Why So Much New World Bashing On The Board Lately?

There are at least 3 current (Scarecrow, HSS & HSS for sale) threads where it seems they have turned into nothing more then posters turning them into bashing of new world wines. I understand an occasional post but it seems like people are just waiting for any opportunity to slam wines that they don’t like. I get it, their not your style but how about some constructive criticism. All I see is syrup, high octane fuel, etc. How about something new? Heard all of these for years. Just because YOU don’t like them doesn’t mean their bad. I think if you spoke with Mike Smith, Thomas Rivers Brown, Russel Bevan, etc. They would politely disagree and could argue far more eloquently then me.

And that’s because those producers are making lots of money off of everyone buying their “syrup, expensive high octane fuel, etc.” LOL

I would surmise that people aren’t bashing per se, they are upset that what was once their favorite wines, or types of wines from a given area, have been changed to appeal to the masses with large wallets.

I know for me there are a number of wines that I don’t buy anymore for this reason. What were once well balanced wines, at decent prices (not cheap, but not outrageously priced), are now super expensive alco-pops as I call them. That doesn’t make them bad, but that doesn’t mean I can’t tell people what I personally think about them as it relates to my likes and dislikes. Matter of fact, is it not better for people to hear the good and the bad so they are better informed? For example, if I’m looking at buying a car I would want to hear the good and the bad. That way I can make a more informed decision on buying it or not.

Do you really think winemakers are making wines they don’t like? Maybe a small (very small) precentage. The winemakers I’ve spoken to believe in what their making and that they are making a good product

If someone doesn’t care for a particular style of wine, what the winemaker says (or thinks) is irrelevant.

If a winemaker is influenced by the tastes of a particular critic, we’d have to assume the winemaker is both conscious of this influence and willing to admit it.

I don’t think these are valid assumptions.

Steve, unless you are extremely friendly with them and they totally trust you, what else do you expect them to tell you. It would be naïve to think anything else so you and I have no idea if it is a small percentage or not that make what sells and not what they want to drink. I would hope that most are trying to make a wine they will also like but I don’t know how you can prove that.

Points=$$$.

Until Parker and his ilk give up the notion that bigger, more tannic, higher alcohol wines are better, very few winemakers are going to revert back to the good old days.

And I can’t believe for a second that any winemaker doesn’t like a 74 Mayacamas or 87 Opus less than the stuff they’re forced to make now.

Yes. In far more instances than any of us think or are led to believe.

Keep in mind many of these winemakers are contractors. They contract out to the highest bidder to make a wine that the highest bidder wants. If the bidder wants a high octane wine that’s what they make. You think they are going to tell you, the consumer, they aren’t fond of their own wine? Wine that is putting food on their table.

The reality is some winemakers make wines they don’t care for because that is what their boss tells them to make. Or they make a wine they don’t care for because their buying public does like it and that is what puts money in their pocket. Money that allows them to also make a wine they do really love.

Is it all winemakers who are like this? Of course not. Are there some, yes.

That’s one reason why so many hired hand wine makers have their own side labels.

Like Satchmo used to say “One for the folks, one for the band…”

Rivers-Marie and Quivet are pretty similar to wines they make for others.

I didn’t say “all”, I said “so many”…

So they do like the wines they make? Other posts seem to imply they only make a style of wine for points

Do you really think winemakers are making wines they don’t like?

Yes. And it’s naive to imagine otherwise.

Wine is expensive to produce. If you have plenty of money and don’t need to sell it, you make what you like and the market be damned. But if you don’t own the place and you’re working for someone, you make what you’re paid to make. Sometimes you like it too. Not always.

Do you think house painters paint walls colors that they don’t like?

Yeap. and when was the last time you heard a wine maker tell you he didn’t like a wine he made? Rarely, you’ll get someone to say a certain vintage isn’t that good. But that’s rare. I know of only one winemaker who is very candid about what he’s made, or his relatives before him, that didn’t turn out that good later. The others rarely come out and say it, if you know them well enough you may get the “it was ok” or “it was a tough vintage” type of comment from them. But to get the real truth of their thoughts is rare.

I also assume that people are not experts in themselves, they see the taste of their favorite wines of a given change from the past region. It’s a shame for good taste. pileon

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A wonderful gift for plombier genève

This battle between Old & New World wines will not change anytime soon. Honestly, I wouldn’t worry about it. For every argument about “flabby this” and “fruit bomb that”, one can easily counter with “acid bomb” and “tannic attack”. In the end it’s all about personal preference. Know what you like and don’t apologize for it.

Hello dear,

Why you told that those people are not expert themselves ?

I think all are also expert in it.

Not sure. I prefer Old World but given we pour (poor, I mean–Freudian slip!) students sometimes even have to drink Franzia or rather Yellow Tail I only bash when I am craving some French wine. I really do get tired of the fruit bomb of New-World stuff though. I have found a great New-World wine with an Old-World spirit:

http://www.ravenswoodwinery.com/#about_us/stories/what_is_no_wimpy_wines

Maybe the Bashers suffer a bit of an inferiority complex and feel better about themselves by bashing others? I generally prefer new world, but feel no compulsion to tell people with differing opinions they are wrong.

There are good and not so good wines on both sides of the fence - I’d rather drink a New world wine then some current vintage 1st growth Bordeaux any day of the week and twice on sundays - I’d rather drink an old Grand Cru than any new world PN

But the “bashing” I think has to do with wanting to join a group or envy that they can’t get it/afford it or they are just parroting what the Somm world has pushed as an ideal.

I deal with it everyday at work, but the joke is that most of the people who walk through the doors of the restaurants (the Public) that i have worked in would prefer, given the choice, to drink a new world big wine over and old world one

Steve, not sure why this is 101. I’ll bite.
I think there will always be those who criticize what they do not know or understand. When combined with a certain lean toward snobbery, it becomes a powder-keg. I have enjoyed wines from both worlds and only have admiration for the true aficionados with wide appreciations. I only know a few people truly like that, Nano Pedraza comes to mind. If you like SQN, so be it. if I get a chance to taste some and not find it to my liking, so be it. It’s when they try and tell us that WE are doing it wrong insinuating that only they are doing it right that makes me angry. What right does anyone have to tell me I am doing it all wrong? I see it mostly with old world guys too. I have ribbed others myself but it’s usually more in good fun, never so vitriolic for sure, some of it even aimed at Paul J who has posted in this thread. Lord knows Keith L and myself have crossed swords many times in the past, but now I think we have a sort of détente, at least since we had that cross-tasting where he seemed to enjoy my recco and I did his.
Anyway, life is short. Enjoy! I know I do.