Lettie Teague's take on alcohol levels in wine

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The article rasises 2 questions:

  1. WWMD? (What would Manlin drink? [tease.gif] )

  2. Does the guy she refers to in the following quote sound familiar to anyone else. I seem to recall his name.

As Dan Posner, owner of the wine store Grapes The Wine Company in White Plains, N.Y., said to me: “Everyone can read the back of a label and get scared by a number. Alcohol is the easiest thing for an amateur to judge.” And who is going to come out in defense of “monstrous fruit bombs” anyway?

Funny.

I sent Lettie a note this am saying that I enjoyed her article and congrats but that I did not agree at all with her premise. I find high alcohol cal pinots less enjoyable to me. In making my own pinot I did my best to keep the alcohol under 14% while trying to not sacrifice ripe fruit flavors. Time will tell if I was successful. 14% isn’t a magic number to me, but is is definitely proximate to where the likely dividing line is for my personal preferences.

Funny she called EZ Ed burly…

i’ll drink an August West pinot any day. and if it’s north of 14% then that’s just fine.

Interesting article. One thing I disagreed with, and that was Lettie’s inference (at least as I read it) that the sommeliers and/or retailers who refused to stock 14+% wines were practicing another form of wine snobbery. I actually like somms or retailers who take a
“stand” on what they like or dislike and can tell you why a wine is on their list or in their store, as to me it demonstrates thought process. I may not agree with their assessments, but I do like the fact that they gave some thought to how a list would be composed.

And one thing I definitely do agree with is that the impact of high alcohol does not affect all grapes equally - to me, it’s clear that zin, syrah and grenache are three varietals that can “handle” elevated levels of alcohol, whereas grapes that I would view as more elegant (and pinot noir immediately comes to mind, as well as chardonnay) are not as capable of delivering finesse and nuance on a 15% alcoholic frame.

“And who is going to come out in defense of “monstrous fruit bombs” anyway?”

Uh, Lettie Teague?

I think it is all based on personal taste. I would prefer alcohol levels to be low, but there are several wines I love at all ABV ranges.
If I had to put a number on the level where alcohol starts to (typically) get in the way of an enjoyable wine, it would be 15% - 15.5% for me, not 14%. But like I said, this generalization will be different for everyone.

The current brouhaha over alcohol levels is boring. Let’s talk about something interesting.

Whenever this issue comes up, that’s always my first reaction. Then for some reason, I chime in with my opinion. I’m of no help.

Bob,
What I applaud about this paragraph is that you obviously understand your own palate. That to me, is the very essence of any discussion where personal taste plays such a large part.

As it so happens, I disagree about syrah (I don’t drink enough zin. and grenache to have an informed opinion), as I believe it can be elegant and nuanced - for example, last night’s 2001 Jamet, Cote-Rotie - it has finally, after years in bottle, become a wine of breed and character, rather than what it was on release - which was disjointed and bruising.
But that is my palate I’m analyzing here and I see plenty of reason for folks to think otherwise.

Best, Jim

The thing is, people who have simplistic rules about not allowing in a wine over 14% alcohol or something similar are very much like the Fox News people. I.e., take a simpleton’s view of the world, project it loudly and painfully, and thereby try to establish your persona.

And I’m underwhelmed by the fact that someone is a sommelier at this or that restaurant. They can be just as dogmatic as anyone else and can have minds that are just as closed. I hate going into a wine store or restaurant and having someone lecture me about this or that opinion they happen to hold, or some issue that they feel passionate about. Cripes.

And to state flatly that a wine over 14% alcohol is unbalanced is just bullshit. Trying to hedge later by stating that it only applies to pinot noir and chardonnay is even worse - it indicates that the person making the comment knows it’s bullshit.

According to Raj, what he said and what was communicated weren’t quite the same… he knows wine, that much is clear… but he would never say that all 14% wines are unbalanced…

(just to clarify, I am only talking about the idea that ALL wines over 14 percent are unbalanced. While I don’t know what he said, I am certain he doesn’t believe that. I am also not suggesting Lettie mis-reported anything, just to be clear)

Gotta love snob sommelliers… Some of the best meals I’ve had at a number of starred Michelin places were consumed with a bottle of KB on the table (back when the only way for me to get KB for a reasonable price was from restaurant lists). In fact, I think I’ll make a reservation at RN74 and bring a bottle of KB just to piss them off. I’ll take a table in the center, display the bottle prominently, and loudly proclaim its virtues over the course of the entire meal.

“That’s one thing that the alcohol-haters leave out: Alcohol delivers flavors. “It’s like the fat in the meat,” as Aldo Sohm, wine director of Le Bernardin in New York, once said to me.”

If a wine has to be 15%+ to taste good, then I’m “anti-flavor”. Just don’t mess with my animal fat intake (or vegetable for that matter).

RT

In general, I agree with you, Rich. That said, I do think it varies by grape - I have had Turley Zins and Petite Sirahs in the past that I felt came across as balanced, although I’ve also had wines by Turley that I felt were way over the top. But I can’t recall a single instance where I’ve ever enjoyed a Pinot Noir that weighed in at 15+% alcohol, and some of these wines (my favorite whipping boy, the Martinelli Blue Slide Ridge, for example) are so overwrought/over-the-top that they come across as grotesque distortions of what the grape is capable of providing. I’ve often said/felt the Martinelli BSR’s would be kick-ass wines to include in a blind California Syrah line-up, which is cool if that’s what maskes you tick, but does call into question why any winemaker would have a desire to make a pinot perform like that?.

Richard,
When I read that comment, my first thought was that I am not fond of the flavor of fat or, more precisely, the way meat tastes when it has more than just a trace of fat.
Without a shred of objective/chamical proof I say, that I believe alcohol can insidiously alter the textures and overall profile of a wine - whether it does so in any particular wine and, more importantly, whether the taster likes that profile, is the rub.
Best, Jim

Then again, I see on Wine Searcher that the Martinelli BSR’s are routinely listed at over $100 a bottle, so I will concede that my opinion is clearly in the minority [pwn.gif] [scratch.gif] .

ACID carries flavor…

Bob, I agree about some varieties being able to handle more “flavor”. Fortunately there are usually “less tasty” options. Martinelli’s BSR comes in to its own served with crushed ice, triple sec, a maraschino cherry, and a small parasol. [wink.gif]

Jim, don’t the insidious alterations occur both before and after the winemaking?

Roberto, cuts fat too.

RT

Scott - somehow I didn’t think he’d have made such an absolutist statement so I’m glad to hear it wasn’t translated perfectly.

Regarding the delivery of flavor - I think alcohol bonds to both water and to fats, so it can kind of link various things that wouldn’t otherwise be riding together. Personally, I don’t like the taste, or maybe it’s the sensation, of alcohol, so I don’t drink Scotch, vodka, or anything stronger than wine, but although it’s a cliche, a wine can be balanced at 9, 12, 15 percent alcohol, depending on the wine. As long as I’m not tasting alcohol, I’m OK with the wine.

A statement that a particular measurement alone is sufficient to make a determination as to the quality of the wine just seems silly. It’s like buying on points, simply assuming that someone’s 94 point score merits a purchase, but their 89 merits a pass, when you haven’t tasted the wine yourself. Your own score may have been the reverse.

Don’t understand this statement at all, Roberto. Could you elaborate?
Tom