I've Never Had A Sine Qua Non Wine.......

And probably never will. I find it remarkable the way that these wines are coveted and wonder how they differ stylisticly from Aussie wines made from the same varieties that are available at a fraction of the cost. Are SQN wines that would make Sparky Marquis proud?

no. They are big wines but they are well done wines. The grenaches in particularly are very well made.

Other countries other than Australia also make Grenache and Syrahs

While they are both big, ripe, high alcohol wines, there are clear differences between SQNs and, say, Mollydookers. I find the SQNs much better balanced. Maybe an AFWE palate would perceive them both to be so over-the-top as to be indistinguishable. We’ve gotta get you to try one. NOLA’s not on my meeting rotation for a couple of years, but if you find yourself in the DC/Baltimore area, we’ll have to set something up.

Who’s doing a tartare in NOLA these days? I can bring a bottle this winter.

David if I ever make it all the way over there, I wil be knocking on your door also …for my first taste of an SQN

SQN is on my list for when I feel like splurging. I know it’s pretty regularly available at a local shop for very close to release price. Just hope it’s not wasted money.

It’s really no big deal. I was on the waiting list for about 6 years. Then I got offers. I drink them with my kids at home. The Moment, a white blend, was my son’s all time favorite wine. He’s 27. It was really good, well made and very balanced. I opened one of the Grenaches with the same son when he was going back to school. Also outstanding, but I think I should keep my hands off for a few years.

They aren’t what I want and I dropped the list long ago, but in the big super-ripe style they were the best Rhone varietal wines I’ve had. I have not had any wines in that style from Australia or CNdP that I could enjoy, but I did like the red SQNs I drank.

Wait youre in nola? Ill be there this coming weekend. Ill bring one. I know it sounds like a joke but its not. If youll be around pm me.

I’m not sure Sparky would be proud, or even appreciate Manfred’s work but I get your inference. What differentiates SQN from potent Aussies, and clever Paso Rhone clones is fit and finish, IMHO. Those that covet these wines either treasure collectibles/trophies, or appreciate the details that make these wines truly a singular experience.

‘Getting’ SQN is probably best explained by someone who has graduated from California wines to Burgundy and/or Barolo, I suspect, but can’t say because I haven’t graduated yet…

Yeah, I find them indistinguishable.

But it’s hardly an AFWE thing. Parker loves them both and scores them both in the same high territory.

So therefore they are indistinguishable from Bordeaux? Nothern Rhones? Parker scores them highly too. That’s an odd argument. But I think that regardless of your preferences and of whether you enjoy them if you can’t tell Sqn from mollydooker your palate is not very discerning, they are very different wines. But what the hell do I know, I like everything from Rhys to KB and even the occasional Burg and mollydooker.

Interesting comment… Not exactly sure what you mean… But, if someone would ask me what my favorite region is, I would be quick to say Burgundy but at the same time my favorite producer (as well as the most represented producer in my cellar) by far is SQN - no question or hesitation at all. Strange combination most might think. Not sure how to explain it either. For me, SQN wines provide a consistency of enjoyment and satisfaction that in my opinion is seldom found in the world of wine - they are impactful and unique in a way that cannot help but bring a smile to my face every time - it is rare to find wines like the SQNs which are powerful, rich and deep yet balanced and graceful. Exactly what you said - it is the fit and finish and details which make them such a singular experience.

Not the same as Mollydooker but Sparky made some better wines IMO. The SQNs that I’ve had are juicy and fruity, without overt alcohol but mostly ripe fruit. Why you would age them I have no idea. The best that I’d imagine would be that they’d hold the fruit. Developing extra complexity? From what and to what?

But I have not had them with many years of age so can’t say.

Sparky’s Mollydooker wines are borderline undrinkable these days. The oak and alcohol seem to dominate. Ditto a lot of the 2007 CdPs. The enjoyment of the SQNs, the CdPs, and many Australian wines is the big fresh fruit. If that’s amped up to Pam Anderson proportions, it becomes grotesque rather than enjoyable. SQN doesn’t quite get there, but it’s close. Mollydooker does and most of the 2007 CdPs did.

Credit to Manfred for getting the prices he does. IMHO, his wines are completely overpriced. There are FAR better wines from CA using “Rhone” grapes, and better wines from Australia than Mollydooker. I think the reason SQN is so coveted is the points. Of course, nobody here cares about points, but if those wines had been scored in the 80s, I wonder how many people would be on the list.

I don’t find them indistinguishable. I actually find SQN rather unique. They do not resemble any Oz SHIRAZ! wine I have ever tasted, and I have plowed through a lot of them as a generalist retailer. There are a few West Coast Syrahs that share some notes with SQN, but none have the mix of concentration and complexity that SQN gets while not coming across as overtly sweet or ponderous at the same time.

Speaking for myself (and as someone who made the list happily), they may not be my weeknight wines, but I like them young for a special occasion.

I think SQN has become easy to dismiss because the wines are critic’s darlings.

Ive tried the Pinots back when he used to make them. I thought they were very good but short of great. Id be curious to try the rhone varietal wines.

any thoughts on the 09 Grenach Upside Down ? CT notes look promising to open this fall. It is my lone botte of SQN via a trade.

Somewhere I have a photo of Keith drinking his first SQN at Pratt’s. To his credit, he has consistently disliked them. I seem to recall having to jump out of the way to avoid the rejected SQN out on the veranda outside the restaurant. It’s OK. More for me.

OK, Michael, no more whining. You’ve had several offers to pop your SQN cherry.

My comment was not meant as a criticism of all Aussie Shiraz. I picked Mollydooker as an obvious over-the-top example to make the point that SQN wines are different. They are different from restrained Aussie Shiraz as well, but I don’t think that was Michael’s question.

Nor was my AFWE palate comment meant as a criticism. To someone that really dislikes this style, I can see where they may be indistinguishable. For a purple-drank-only aficionado, maybe Burgundy and Barolo are indistinguishable.

For those of us with wider-ranging preferences, the SQNs are clearly distinguishable. I’ve had a few other Cali Syrahs that play in the same league at lower cost, but I’ve never done head to head comparisons and I’m not on their lists.

I had the 2005 Atlantis Grenache…and I think of myself as having an AFWE-based palate. I think that SQN wines are the apex of a style that is clearly California. Big, bold, at times unctuous on the palate…but still clearly holding a balance. While there are Old World wines that are more in my wheel-house, I can still enjoy & appreciate this style (a few times a year). I’ve never had one of his Syrahs…but Humberto & I have a trade set up to fix that in a few weeks (thank you).