Hey Brian - I’ve done about 10 or so dry aged sub-primal over the last year. I think the minimum you would see ‘change’ is 14 days, but that is mostly moisture loss and slight tenderization. Not until around the 4-5 week mark do you start to get the funky aged beef notes. It’s all about the meat you start with, as both fat & bone tend to give more of that funky flavor. I’ve found my sweet spot for NYS is around 43 days, maybe around 50 for Ribeye. It’s all a matter of taste… More info: The Dry Aging Beef thread - Epicurean Exploits - Food and Recipes - WineBerserkers
Yes. 275 bake is fine, pull at 115 and rest. Prior to oven, make sure you paper towel dry and put the beef on a rack in the fridge to help dry out the outside of the beef for at least a few hours (not dry aging per say), but it will help with the crust/browning.
I don’t cook beef inside (team BGE!), but if you have a grill - use it to do the searing - should be more flavor, less smoke in the house, etc…
I still don’t think I have gotten an answer on how long a 17# boneless roast will take at 275 degrees. I don’t want an exact figure, as I’ll pull it when the temperature says to do so, but I still need to have an idea of when to start it.
I’ll take a stab at it since I’ve never done an entire subprimal as a roast in one shot but I would say north of 4-5 hours. Thats a guess though as the temperature you are trying to reach isn’t that high to begin with so it might not even be that long. You’ll have to tell us what it actually is when you get around to doing it.
The challenge here is not just the weight but how thick the roast is. The heat has to penetrate through the meat, so if the roast is more “stocky” it will take longer. Now with a roast that size, once it is up to temperature you could let it rest for an hour plus before carving, freeing up your oven for other uses.
Since I only have one oven (sadly) the long rest will be a necessity. I will need to get potatoes done in that time frame as well as a vegan roast with vegetables for those not eating meat.
We have used an electric warming tray on the counter with roasts after they are done to keep them in a warm environment, on the serving tray or sheet pan, lightly covered with foil.
Or you can do it redneck style, wrap a couple of bricks in foil, put in the oven while you roast the roast, put a folded bath towel in the bottom of a cooler, put the bricks in, but the roasting pan with the roast on the bricks and close the lid. Will keep warm for about 8 hours.
Im not sure if your vegan roast goes in at the same temp as the potatoes, but if the two of them require different temps I would do the potatoes stovetop in a frying pan. I do this often using small new potatoes either quartered or halved. Boil them in well salted water until fork tender then when you drain them let them steam and dry off for a few minutes while you heat up a pan. Add some duck fat or a high smoke point oil (you can do butter near the end to finish them) to the pan and place each potato in on a flat side leaving till browned then flip. You can flip them multiple times till they become very crisp on the outside and will still stay very tender on the inside. I usually season in the pan near the end with salt, pepper, garlic, rosemary and thyme.
On another note what is a vegan roast? Do you have a pic of it? Im kind of curious. Have you ever tried it yourself?
Thanks Elliot, but The vegan roast and vegetables can be done at the same temp as the potatoes. I’ve done it before. I do Jamie Oliver’s potatoes. Boil medium sized Yukon gold potatoes until just soft, then smash them with the bottom of a glass or a meat tenderizer, and then toss in butter and herbs and roast until crispy all over. I debated trying a Hasselbach gratin that I saw but don’t want the extra stress and know these to be both easy and good.
The real question mark at this point is whether I do popovers or outsource by buying butter rolls from a truly excellent local bakery. Popovers or Yorkshire puddings are more traditional (and better if done well) but its just one more thing to juggle.
Someday I will remodel my kitchen and will have two ovens… but for now I should probably except limitations and just buy the rolls.
Definitely buy the rolls. With a roast that large and such a big investment in it I would put my focus on that. Plus it sounds like your bakery is a no brainer.
200 is too low to render the fat and start the Maillard reaction so for a roast like this you’d end up with gelatinous feeling fat which is really unpleasant.
I do it this way, but probably more like 225 and the results have been outstanding. I do the entire process on my BGE. Indirect, between 200-250 until internal is around 110-115, then pull it. I let it rest while I change the set up for my BGE for direct, high heat which probably takes about 15 minutes to come up to temp - probably around 500. The Maillard is no problem at that temp and in fact the opposite is true. I have to be careful the exterior doesn’t burn.
No matter which way you cook it, the internal temp result shouldn’t be different, so I wouldn’t expect any difference in the rendering of the internal fat. Well, with one caveat. If you did it SV at something like 125-130 for an extended period (hours), you would definitely get more rendering. Too much, in fact. I don’t like the texture with the fat fully rendered out after a long SV run as the meat becomes kind of mealy. Probably some breakdown of the muscle fibers contributing there too.
My wife’s Grandmother has a recipe they have used for years. Pretty much the same as Paula Deen’s. It’s worked for many generations. Same directions for any size roast. Almost foolproof
Preheat the oven to 375 degree F. Rub roast with House Seasoning; place roast on a rack in the pan with the rib side down and the fatty side up. Roast for 1 hour. Turn off oven. Leave roast in oven but do not open oven door for 3 hours. About 30 to 40 minutes before serving time, turn oven to 375 degrees F and reheat the roast. Important: Do not remove roast or re-open the oven door from time roast is put in until ready to serve.
Thank you. I’m going to estimate about 4 hours, plus an hour rest and 10 minutes to sear. Approx. 5.5 hrs start to finish will be my plan with the understanding that the roast will make the ultimate decision.
Thanks but I’m committed to the method discussed. I’ve done bone in and boneless several ways but I want to do the reverse sear this time. Everything I read about it says that the reverse sear will give the most uniform pinkness throughout but still a seared “crust.” A more moderate heat like what you are talking about works fine, but it results in a lot more gray, overcooked meat between the outer crust and the pink, rare middle. The longer time at a lower temp also, from what I read, does a better job of liquefying the internal fat. Plus I’d expect that at 375 the outside wouldn’t sear enough for my taste. When I’ve done more moderate temps I always started with searing on a grill or stovetop.
Not sure how you would interprete when I say “then searing at the end” as not equating to starting a Maillard reaction? Maillard is all on the outside of the roast, while the method of cooking the interior has a marked effect on how much “gray meat” you get with the final product.
The prevailing wisdom about the merits of low and slow is that cooking at a temp above the boiling point of water means you lose juices that you wouldn’t lose if cooking below that boiling point. Essentially, do you want the juices in the pan, or in the meat? I’ll always choose the meat.
Of course, it takes longer to cook a roast in this fashion, but nothing outlandish. I budget 5 hours for the low and slow part (assuming a roast of 12+ lbs or more), at least an hour to rest, then 30 minutes of time for preheating oven/searing. If the roast somehow cooks faster during the low and slow part, then it’s just a longer rest period.
Kenji Lopez-Alt of Serious Eats fame did several runs at cooking prime rib, and he agreed that low and slow for the interior with searing at high heat at the end produces the ideal medium rare with minimal gray and the crisp browned exterior: