Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #1  Postby MitchTallan » May 19th 2017, 7:52am

I got an email offer for 2014 Peter Michael Les Pavots at just under $200. I remember when it sat on retailer's shelves at $35.
Dalle Valle went from $25 to $150 for the regular, Maya from $45 to $400.
Chave-well-let's not talk about Chave.
These are the three that come to mind first for me.
There was the crazy Cinq Cepages phenomenon but I don't count it.

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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #2  Postby T. Altmayer » May 19th 2017, 7:55am

Angelus took a big jump after its upgrade in status.
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Post #3  Postby Drew Goin » May 19th 2017, 8:00am

Anything between 1990 and 2005.
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Post #4  Postby Markus S » May 19th 2017, 8:30am

You want a list? Let me find that Excel file... [swearing.gif]
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #5  Postby etomasi » May 19th 2017, 8:37am

Jura in general, but Ganevat in particular (P. Overnoy too, but i can't even find a bottle).

Etna - basically all of it.
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #6  Postby Joe B » May 19th 2017, 8:57am

It is all being priced for the rich and famous now. You need to make $250,000 per year and be a dink/sink to have a respectable cellar.
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Post #7  Postby PeterJ » May 19th 2017, 9:07am

I'd bet the overall winner might be Screagle, especially if you use the street price. I'm pretty sure the winery price was <$100 pre-2000.
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #8  Postby Robert Alfert, Jr. » May 19th 2017, 9:43am

Rougeard
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #9  Postby Bob G » May 19th 2017, 9:57am

A similar analysis was done six years ago for an article in Fortune by Gregory Dal Piaz:

http://fortune.com/2011/12/09/how-wine-prices-have-changed-over-25-years/

At the high end, wines have become luxury goods and are priced accordingly. You pay for the brand name if you want it (and many do or the price increases would not be sustainable). There is still lots of good wine available at prices lower than the inflation equivalent price over almost any period as new sources have been developed and the supply of wine has expanded.
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Post #10  Postby Jay Miller » May 19th 2017, 10:00am

Egon Muller, almost all Grand Cru Burgundy
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Post #11  Postby Steve Crawford » May 19th 2017, 10:01am

lail j.daniel did a very large and swift jump after their 100 pt score.
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #12  Postby Ian Sutton » May 19th 2017, 10:04am

In full agreement with other posters - the growth in the numbers of worldwide 'super-rich' allied to wineries happy to court them, means a lot of wines now no longer represent any sense of value, for that is not the reason for buying them.

No tears though, for all the DRCs of the world, there are plenty of very fine wines offering decent to good value, and label worship is the perfect route to paying over the odds.
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #13  Postby Ryan Caughey » May 19th 2017, 10:07am

More than I can list--especially in Burgundy. Obvious ones that come to mind that have really jumped in just the past few years:

Verset
Allemand
Raveneau
Arnaud Ente
Giacomo Conterno
Fourrier
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Post #14  Postby Jay Miller » May 19th 2017, 10:07am

Mayacamas
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Post #15  Postby CJ Beazley » May 19th 2017, 10:28am

Larkmead
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Post #16  Postby Bruce Leiser_owitz » May 19th 2017, 10:31am

Is the question greatest % increase or greatest $$ increase?

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Post #17  Postby NED VALOIS » May 19th 2017, 10:33am

Bryant is certainly up there !
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #18  Postby Prashant Jyothi » May 19th 2017, 10:34am

Not to go OT but where would you say the value is today? What's drinking great yet doesn't necessarily have the brand cachet...yet?
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Post #19  Postby MitchTallan » May 19th 2017, 10:42am

Mayacamas


For those of us from Columbus OH Mayacamas and the problems behind the curtain are of particular interest since Jay Schottenstein is involved. The wealthy side of the Schottenstein family are said to be so wealthy that no one really knows how wealthy they are. Our newly built The Ohio State University basketball arena is called, "The Schottenstein Arena" though it is known as "The Schott".

Another ridiculous "jumper"-Carruades de Lafite-geeez. I bought a case of double ought for $30/bottle IIRC.
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #20  Postby Ian Sutton » May 19th 2017, 11:25am

Prashant Jyothi wrote:Not to go OT but where would you say the value is today? What's drinking great yet doesn't necessarily have the brand cachet...yet?

