08 red Burgundy: Are you still bullish?

Recent run-ins with some less than thrilling bottles of 2008 red Burgundy have me thinking (worrying?) about all my resting bottles from the vintage.

I don’t really load up on vintages, but I did buy a significant amount of 2008s. In the run of vintages in the late aughts, they hit the right intersection of my taste preferences and relative value. In a reductive nutshell, 06 seemed screechy, 07 fun but light, 09 too blowsy. The 2008s had structure and stuffing. Early bottles had a freshness, lift and effervescence given the acid streak that marked most wines in the vintage. Retailers and critics played to my vanity, with description of the wines being for classicists, connoisseurs. etc.

I have started dipping my toes in the 08 waters, opening some 1er crus from Bertheau, Drouhin and Chevillon. A bit lean and ungiving. Yes, I know very small sample. Yes, individual producers and vineyards. Yes, individual bottles … Not sure if these are just in shutdown mode or a hint of things to come. I hope and trust it’s the former. But I have to admit I’m worrying about seeing the ghost of 1996 (fruit – come out, come out wherever you are! ollie-ollie oxen free!)

So my question is: are the early 08 lovers/Acid Freaks still bullish on the vintage? If so, send me some reassuring words. And when would you think about sampling Grand Crus?

My answer. Yes.

I am actually finding quite the opposite. The few 2008s I have had recently have been much more mature than I would have thought. 2008 Charmes Chambertins with friends on a Saturday night - WINE TALK - WineBerserkers

I never thought 2008 was going to be a great vintage or a terrible vintage. My guess is that it will be a very good vintage, possibly the weakest of the very strong stretch of 2005-2010, but better by a lot than 2003, 2004 and 2011. I don’t see it as anything like the 1996s, which have a lot more to them and which I happen to like a lot.

you think 08 is weaker than 06/07? I feel like i’ve had a lot of worse bottles from 06/07 than 08. Especially at the lower end.

I probably have had a lot more wines from 2006 and 2007 in the last couple of years than 2008s. Until recently, most of my experience with 2008s were when they were very young. I am just starting to open 2008s and have been surprised by what I have found - very nice wines, but more mature than I would have thought.

As for comparisons, I like 2006 a lot more than many people do. I think it is a very well balanced vintage and I have had very good ones. So, I think it is above the other two by a little bit. 2007s I have been enjoying in their youth a lot - easy to drink. I guess between 2007 and 2008, time will tell.

I guess I feel on balance that these vintages are close to each other in quality and I am not as sure about 2008 (a lot because I have not been opening many) so at this time I would rate it lower. Ask me in five years and I might have a very different order.

IMO, it makes very little sense to worry about the 08s at this stage. Most of the 08 1er crus will take 10 to 20 years t reach the peak if you prefer the tertiary expression of sous bois and decadent yet delicate fruit.

For me 01 and 07 are similar, very much nose driven, sweet fruits and semi pure but lacking concentration and middle palate.
02 Concentrated fruit, strong presence of acidity and tannins. Will need a lot of time, somewhat similar to the 96?
03 Roasted fruit, easy to identify.
04 if you are sensitive to LBT, avoid. Similar to the 11, lacking concentration and often with a hint of green on top of LBT.
05 As good as Burgundy gets, pure, concentrated and structured.
06 Ripe but a lot of wines have a hint of bitterness.
07 nice nose, already really enjoyable showing a bit of tertiary notes. No need to wait.
08 really red fruit driven, very pretty and pure, somewhat lean and no opulent fruit.
09 ripe and concentrated, a lot of black fruits. Settled down nicely and will age beautifully.
10 Excellent concentration, great structure, more red fruit than the 09.
11 some with possible LBT but not as noticeable as in the 04s. Lacking energy.
12 big concentrated wine, even bigger than the 10.

05 As good as Burgundy gets, pure, concentrated and structured.
06 Ripe but a lot of wines have a hint of bitterness.
07 nice nose, already really enjoyable showing a bit of tertiary notes. No need to wait.
08 really red fruit driven, very pretty and pure, somewhat lean and no opulent fruit.
09 ripe and concentrated, a lot of black fruits. Settled down nicely and will age beautifully.
10 Excellent concentration, great structure, more red fruit than the 09.

Agree total…

I haven’t opened any for a while as they seemed to be shutting down. Personally I wouldn’t judge Burgundy based on how the wines are showing 8 years from vintage.

I’m still bullish.

Why not be. Most vintages have good wines if you buy from good producers. It is not like the old days. From the last 15 year or so, 1999, 2005 and 2010 are IMHO great vintages. 2003, 2004, and maybe 2011 are questionable vintages, esp. 2004. The rest have an awful lot of good wine made when you stick to good producers.

And, for their times, 2001, 2007 and 2008 had the advantage of being really well priced. For $x, you probably could have done better in those vintages than in say 2002 and 2009.

I liked the 2008s a lot and was going to have that be my farewell vintage for laying down Burgundy but was ordered to do otherwise.

Matthew–I wouldn’t worry much. AS has already been pointed out, this is the absolute worst time (6-8 or 9 years)to judge a red Burg vintage, but is commonly when people begin to question, as they can’t keep their hands off, and then find an uninspiring wine when they pop one. If you tried the wines upon release, I would stick with your assessment from that time. If not, then, well, just be patient.

It’s appropriate to make judgements on vintages from the 90’s at this stage, and some from the 2000’s (2000, 2001, maybe 2004. I think the jury is still out on 2002 so far.) Otherwise, I’m holding off judging (although clearly 2005 and 2010 are great vintages) For 2008 I think it will be better than 06, 07, and 11 when all of the dust settles.

Absolutely, yes.

I strongly agree with every word of this except I would add the word “correct” to 2008, damning with faint praise, “indistinct” to 2006, and “wild” to the exciting 2012s I’ve had so far

Also wouldn’t it be nice if 03 and to a lesser extent 04 came around. Some 03’s that were delicious red fruit on release, sometimes marred by alcohol, sometimes just delicious,and lovely to smell, showed dark coffee and chocolate and roasted and not much red later.

There are some '03s that are already very good. Jadot did very well in 2003.

Thank you John. Sage advice. I guess I’m nervous parent fretting over how my kids will turn out when they are – as you rightly point out – smack in their most gawky and awkward phase of adolescence. Time to chill.

1st: I liked and like the vintage, but I was never raving about it (like some others here … wasn´t JG among them?) … so I never called it a great vintage, rather classic, very good to excellent, but a bit high in acidity and lacking real sweetness of tannins.

2nd: However - much too early for me to get real drinking pleasure out of the better wines … I let them sleeping …
I´d rather open a 06, 07, better a 01, 03, 00 or older instead.

And when would you think about sampling Grand Crus?

If you have “cases” of each wine you can easily “sample” bottles of GCs … sure depending on the wine style, but more often than not with similar results as above.

Otherwise I would say: better 1er Crus after 2020/22, better GCs after 2025 … or better later still …

I agree only partially - sorry, no time to go into details now,
but 01 and 07 are VERY DIFFERENT, both in weight and in structure … I would never compare the two …

Generally I’ve enjoyed the 08’s drunk so far, although overall it’s hard to tell this early. It’s likely my age (60), but I’ve been drinking and loving the 07’s, and have been selling a portion of my 08’s.

Hmmm…mature? At this juncture? Any one I’ve recently opened (village and PC, mostly) have been cranberries soaked in battery acid and not yielding much beyond that. I’d like to write the vintage off as one that simply sucks at being charming, but i have too many of them to not care. Here’s to hoping they blossom into something…better!?