’s cellar is a diversity of selection that doesn’t adhere to critical ratings, prestige or anything of that like; rather personal stylistic preference and knowledge.

[Bob_Wood]

Leroy Chassagne in the risotto may be the ultimate act of the insufferable wine snot.

[Bob_Kaminski]

@Faryan Amir-Ghassem¡

Cheers to Scott, Jim and Wilfred for opening up some fantastic wines for a neophyte reporter. I don’t know why people are lambasting them. Blind tasting is a great leveler, but honestly, the ratio or frequency of profound to cheap is far less than the ratio of profound to expensive, as long as one is looking in the right places.

I agree, that anyone can buy first growths. What impresses me about one’s cellar is a diversity of selection that doesn’t adhere to critical ratings, prestige or anything of that like; rather personal stylistic preference and knowledge.

No one is lambasting them that I can see - there are no ad hominum attacks. That event described in the article is the antithesis of your final comment. Just saying…

[Andrew_Hall]

@Bob Wood

Leroy Chassagne in the risotto may be the ultimate act of the insufferable wine snot.

There are plenty (actually a huge amount) who would view your putting a 10$ bottle of Soave into your risotto just as equally incomprehensible and insufferable. It is all relative.

A.