What next: "the PG Cellars Berserkers' Cuvee Effect"

It’s been really interesting and fun to see the response to the Patricia Green Cellars’ offer over in Commerce Corner (see 2013 Patricia Green Cellars sub $20 Pinot for Berserkers - Commerce Corner - Wine Classifieds - WineBerserkers if you missed this).

A wonderful wine producer tests the waters to see if a special offer could create a win for them (make a little extra $$ and move some wine they weren’t sure what to do with) and a win for the community (easy access to a lovely wine at a dynamite price). Brilliant to use frequent posters here to sample the wine to create trust in the community that a good deal was really in the offing. And hundreds of cases move quickly. I bought one.

Moments like this beautifully reinforce the potentially happy relationship between the producers and the wine lovers in a community like WB. Real community.

If I were a wine producer (and I’m not – pure consumption is my role) I would have read these threads with extreme interest and envy. WB has the potential to be a powerful marketing and distribution tool. When used in positive community-oriented ways it can be fantastic. I for one find the participation of producers here to be incredibly insightful. But this trust and community spirit can definitely be abused.

I’m curious what people think about this – what are the best/worst practices to keep our community healthy and positive, and keep those who would abuse us out? Does PGC’ offer represent a new kind of dynamic, or was it just another sale in CC?

I think Tex can keep the riff raff in line.
I really appreciate those producers that contribute to the discussion and make a point to by their wines.

Brilliant to use frequent posters here to sample the wine to create trust in the community that a good deal was really in the offing.

I think it’s a really good idea. The only thing I wonder about is the above. Frequent TNs don’t mean anything other than the fact that someone writes a lot of TNs. And many of those people neither write nor taste particularly well.

I’d buy a wine based on my knowledge of the producer. For example, at this point, I’d probably try anything that Bryan Harrington makes - he’s one of my new discoveries. And Paul Gordon from Halcon. I’m sure other people have similar faves. And since Pat Green wines are generally stellar, that would suffice.

In any event, I think it’s an interesting and potentially very good idea. Kudos to Jim for trying it out and good luck!

This was just an honest version of what a bunch of producers (cough Rhys cough) have been doing for years.

I think the word “honest” is somewhat inflammatory. Substitute in the word “explicit”, however, and I’d tend to agree with you.

Fair enough. I was just responding to the implication in the OP that the PG sale might have crossed some imaginary line. I think it’s much better for the board when producers are open about using social media (including this board) to create and build a market for their bottles.

It’s not just about using social media - think the op (no relation, unless maybe you go back a couple of hundred years) is referring to the potential for going direct to consumer with a win-win scenario. Winemakers receive more for their product than they would otherwise, either directly or considering fully-loaded costs of sales and marketing; Berserkers get a great deal on a quality bottle of wine.

What made this work in particular was that nobody in the PG distribution chain was going to be upset by this, i.e., it didn’t fit with their normal paradigm, and wasn’t already being distributed by anybody.

I’m all for it - helps everyone involved.

OP here. I made absolutely zero implication about PG doing anything inappropriate, or crossing any lines, imaginary or otherwise. The whole process was extremely open, honest, clear, direct and even-handed. Very very positive. I bought a case and am happy to have done so.

The point of my post was just that this sale was something I hadn’t seen before on WB, and was curious what folks thought about it, or other potential kinds of transactions.

Well said. I tend to prefer producers over TN’s from random individuals. Granted, they can serve a purpose after a fashion and possibly point you in the correct general direction of a wine, but should be viewed with a healthy dollop of salt (barring the possibly of you knowing the taster and having a good understanding of their strengths, weakness and general preferred flavor profile).

I’m gonna have to second your thoughts on Bryan Harrington, his Beserker four pack has resulted in two more cases coming my way tomorrow. Are his wines that good? Most certainly to me they are, and he’s a nice guy as well. I know some people don’t care about that and just want good wine, but I’ve got a finite amount of wine dollars to spend and I’d rather they go to support someone I like.

Regarding the idea of the OP, I can see how producer involvement here can be a good thing; bringing together like minded consumers/producers for projects that might never see the light of day otherwise. Of course there exists the possibly of some people trying to take advantage of the situation, but even though I’m relatively new to this community I don’t doubt that the members here will suss it out pretty quickly.

Hmm… not sure about the “quickly” part.

The PG offer is different than some other wineries who have used the board as part of their direct-to-consumer model in that the deal was apparently a very good one (disclaimer: I have nto tasted the wine). In essence, PG shared the “profits” of cutting out the distributor with the board members and so a presumably $40 bottle of wine was available to the board for $19. This is quite different than some other wineries where a bottle is $60 whether you buy it at retail or direct from the winery.

[Puts on best Clinton impersonation]
It depends on what the meaning of the word “quickly” is…

I see your point on how the PG offer differs from other direct to customer models. Maybe it’s a new paradigm like the 2010 Baro…ok I’m just gonna shut-up now.

I’m just thinking that Jim could have sold the wine to a negociant like Garagiste for some mystery wine (dos Iramos anyone) with a lot of hints, etc. Then we would pay like $30 not knowing what we got until it arrived. In the valley there are several that bottle excess under their own labels, A to Z is a big player and their wines are as good as the real thing.

Huh? My in laws buy A to Z wines from Costco all the time and I haven’t found them to taste much like the small producers we seem to enjoy on a regular basis

I should qualify that by saying Pinot Gris that my wife buys.

What Jim (and Patty) did was really the definition of a berserker, giving back and supporting a community.
They easily could have done a one off offer to any one of the on line retailers there is or offered it to a large shop as a special ‘private label’ but they chose to come to us and offer their wine at a pretty big discount with more hassle than they would have if they just had a one deal drop.

Don’t forget that not only is the wine discounted, the shipping is too. And… how much of a pain in the ass is it to package up 500 to 600 cases of wine when they could have just palletized it and shipped it off in one shot.

Awesome folks, awesome winery, I doubt anyone else does anything like this.

This

The question to me is if and to what extent other Board favorite producers could do this without upsetting the distribution chain or cutting into their overall brand pricing. What conditions would be necessary for that to be possible?

I agree that this was a fascinating exercise, and I was happy to buy a case (though I haven’t received and tasted it yet). I’m curious to know if and to what extent this is likely to happen in the future through WB. I guess BerserkerDay is already partially this same phenomenon, right?

I would love to say that PGC is some anti-3 tier hero and that everyone who got in on this is playing some role in sticking it to the man. I wish that this was repeatable at some scale say 10x this size. My life would certainly be easier.

Unfortunately that’s not really so. This is a happy confluence of a new active wine buying community, a winery with enough size and reputation to be known and an unlabeled wine with no particular home due to a series of (hopefully) not especially reproducible events. None of our distributors are out of the loop on a wine that may or may not happen again so any sort relationships we have established across the country are unaffected.

Perhaps There is some way for this to come up again with other wineries. I do think it would take a special set of circumstances though which is what we sort of stumbled into.

I think labels are scheduled to be printed on the 14th so some folks may be able to get wine within the next 3 weeks. I hope that doesn’t sound too, you know, MI-esque.

Just want to thank Rich Frankel for starting this thread - I was only vaguely aware of this whole idea, but saw the link in Rich’s post and decided to check it out - ordered my case yesterday .

Jim, thanks for shedding some light on this situation. Not being ITB myself, I didn’t really think about all the channel conflict issues (since I barely understand how wine distribution really works). So I’m thinking about what this channel (i.e. enthusiastic WB members) is really good for.

Most wineries have an inherent conflict with their channels when they distribute through their lists. My guess is that there is a pretty small number of producers that can effectively sell out this way – either teensy ones (Sandlands comes to mind) or super beloved wineries (many good California examples).

I wonder what a really excellent producer like PGC with a good track record and loyal customers can really do with their list members. Is this good for 5% of sales? 25%? I assume that a solid distributor can do something that the list can never do – write a big check and move a large amount of product all at once.

But back to the initial subject I raised – how could producers really use the WB channel for special distributions. Berserkers’ Cuvee 2013 was a relatively low priced product. Could this work at the other end of the spectrum, say for a $100 or $150 wine? A special “Berserkers’ Reserve” could be imagined. What would be the circumstances in which a well-loved producer with a good track record can’t get a super premium wine distributed any other way? Guys like Mike Smith, Aaron Pott, TRB might be able to do that here.

Food for thought …