Logically the reverse, so whilst the famous & prestigious names in the famous & prestigious appellations are the most likely to have little value, lesser known producers or lesser known appellations are more likely to offer value. They require a little more effort to find, but then if we're enthusiasts, we probably don't mind that effort.

In addition however there is also value to be had away from the wines lauded by critics or otherwise 'trendy and sought after'. Finding a region whose wines appeal to your palate is a great way to find value, but having leading critics ignore it or berate it is a very positive scenario for the wine remaining affordable and good value.
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #21  Postby Prashant Jyothi » May 19th 2017, 12:47pm

Ian Sutton wrote:
Prashant Jyothi wrote:Not to go OT but where would you say the value is today? What's drinking great yet doesn't necessarily have the brand cachet...yet?

Logically the reverse, so whilst the famous & prestigious names in the famous & prestigious appellations are the most likely to have little value, lesser known producers or lesser known appellations are more likely to offer value. They require a little more effort to find, but then if we're enthusiasts, we probably don't mind that effort.

In addition however there is also value to be had away from the wines lauded by critics or otherwise 'trendy and sought after'. Finding a region whose wines appeal to your palate is a great way to find value, but having leading critics ignore it or berate it is a very positive scenario for the wine remaining affordable and good value.


Any examples you've come across lately?
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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #22  Postby Ian Sutton » May 19th 2017, 1:07pm

I'm presuming of the latter (no-one really wants to know about over-priced wine [basic-smile.gif] )

Yes, but such wines may not be available where you are and more importantly may not be to your taste. FWIW tonight's wine probably did fit into the undervalued 2005 LdH Gravonia Blanco because slightly oxidative whites weren't popular. It's complex for sure, but many would be uncomfortable with the subtle oxidation. Give it 5 years and I fear the current love for LdH could see it crossing into the overpriced catagory (though the reds will probably get there first). Ch Lamartine Cahors (basic bottling) has the advantage of being seen as a lesser appellation, and Ch Lamartine aren't a lauded producer, and the wine isn't their fancier cuvee particuliere or cuvee expressione. A wine utterly untroubled by wine investment schemes, yet ~ £10 of good cellar potential. Also £10 a nebbiolo d'Alba from a small producer, brought into the UK direct by a local internet only merchant, that gives me much of the enjoyment of a Barbaresco but in a more immediate form (Cascina Saria FWIW). Ch Musar also remains very competitively priced in the UK market, but less so in the US (but still value IMO for a complex cellaring wine)

Just a few examples, but there should be plenty of other suggestions from everyone here. The recommendation is thus to keep an open mind, and try the wines from the smaller producers as well as the establishment. On trips to Italy, it's amazing how often a little under the radar producer ends up being more appealing to us than the established 'name' in the region (an example I've mentioned before is Daviddi vs. Poliziano who are near neighbours in the Stazione Montepulciano area, Daviddi pretty much off the radar of wine writers/critics)
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Post #23  Postby dbailey » May 19th 2017, 1:42pm

Engel and Truchot.
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Post #24  Postby Howard Cooper » May 19th 2017, 2:44pm

Truchot (although different because he is no longer selling wine)
Musigny from producers like Drouhin and Mugnier
Mugneret-Gibourg [I think most of this is middle man profit, not the Mugnerets]
Classified Bordeaux (I paid $60 for 1990 Latour and Cheval Blanc, $28 for 1990 LLC and $20 for 1990 Leoville Barton)
Clos des Lambrays (the 2001 and 2002 were $59)
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Post #25  Postby Thomas Keim » May 19th 2017, 2:46pm

Penfolds Grange Hermitage -
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Post #26  Postby Howard Cooper » May 19th 2017, 2:55pm

Prashant Jyothi wrote:Not to go OT but where would you say the value is today? What's drinking great yet doesn't necessarily have the brand cachet...yet?


viewtopic.php?f=1&t=119762

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=140458

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=114693

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=136487&p=2188548&hilit=cru+bourgeois#p2188548

