That is, relative to other yeast strains . . . .
Have not clicked over to the AWRI site, but the article itself warns of many caveats, including the higher than normal levels of ethyl acetate produced in the chardonnay (nail polish remover, my friends . . .), and Linda Bisson’s warming about taking ‘lab level’ research and applying to large scale production.
Still interesting, of course . . .
John,
Thanks - I did see this originally in that thread thanks to Adam Lee, but figured it needed its own thread . . .
Dig the discussion and hope to see more of it!
Cheers!
So… I have been on WB for a week now so I might as well make my first opinionated post
This frustrates me to no end! The trend toward lower alcohol wines is what they represent, higher acid, more nuance. Simply making a wine from very ripe grapes that still has no acid structure wont solve anything. The wine can be 9% and still suck. There are already ways to to de-alc a wine or just water it down.
Things like this distract from the larger discussion about a wine being balanced as a whole. Don’t get me wrong. I find the article and the research fascinating, but I just see it as another tool to make mass market wine chasing a trend rather than pursuing better wine making. I don’t know a single winemaker that would choose a yeast for it’s potential alcohol over it’s ability to add beneficial characteristics to the wine itself.
Birk,
Thanks for the post. And thanks for the comments and the insight. Based on your third sentence, though, seems to imply that you feel lower alcohol wines have ‘more nuance’ than wines not made in that style. If so, that’s cool that that’s what you believe - just want to make sure.
The implications are interesting across many levels as far as I’m concerned. If they can achieve creating or isolating yeasts that can do this without the negative side affects mentioned here, more than just ‘mass market wine’ producers will be using it, no doubt. And as far as ‘beneficial characteristics to the wine itself’, you can read numerous articles that discuss the fact that the yeast used oftentimes has very very little affect on the final product. Yeast serve a very important purpose during the winemaking process, but ‘imparting beneficial characteristics to the wine itself’ is questionable at best (except for many stainless fermented aromatic whites, from what I’ve experienced).
Would love other takes on this topic . . .
Cheers!
Larry, would you guess that using this Aussie yeast would actually result in a different taste or feel to the finished wine, or simply have it be lower in alcohol?
Chris,
Good question - and one that is difficult to answer without clarifying further. As I mentioned above, yeast strain has greatest effects on stainless steel wines that see little time in elevage. Once you throw a wine into oak for an extended period of time, the slight oxidative forces and the natural aging process seem to ‘mitigate’ much of the differences that occur because of yeast strains - at least in my experiences. Others may have had different experiences, of course . . .
The research alludes to the fact that the chard ferments had higher levels of ethyl acetates - not something I want in my wines or in any wines I want to try for that matter.
As far as mouthfeel goes, I again have found differences in mouthfeel in younger whites due to, I think, different yeasts being used (all other things considered equal). Again, the differences get minimized the longer the wine is in oak . . .
To me, yeast have a job to do and you choose the yeast that can handle the job and complete it given the ‘environment’ they will have to survive in - cooler or warmer ferments/ must with low or high nitrogen levels/ low or high brix amounts etc . . .
Cheers!
Larry,
Want to be clear I’m not saying higher alcohol “big” wines can’t be nuanced, nor big producers can’t be great. (In fact large producers that manage to still create compelling wines I find very impressive.)
I also have admit after thinking about it, that if the yeast had no negatives I could see someone including myself being tempted to use it in certain situations. But I don’t think the decision would be based on final percentage vs if we thought the wine would be better. (Subtle difference I know)
The discussion around alcohol I just find frustrating as I think it distracts from a question of is the wine good or not? I remember when I worked in retail years ago customers telling me “you can judge a wine on alcohol. The more alcohol the better.” I find the opposite just as frustrating. Christopher Bates, an MS just released his first Finger Lake Wines under a label called Element and all of them are labeled “11-14%” because he wants the discussion to be about something else. I kind of love it.
As for yeast though, that hasn’t been my experience at all. I find large differences in the wine based on the yeasts we use, particularly in the aromatics. It might be the style, we use neutral oak and lees aging for 6-8 months so not years in oak and little to know oak flavor so not too far from your stainless steel wines. I do also notice a difference in mouth feel as well.
Here is another (Not so positive take on this “product”
from Scientific American via Salon.
http://www.salon.com/2014/02/28/is_wine_the_new_whiskey_partner/
One where some of the wines were tasted. Seems like it was interesting.
Birk,
Thanks for replying and clarifying. With regards to Christopher Bates’ wines - is he really labeling them with that alcohol on it? I know that if you’re under 14%, you can simply state ‘table wine’ but I didn’t think you could put that range on it (unless it is imported, where I see that on wines still).
And I agree that it should be what’s INSIDE the bottle that matters, not what is on the label. As you and I can probably both agree, there are wines at 11.5% alc that are unbalanced and 16+% alc that are balanced . . .
As I stated above, I find differences in aromatics depending upon what yeast is used in very very young whites, especially those that are in stainless steel, but also in very neutral oak. Have not found this to be the case in young reds . . .
Cheers!