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=113641&p=1722358&hilit=prum+chinon#p1722358

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Which wines would you say jumped ridiculously price-wise

Post #27  Postby Kirk.Grant » May 19th 2017, 2:58pm

Jay Miller wrote:Mayacamas



What?!?! Not even in the same league as the others listed so far
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Post #28  Postby Eric Ifune » May 21st 2017, 8:29am

Early 19th century Madeira, especially the well known wines. They have literally trebled and quadrupled in price over the past 4-5 years.
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Post #29  Postby Mark Golodetz » May 21st 2017, 8:39am

What worries me more are not the small producers, that a few incremental buyers can triple the wines overnight.
That would include many of the producers mentioned here. But more worrying, particularly in Burgundy are the reliable larger producers and negotiants who are now priced at the nearly same levels. Drouhin of course, but Jadot too is coming in strong. You can actually see the discrepancies between the prices of the new vintages, and the amount that good vintages are fetching in the secondary market.
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Post #30  Postby Peter Panzica » May 21st 2017, 8:40am

CJ Beazley wrote:Larkmead


Yes Perfect strategy to have a long time list member to leave their list.
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Post #31  Postby alan weinberg » May 21st 2017, 8:44am

DRC
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Post #32  Postby Nathan Smyth » May 21st 2017, 9:49am

Prashant Jyothi wrote:Not to go OT but where would you say the value is today? What's drinking great yet doesn't necessarily have the brand cachet...yet?

Zardetto Prosecco & Saracco Moscato d'Asti.

Two thirds of a world class meal for $30 total.

Then find a great Barbera or Dolcetto [or Chianti] for another $30, and for $60 total, you'll be drinking like a king.

Or at least as a peasant with a big imagination.
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Post #33  Postby lleichtman » May 21st 2017, 11:46am

Not sure what the year was but St Jean Cab Sauv was named the wine of the year by Wine Spectator and jumped 300% in a day.
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Post #34  Postby MitchTallan » May 21st 2017, 11:54am

lleichtman wrote:Not sure what the year was but St Jean Cab Sauv was named the wine of the year by Wine Spectator and jumped 300% in a day.


That would be the Cinq Cepages I mentioned in the OP. I believe it was the '96 in the '99 Spectator. I recall it stayed that way for close to 5 years before the jig was up.
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Post #35  Postby alan weinberg » May 21st 2017, 12:00pm

1990 DRC La Tâche $233/b in 1993, more than ten times that now for current releases. And even more percentage increase for RC.
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Post #36  Postby Ian Sutton » May 21st 2017, 12:24pm

One that grates a little is the old Vallana spanna wines from 50s & 60s. Having picked a few up for reasonable prices a decade or so ago, there seem so few around that the rare wine specialists have swooped and all now over £100 a bottle and good as they are, it's just not worth the risk on an old wine where the chances of hitting a dud are too high for such silly money.
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Post #37  Postby Chris Seiber » Yesterday, 12:56pm

Some of the old school or AFWE wines have really shot up in price, like G Mascarello, Juge, Gonon and Jamet, once they became darlings of the WB / New York somm set.
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Post #38  Postby Howard Cooper » Yesterday, 1:09pm

Mark Golodetz wrote:What worries me more are not the small producers, that a few incremental buyers can triple the wines overnight.
That would include many of the producers mentioned here. But more worrying, particularly in Burgundy are the reliable larger producers and negotiants who are now priced at the nearly same levels. Drouhin of course, but Jadot too is coming in strong. You can actually see the discrepancies between the prices of the new vintages, and the amount that good vintages are fetching in the secondary market.


Mark,

You are correct about Jadot. I used to buy a good bit of Jadot as they represented great value. But the wines have gotten much more expensive as of late.
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Post #39  Postby michael ottesen » Yesterday, 1:29pm

Giuseppe Rinaldi
Soldera
Cerbaiona
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Post #40  Postby Marvl » Yesterday, 2:52pm

Harlan/Bond
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Post #41  Postby David B. » Yesterday, 4:42pm

Carruades de Lafite

Bought the 2000 as futures for $30 or even less I think. 6 times that for the current release
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